From fredericosg@gmail.com Sat Mar 01 00:17:20 2008 Return-Path: X-Sender: fredericosg@gmail.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 25748 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 08:17:12 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.96) by m56.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 08:17:12 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO n49a.bullet.mail.sp1.yahoo.com) (66.163.168.143) by mta17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 08:17:12 -0000 X-Received: from [216.252.122.219] by n49.bullet.mail.sp1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 08:17:12 -0000 X-Received: from [209.73.164.86] by t4.bullet.sp1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 08:17:12 -0000 X-Received: from [66.218.67.195] by t8.bullet.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 08:17:12 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 08:17:10 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-Originating-IP: 66.163.168.143 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:6:0:0:0 X-Yahoo-Post-IP: 201.17.35.167 From: "fsgonzales1" Subject: Re: Theos-World Influence of Mahatmas on people of this world X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=225253901; y=YQUncq4sDSh6GT6x_CP8b3DyW1Lbq3I3UHZWHapIjS96lbIUJq0 X-Yahoo-Profile: fsgonzales1 X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43163 Hello Christina and all. I also think that higher dimension beings, some of who we call Masters, do influence some people, even to the point of changing their forms in some cases. The changing of Matter itself by the power of Thought and Love is an interesting thing to see. Devotion and ultimately total surrender should render one=B4s being to the Master=B4s, so completely that the two are merged and the Master becomes manifest through the disciple. This is a well-known principle in Tibetan Buddhism and Deities are used. For example, Tsong Ka Pa is considered to be an emanation of Manjushri because he worked with that particular Bodhisattva and through devotion and practice acquired Manjushri=B4s wisdom. Love,=20 Frederico. =20=20 --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "christinaleestemaker" wrote: > > Higher dimension souls can influence ours on the lower dimensions. > So they can work out all forms on earth, where necessary. > Than the question can be, why they don't stop war? > Because we have to overcome by ourself that behavior. > We have no free will, but free choises, as mentioned before in=20 > another message and I think there is the link we can learn from. > Christina >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "fsgonzales1" =20 > wrote: > > > > At last, a light has shone... as to creating our realities, Cass, I > > really do not create my reality. I did not create this computer and=20 > I > > am not responsible for its appearance. If it starts to resemble me=20 > of > > Master Morya or any other, there=B4s either something in me or in the > > computer, or in both of us. Of course the computer is an absurd > > example but this applies to people. > > Our ideals of perfection are really what matters to me regarding=20 > the > > Masters, they are examples of perfection. Their sketches and=20 > pictures > > are symbollic. > > Anyone who wishes to go deeper into studying deity Yoga might find=20 > a > > very interesting similarity between the Masters of Theosophy and the > > Yidams of Buddhism. > > Both are empty, they do not have inherent existence. Still,=20 > trusting > > them, putting your love and faith and wishing to embrace their=20 > aspects > > can and does change a person, as in Tibetan Buddhism deity practice. > > The practitioner becomes enlightened by becoming his chosen deity.=20 > The > > whole process is complicated but it is similar to the Masters in=20 > some > > ways. Although I think there is a difference also, and the Masters=20 > are > > what is described in Buddhism as 'Gods of the realm of Form=B4 > > (Rupadhatu), while we are in the realm of desire (kamadhatu) and=20 > there > > are also gods in the Formless realm (arupadhatu). > > Adelaise your point is brilliant. > >=20 > > Another point, and more to the point here, is the fact that Masters > > of the > > Great White Lodge have evolved beyond the necessity of incarnating=20 > in > >=20 > > a physical form. They can take on a body if need be, and have done=20 > so > > within the history of theosophy, but there is no reason that the > > appearance > > of, for instance, the Master M, would be the same each time He > > assumed > > human form. The pictures we have of the Masters are symbolic in > > nature, > > meant to represent the ideal of perfection for humanity. > >=20 > > If we see some resonance of perfection in our friend, perhaps we are > > seeing > > the "real" person. The divine soul can shine forth, if we have eyes > > to see, > > enhancing the familiar form and giving it a larger than life > > effulgence. > >=20 > > Adelasie > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "adelasie" wrote: > > > > > > Hello Cass, Friends, > > >=20 > > > We might keep in mind that when we say that someone "looks like"=20 > > > someone else, what we are saying is that when we look at the=20 > person,=20 > > > we see a resemblance. Another person might not see the=20 > resemblance at=20 > > > all.=20 > > >=20 > > > > Nevertheless, this phenomenon of people looking like Masters and > > > > especially changing their ways of behaviour, has to have some=20 > deeper > > > > link. My personal opinion is that certain Apprentices concede=20 > their > > > > bodies to the Master=B4s influence so much that the Master=20 > actually > > > > takes over that body, so to speak, although the individual > > > > consciousness of that body is only widened, and does not suffer=20 > in any > > > > way. > > >=20 > > > Another point, and more to the point here, is the fact that=20 > Masters=20 > > > of the=20 > > > Great White Lodge have evolved beyond the necessity of=20 > incarnating in=20 > > >=20 > > > a physical form. They can take on a body if need be, and have=20 > done so > > > within the history of theosophy, but there is no reason that the=20 > > > appearance=20 > > > of, for instance, the Master M, would be the same each time He=20 > > > assumed=20 > > > human form. The pictures we have of the Masters are symbolic in=20 > > > nature,=20 > > > meant to represent the ideal of perfection for humanity.=20 > > >=20 > > > If we see some resonance of perfection in our friend, perhaps we=20 > are=20 > > > seeing=20 > > > the "real" person. The divine soul can shine forth, if we have=20 > eyes=20 > > > to see,=20 > > > enhancing the familiar form and giving it a larger than life=20 > > > effulgence.=20 > > >=20 > > > Adelasie > > > > > > From fredericosg@gmail.com Sat Mar 01 00:19:51 2008 Return-Path: X-Sender: fredericosg@gmail.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 14828 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 08:19:50 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.97) by m45.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 08:19:50 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO n12.bullet.mail.re1.yahoo.com) (69.147.103.139) by mta18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 08:19:50 -0000 X-Received: from [68.142.237.90] by n12.bullet.mail.re1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 08:19:50 -0000 X-Received: from [66.218.69.5] by t6.bullet.re3.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 08:19:50 -0000 X-Received: from [66.218.67.195] by t5.bullet.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 08:19:50 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 08:19:49 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-Originating-IP: 69.147.103.139 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:6:0:0:0 X-Yahoo-Post-IP: 201.17.35.167 From: "fsgonzales1" Subject: Definition of the 7 Rays X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=225253901; y=FCNK53IYZ4W1-zeOvgdgMiWVLSmKapeX_epbaT6mANWPRBPPMwY X-Yahoo-Profile: fsgonzales1 X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43164 I would like to ask other people who are interested in Theosophy to share their views on what are the characteristics of each of the Seven Rays. And also what Ray is the Mahachohan=B4s ? He is said to be in the 7th, 4th or 3rd Ray. Is the Mahachohan the Venetian Master or another one? Frederico =20=20 From christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com Sat Mar 01 04:16:39 2008 Return-Path: X-Sender: christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 53278 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 12:16:36 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (69.147.108.202) by m53.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 12:16:36 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO n15b.bullet.sp1.yahoo.com) (69.147.64.119) by mta3.grp.re1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 12:16:36 -0000 X-Received: from [216.252.122.216] by n15.bullet.sp1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 12:14:07 -0000 X-Received: from [66.218.69.2] by t1.bullet.sp1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 12:14:07 -0000 X-Received: from [66.218.67.199] by t2.bullet.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 12:14:07 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 12:14:06 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-Originating-IP: 69.147.64.119 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:6:0:0:0 X-Yahoo-Post-IP: 83.87.102.145 From: "christinaleestemaker" Subject: Re: Definition of the 7 Rays X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=162317756; y=uvdkhSLbDbAWQnTldiAOKbk8-E96P46xbn__sX6T1nUWWVEm-P_nHaCBZKGlIB8 X-Yahoo-Profile: christinaleestemaker X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43165 Hi Fred, maybe I can help you with the following . Maha Choha, till this moment I cannot find his rule for one ray=20 especially.I think he is working on all rays. Here follows : Master the prince Rakoczy is a great Lord of Fohat or cosmic electric=20 fire and head of the seventh ray.The Master is also of course, a very=20 wonderful superhuman Being highly developed in every aspect of human=20 nature, a glorious, perfected man, a very high Adept. Other aspects are therefore fully and perfectly developed and=20 expressed in him.He deals with creative forces of the Solar system=20 and planet.He is also a great Lord of Wisdom and Love and an=20 embodiment of the Cosmic Will.He is also a Master, an Adept who takes=20 pupils.Ray seven and the first are associated with each other.Some=20 information gives master St Germain for this ray. Master of the first ray is Master Morya.Also the rays are=20 corresponding into colors, crystals,sounds, angels and chakras,=20 planets and days of the week and social functions. Not that the first ray is corresponding to the first chakra, it is=20 not .It is to the vicuddha or fifth troath chakra with planets mars=20 and jupiter and the day tuesday and do=3DC crystal and angel Michael. Master Koot Hoomi is one of the second ray, a ray of Wisdom and Love=20 corresponding to sahasrara or seventh, crown chakra and sunday and of=20 course star Sun.and sound re=3DD sapphire and angel Gabri=EBl. Master of the third Ray is Paul the Venetian anahata=3D fourth,heartchakra and associated with wednesday sound=20 mi=3DE emerald and angel Rafa=EBl. Specialized in to be aware and viveka or ability of distinction. This three aspects of 1.2 and 3 ray are directly from the=20 willpower,love-wisdom and ability of distinction. Ray 4,5 and 6 are resp from Harmony,Knowledge and Devotion Masters are Serapis Bey,Hilarion and Lord Maitreya Jezus,=20 4 Ray=3Dsound fa=3DF muladhara=3D first rootchakra , saturday, planet=20 earth. 5 Ray sound sol=3DG anja,sixth foreheadchakra , monday ,planet=20 saturnus. 6 Ray sound la=3DA manipura, solar plex thirdchakra, thursday,=20 planet Venus and Mercurius. 7 Ray sound si=3DB(es) second chakra, swadhistana or=20 spleenchakra.planet moon and friday. Hope I give you some info from my literature from several books and=20 lectures in Theosophy.=20=20 Christina --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "fsgonzales1" =20 wrote: > > I would like to ask other people who are interested in Theosophy=20 to > share their views on what are the characteristics of each of the=20 Seven > Rays. > And also what Ray is the Mahachohan=B4s ? He is said to be in the=20 7th, > 4th or 3rd Ray. Is the Mahachohan the Venetian Master or another=20 one? > Frederico > From Mvandertak@yahoo.com Sat Mar 01 04:26:28 2008 Return-Path: X-Sender: mvandertak@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 45831 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 12:26:23 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.97) by m43.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 12:26:23 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO web52612.mail.re2.yahoo.com) (206.190.48.215) by mta18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 12:26:23 -0000 X-Received: (qmail 69388 invoked by uid 60001); 1 Mar 2008 12:26:22 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: oHN7kE0VM1k81pB7bJfwSp_Ib7f7sptIxwQ7UEgsSursVhi2uplk4g19G4_.dFEyGI64cj3KGPY4Xmh3D7TiGdTXOEPynmCTtX.QB2pLkkzzxKHh.FMpcDr3.WzN3A-- X-Received: from [212.127.190.196] by web52612.mail.re2.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 01 Mar 2008 04:26:22 PST Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 04:26:22 -0800 (PST) To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <837907.68862.qm@web52612.mail.re2.yahoo.com> X-Originating-IP: 206.190.48.215 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0:0:0 From: Martin Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Definition of the 7 Rays X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38276385; y=gyBzbO2vwp4WLoXA0zkxRA2vh5l6NvXzWzHrZKEJMtJVYFst4g X-Yahoo-Profile: mvandertak X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43166 Erhmm, you mean its from Alice Bailey's Theosophy, which is quite different than Blavatsky's...I never read a written thing by HPB telling on what ray's some adepts are..I also don't think its helpfull for anyone to know...One thing IS important though: the soul works on ALL rays, since the (Atmic) soul knows all...and after all its the soul which is important , not the personalities embodying her. Personalities are just temporary appearances..so here my 2 dollars worth. --- christinaleestemaker wrote: > Hi Fred, maybe I can help you with the following . > Maha Choha, till this moment I cannot find his rule > for one ray > especially.I think he is working on all rays. > > Here follows : > > Master the prince Rakoczy is a great Lord of Fohat > or cosmic electric > fire and head of the seventh ray.The Master is also > of course, a very > wonderful superhuman Being highly developed in > every aspect of human > nature, a glorious, perfected man, a very high > Adept. > Other aspects are therefore fully and perfectly > developed and > expressed in him.He deals with creative forces of > the Solar system > and planet.He is also a great Lord of Wisdom and > Love and an > embodiment of the Cosmic Will.He is also a Master, > an Adept who takes > pupils.Ray seven and the first are associated with > each other.Some > information gives master St Germain for this ray. > > Master of the first ray is Master Morya.Also the > rays are > corresponding into colors, crystals,sounds, angels > and chakras, > planets and days of the week and social functions. > Not that the first ray is corresponding to the first > chakra, it is > not .It is to the vicuddha or fifth troath chakra > with planets mars > and jupiter and the day tuesday and do=C crystal > and angel Michael. > > Master Koot Hoomi is one of the second ray, a ray of > Wisdom and Love > corresponding to sahasrara or seventh, crown chakra > and sunday and of > course star Sun.and sound re=D sapphire and angel > Gabriël. > > Master of the third Ray is Paul the Venetian > anahata= fourth,heartchakra and associated with > wednesday sound > mi=E emerald and angel Rafaël. > Specialized in to be aware and viveka or ability of > distinction. > This three aspects of 1.2 and 3 ray are directly > from the > willpower,love-wisdom and ability of distinction. > > Ray 4,5 and 6 are resp from Harmony,Knowledge and > Devotion > > Masters are Serapis Bey,Hilarion and Lord Maitreya > Jezus, > > 4 Ray=sound fa=F muladhara= first rootchakra , > saturday, planet > earth. > > 5 Ray sound sol=G anja,sixth foreheadchakra , > monday ,planet > saturnus. > > 6 Ray sound la=A manipura, solar plex > thirdchakra, thursday, > planet Venus and Mercurius. > > > 7 Ray sound si=B(es) second chakra, swadhistana or > spleenchakra.planet moon and friday. > > Hope I give you some info from my literature from > several books and > lectures in Theosophy. > > Christina > > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "fsgonzales1" > > wrote: > > > > I would like to ask other people who are > interested in Theosophy > to > > share their views on what are the characteristics > of each of the > Seven > > Rays. > > And also what Ray is the Mahachohan´s ? He is > said to be in the > 7th, > > 4th or 3rd Ray. Is the Mahachohan the Venetian > Master or another > one? > > Frederico > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ From mkr777@gmail.com Sat Mar 01 05:15:11 2008 Return-Path: X-Sender: mkr777@gmail.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 52841 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 13:15:08 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.95) by m55.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 13:15:08 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO wr-out-0506.google.com) (64.233.184.235) by mta16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 13:15:08 -0000 X-Received: by wr-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id 68so359881wra.7 for ; Sat, 01 Mar 2008 05:15:08 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.101.71.16 with SMTP id y16mr16910959ank.0.1204377307843; Sat, 01 Mar 2008 05:15:07 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.100.168.10 with HTTP; Sat, 1 Mar 2008 05:15:07 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 07:15:07 -0600 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 References: X-Originating-IP: 64.233.184.235 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0:0:0 From: MKR Subject: Re: Theos-World Definition of the 7 Rays X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=243096636; y=pThx6DFwssfVQR5ux388TA_lSoFJm2UKg_rdlG0huKUo1mla4gE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43167 *Have you read the book by Ernest Wood?* On 3/1/08, fsgonzales1 wrote: > > I would like to ask other people who are interested in Theosophy to > share their views on what are the characteristics of each of the Seven > Rays. > And also what Ray is the Mahachohan=B4s ? He is said to be in the 7th, > 4th or 3rd Ray. Is the Mahachohan the Venetian Master or another one? > Frederico > > >=20 > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com Sat Mar 01 05:41:14 2008 Return-Path: X-Sender: christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 150 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 13:41:03 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.96) by m36.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 13:41:03 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO n5.bullet.mail.re1.yahoo.com) (69.147.103.132) by mta17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 13:41:02 -0000 X-Received: from [68.142.237.90] by n5.bullet.mail.re1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 13:41:02 -0000 X-Received: from [66.218.69.4] by t6.bullet.re3.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 13:41:02 -0000 X-Received: from [66.218.66.84] by t4.bullet.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 13:41:02 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 13:41:01 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <837907.68862.qm@web52612.mail.re2.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-Originating-IP: 69.147.103.132 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0:0:0 X-Yahoo-Post-IP: 83.87.102.145 From: "christinaleestemaker" Subject: Theos-World Re: Definition of the 7 Rays X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=162317756; y=veBsAc6C7K_E9-_kaPGMEwjm90hQVAvxgAmnz5niayIpUNy4wpy9P8Opp6N1LMU X-Yahoo-Profile: christinaleestemaker X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43168 It is not from Alice Bailey, she mentioned different names and you=20 are right, HPB did not mentioned rays and names from Masters, but she=20 gives good sight on te working aspects.Most of all to be read in SDIII Geoffrey Hudson wrote about the names in his Light of the Sanctuary. By the way, the question was in Theosophical philosophy and not only=20 from the HPB writings.Theosophy does not end or start with only HPB,=20 although she gives great masterwork in her way. Christina --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Martin wrote: > > Erhmm, you mean its from Alice Bailey's Theosophy, > which is quite different than Blavatsky's...I never > read a written thing by HPB telling on what ray's some > adepts are..I also don't think its helpfull for anyone > to know...One thing IS important though: the soul > works on ALL rays, since the (Atmic) soul knows > all...and after all its the soul which is important , > not the personalities embodying her. Personalities are > just temporary appearances..so here my 2 dollars > worth.=20 >=20 >=20 > --- christinaleestemaker > wrote: >=20 > > Hi Fred, maybe I can help you with the following . > > Maha Choha, till this moment I cannot find his rule > > for one ray=20 > > especially.I think he is working on all rays. > >=20 > > Here follows : > >=20 > > Master the prince Rakoczy is a great Lord of Fohat > > or cosmic electric=20 > > fire and head of the seventh ray.The Master is also > > of course, a very=20 > > wonderful superhuman Being highly developed in > > every aspect of human=20 > > nature, a glorious, perfected man, a very high > > Adept. > > Other aspects are therefore fully and perfectly > > developed and=20 > > expressed in him.He deals with creative forces of > > the Solar system=20 > > and planet.He is also a great Lord of Wisdom and > > Love and an=20 > > embodiment of the Cosmic Will.He is also a Master, > > an Adept who takes=20 > > pupils.Ray seven and the first are associated with > > each other.Some=20 > > information gives master St Germain for this ray. > >=20 > > Master of the first ray is Master Morya.Also the > > rays are=20 > > corresponding into colors, crystals,sounds, angels > > and chakras,=20 > > planets and days of the week and social functions. > > Not that the first ray is corresponding to the first > > chakra, it is=20 > > not .It is to the vicuddha or fifth troath chakra > > with planets mars=20 > > and jupiter and the day tuesday and do=3DC crystal > > and angel Michael. > >=20 > > Master Koot Hoomi is one of the second ray, a ray of > > Wisdom and Love=20 > > corresponding to sahasrara or seventh, crown chakra > > and sunday and of=20 > > course star Sun.and sound re=3DD sapphire and angel > > Gabri=EBl. > >=20 > > Master of the third Ray is Paul the Venetian > > anahata=3D fourth,heartchakra and associated with > > wednesday sound=20 > > mi=3DE emerald and angel Rafa=EBl. > > Specialized in to be aware and viveka or ability of > > distinction. > > This three aspects of 1.2 and 3 ray are directly > > from the=20 > > willpower,love-wisdom and ability of distinction. > >=20 > > Ray 4,5 and 6 are resp from Harmony,Knowledge and > > Devotion > >=20 > > Masters are Serapis Bey,Hilarion and Lord Maitreya > > Jezus,=20 > >=20 > > 4 Ray=3Dsound fa=3DF muladhara=3D first rootchakra , > > saturday, planet=20 > > earth. > >=20 > > 5 Ray sound sol=3DG anja,sixth foreheadchakra , > > monday ,planet=20 > > saturnus. > >=20 > > 6 Ray sound la=3DA manipura, solar plex=20 > > thirdchakra, thursday,=20 > > planet Venus and Mercurius. > >=20 > >=20 > > 7 Ray sound si=3DB(es) second chakra, swadhistana or=20 > > spleenchakra.planet moon and friday. > >=20 > > Hope I give you some info from my literature from > > several books and=20 > > lectures in Theosophy.=20=20 > >=20 > > Christina > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "fsgonzales1" > > =20 > > wrote: > > > > > > I would like to ask other people who are > > interested in Theosophy=20 > > to > > > share their views on what are the characteristics > > of each of the=20 > > Seven > > > Rays. > > > And also what Ray is the Mahachohan=B4s ? He is > > said to be in the=20 > > 7th, > > > 4th or 3rd Ray. Is the Mahachohan the Venetian > > Master or another=20 > > one? > > > Frederico > > > > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20=20=20=20=20=20=20 ___________________________________________________________________________= _________ > Be a better friend, newshound, and=20 > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http:// mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=3DAhu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ > From Mvandertak@yahoo.com Sat Mar 01 06:49:49 2008 Return-Path: X-Sender: mvandertak@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 8165 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 14:49:47 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.97) by m53.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 14:49:47 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO web52604.mail.re2.yahoo.com) (206.190.48.207) by mta18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 14:49:47 -0000 X-Received: (qmail 64007 invoked by uid 60001); 1 Mar 2008 14:49:46 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: oKJn7o0VM1mf3EYxDS_swX8lHrM7lmS46240NpOhsF7dOJ29uxQwfKi5DXwMpicVlbqIp_d6zteugBzGWx9aA5GAEcr4EcMZiGyJnbvuDzzJR6ul7Xk.fy27OOsWINlpQiPVWZf.ySkzASL9ol9ixTJK0g-- X-Received: from [212.127.190.196] by web52604.mail.re2.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 01 Mar 2008 06:49:46 PST Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 06:49:46 -0800 (PST) To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <501969.63609.qm@web52604.mail.re2.yahoo.com> X-Originating-IP: 206.190.48.207 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0:0:0 From: Martin Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Definition of the 7 Rays X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38276385; y=qeS8McgcTOYd1vaOwWqqvk4OnO7HKEd1NUx6bJoGEwrSj7CSFw X-Yahoo-Profile: mvandertak X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43169 Agreed, Theosophy didn't start with HPB, however she reinvented the word with HSO for use a a name for the Society, so when spoken about Theosophy one should distinquise between Theosophy in general or the teachings given by HPB. The SD3 is not a part3 but a collected bunch of papers lying around in HPB's apartment, collected and edited by A.Besant who on herself wasn't too much to be trusted on Theosophy as she proved later... Geoffrey Hodson was greatly under the influence of Leadbeater and Besant, and we all know how Leadbeater abused Theosophy. Hudson wrote about faeries, dwarfs, angels etc. He was a clairvoyant but no Seer. --- christinaleestemaker wrote: > It is not from Alice Bailey, she mentioned different > names and you > are right, HPB did not mentioned rays and names from > Masters, but she > gives good sight on te working aspects.Most of all > to be read in SDIII > Geoffrey Hudson wrote about the names in his Light > of the Sanctuary. > By the way, the question was in Theosophical > philosophy and not only > from the HPB writings.Theosophy does not end or > start with only HPB, > although she gives great masterwork in her way. > Christina > > > > > > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Martin > wrote: > > > > Erhmm, you mean its from Alice Bailey's Theosophy, > > which is quite different than Blavatsky's...I > never > > read a written thing by HPB telling on what ray's > some > > adepts are..I also don't think its helpfull for > anyone > > to know...One thing IS important though: the soul > > works on ALL rays, since the (Atmic) soul knows > > all...and after all its the soul which is > important , > > not the personalities embodying her. Personalities > are > > just temporary appearances..so here my 2 dollars > > worth. > > > > > > --- christinaleestemaker > > wrote: > > > > > Hi Fred, maybe I can help you with the following > . > > > Maha Choha, till this moment I cannot find his > rule > > > for one ray > > > especially.I think he is working on all rays. > > > > > > Here follows : > > > > > > Master the prince Rakoczy is a great Lord of > Fohat > > > or cosmic electric > > > fire and head of the seventh ray.The Master is > also > > > of course, a very > > > wonderful superhuman Being highly developed in > > > every aspect of human > > > nature, a glorious, perfected man, a very high > > > Adept. > > > Other aspects are therefore fully and perfectly > > > developed and > > > expressed in him.He deals with creative forces > of > > > the Solar system > > > and planet.He is also a great Lord of Wisdom > and > > > Love and an > > > embodiment of the Cosmic Will.He is also a > Master, > > > an Adept who takes > > > pupils.Ray seven and the first are associated > with > > > each other.Some > > > information gives master St Germain for this > ray. > > > > > > Master of the first ray is Master Morya.Also the > > > rays are > > > corresponding into colors, crystals,sounds, > angels > > > and chakras, > > > planets and days of the week and social > functions. > > > Not that the first ray is corresponding to the > first > > > chakra, it is > > > not .It is to the vicuddha or fifth troath > chakra > > > with planets mars > > > and jupiter and the day tuesday and do=C > crystal > > > and angel Michael. > > > > > > Master Koot Hoomi is one of the second ray, a > ray of > > > Wisdom and Love > > > corresponding to sahasrara or seventh, crown > chakra > > > and sunday and of > > > course star Sun.and sound re=D sapphire and > angel > > > Gabriël. > > > > > > Master of the third Ray is Paul the Venetian > > > anahata= fourth,heartchakra and associated with > > > wednesday sound > > > mi=E emerald and angel Rafaël. > > > Specialized in to be aware and viveka or ability > of > > > distinction. > > > This three aspects of 1.2 and 3 ray are directly > > > from the > > > willpower,love-wisdom and ability of > distinction. > > > > > > Ray 4,5 and 6 are resp from Harmony,Knowledge > and > > > Devotion > > > > > > Masters are Serapis Bey,Hilarion and Lord > Maitreya > > > Jezus, > > > > > > 4 Ray=sound fa=F muladhara= first rootchakra , > > > saturday, planet > > > earth. > > > > > > 5 Ray sound sol=G anja,sixth foreheadchakra , > > > monday ,planet > > > saturnus. > > > > > > 6 Ray sound la=A manipura, solar plex > > > thirdchakra, thursday, > > > planet Venus and Mercurius. > > > > > > > > > 7 Ray sound si=B(es) second chakra, swadhistana > or > > > spleenchakra.planet moon and friday. > > > > > > Hope I give you some info from my literature > from > > > several books and > > > lectures in Theosophy. > > > > > > Christina > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "fsgonzales1" > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > I would like to ask other people who are > > > interested in Theosophy > > > to > > > > share their views on what are the > characteristics > > > of each of the > > > Seven > > > > Rays. > > > > And also what Ray is the Mahachohan´s ? He > is > > > said to be in the > > > 7th, > > > > 4th or 3rd Ray. Is the Mahachohan the Venetian > > > Master or another > > > one? > > > > Frederico > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > > Be a better friend, newshound, and > > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. > http:// > mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From mkr777@gmail.com Sat Mar 01 07:13:47 2008 Return-Path: X-Sender: mkr777@gmail.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 56393 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 15:13:45 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.96) by m35.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 15:13:45 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO wx-out-0506.google.com) (66.249.82.229) by mta17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 15:13:45 -0000 X-Received: by wx-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id i29so7464948wxd.19 for ; Sat, 01 Mar 2008 07:13:44 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.100.124.6 with SMTP id w6mr22911251anc.94.1204384424677; Sat, 01 Mar 2008 07:13:44 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.100.168.10 with HTTP; Sat, 1 Mar 2008 07:13:44 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 09:13:44 -0600 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <501969.63609.qm@web52604.mail.re2.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <501969.63609.qm@web52604.mail.re2.yahoo.com> X-Originating-IP: 66.249.82.229 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0:0:0 From: MKR Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Definition of the 7 Rays X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=243096636; y=7jxzaAJZFg7a38LC2_ODwplOmfm1I-ky3cN9USTqFTODaKsV_So Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43170 Hodson was a clairvoyant in his own right and many who had known him would vouch for it. On seven rays, the comprehensive first book ever written was by Ernest Wood= . mkr On 3/1/08, Martin wrote: > > Agreed, Theosophy didn't start with HPB, however she > reinvented the word with HSO for use a a name for the > Society, so when spoken about Theosophy one should > distinquise between Theosophy in general or the > teachings given by HPB. > The SD3 is not a part3 but a collected bunch of papers > lying around in HPB's apartment, collected and edited > by A.Besant who on herself wasn't too much to be > trusted on Theosophy as she proved later... > Geoffrey Hodson was greatly under the influence of > Leadbeater and Besant, and we all know how Leadbeater > abused Theosophy. Hudson wrote about faeries, dwarfs, > angels etc. He was a clairvoyant but no Seer. > > --- christinaleestemaker > > wrote= : > > > It is not from Alice Bailey, she mentioned different > > names and you > > are right, HPB did not mentioned rays and names from > > Masters, but she > > gives good sight on te working aspects.Most of all > > to be read in SDIII > > Geoffrey Hudson wrote about the names in his Light > > of the Sanctuary. > > By the way, the question was in Theosophical > > philosophy and not only > > from the HPB writings.Theosophy does not end or > > start with only HPB, > > although she gives great masterwork in her way. > > Christina > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com , Marti= n > > wrote: > > > > > > Erhmm, you mean its from Alice Bailey's Theosophy, > > > which is quite different than Blavatsky's...I > > never > > > read a written thing by HPB telling on what ray's > > some > > > adepts are..I also don't think its helpfull for > > anyone > > > to know...One thing IS important though: the soul > > > works on ALL rays, since the (Atmic) soul knows > > > all...and after all its the soul which is > > important , > > > not the personalities embodying her. Personalities > > are > > > just temporary appearances..so here my 2 dollars > > > worth. > > > > > > > > > --- christinaleestemaker > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Fred, maybe I can help you with the following > > . > > > > Maha Choha, till this moment I cannot find his > > rule > > > > for one ray > > > > especially.I think he is working on all rays. > > > > > > > > Here follows : > > > > > > > > Master the prince Rakoczy is a great Lord of > > Fohat > > > > or cosmic electric > > > > fire and head of the seventh ray.The Master is > > also > > > > of course, a very > > > > wonderful superhuman Being highly developed in > > > > every aspect of human > > > > nature, a glorious, perfected man, a very high > > > > Adept. > > > > Other aspects are therefore fully and perfectly > > > > developed and > > > > expressed in him.He deals with creative forces > > of > > > > the Solar system > > > > and planet.He is also a great Lord of Wisdom > > and > > > > Love and an > > > > embodiment of the Cosmic Will.He is also a > > Master, > > > > an Adept who takes > > > > pupils.Ray seven and the first are associated > > with > > > > each other.Some > > > > information gives master St Germain for this > > ray. > > > > > > > > Master of the first ray is Master Morya.Also the > > > > rays are > > > > corresponding into colors, crystals,sounds, > > angels > > > > and chakras, > > > > planets and days of the week and social > > functions. > > > > Not that the first ray is corresponding to the > > first > > > > chakra, it is > > > > not .It is to the vicuddha or fifth troath > > chakra > > > > with planets mars > > > > and jupiter and the day tuesday and do=3DC > > crystal > > > > and angel Michael. > > > > > > > > Master Koot Hoomi is one of the second ray, a > > ray of > > > > Wisdom and Love > > > > corresponding to sahasrara or seventh, crown > > chakra > > > > and sunday and of > > > > course star Sun.and sound re=3DD sapphire and > > angel > > > > Gabri=EBl. > > > > > > > > Master of the third Ray is Paul the Venetian > > > > anahata=3D fourth,heartchakra and associated with > > > > wednesday sound > > > > mi=3DE emerald and angel Rafa=EBl. > > > > Specialized in to be aware and viveka or ability > > of > > > > distinction. > > > > This three aspects of 1.2 and 3 ray are directly > > > > from the > > > > willpower,love-wisdom and ability of > > distinction. > > > > > > > > Ray 4,5 and 6 are resp from Harmony,Knowledge > > and > > > > Devotion > > > > > > > > Masters are Serapis Bey,Hilarion and Lord > > Maitreya > > > > Jezus, > > > > > > > > 4 Ray=3Dsound fa=3DF muladhara=3D first rootchakra , > > > > saturday, planet > > > > earth. > > > > > > > > 5 Ray sound sol=3DG anja,sixth foreheadchakra , > > > > monday ,planet > > > > saturnus. > > > > > > > > 6 Ray sound la=3DA manipura, solar plex > > > > thirdchakra, thursday, > > > > planet Venus and Mercurius. > > > > > > > > > > > > 7 Ray sound si=3DB(es) second chakra, swadhistana > > or > > > > spleenchakra.planet moon and friday. > > > > > > > > Hope I give you some info from my literature > > from > > > > several books and > > > > lectures in Theosophy. > > > > > > > > Christina > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com , > "fsgonzales1" > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I would like to ask other people who are > > > > interested in Theosophy > > > > to > > > > > share their views on what are the > > characteristics > > > > of each of the > > > > Seven > > > > > Rays. > > > > > And also what Ray is the Mahachohan=B4s ? He > > is > > > > said to be in the > > > > 7th, > > > > > 4th or 3rd Ray. Is the Mahachohan the Venetian > > > > Master or another > > > > one? > > > > > Frederico > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________________ > > > Be a better friend, newshound, and > > > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. > > http:// > > mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=3DAhu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________________ > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs >=20 > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com Sat Mar 01 07:49:27 2008 Return-Path: X-Sender: christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 72085 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 15:49:24 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.96) by m56.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 15:49:23 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO n42d.bullet.mail.sp1.yahoo.com) (66.163.169.156) by mta17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 15:49:23 -0000 X-Received: from [216.252.122.219] by n42.bullet.mail.sp1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 15:49:23 -0000 X-Received: from [209.73.164.83] by t4.bullet.sp1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 15:49:23 -0000 X-Received: from [66.218.66.78] by t7.bullet.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 15:49:23 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 15:49:22 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-Originating-IP: 66.163.169.156 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:6:0:0:0 X-Yahoo-Post-IP: 83.87.102.145 From: "christinaleestemaker" Subject: Theos-World Re: Definition of the 7 Rays X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=162317756; y=ro3cDdvW59tJ2wHv1o-tCLiG2Q7eRIUUZVIyzNrzXAYs5zBf5QpspFfXe4sbwJU X-Yahoo-Profile: christinaleestemaker X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43171 "Sounds and colours are all spiritual numerals; as the seven=20 prismatic rays proceed from one spot in heaven, so the seven powers=20 of nature, each of them a number, are the seven radiations of the=20 Unity, the central, spiritual SUN." (H P Blavatsky - "Isis Unveiled"---=20 In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com,=20 MKR wrote: > > Hodson was a clairvoyant in his own right and many who had known=20 him would > vouch for it. >=20 > On seven rays, the comprehensive first book ever written was by=20 Ernest Wood. >=20 > mkr >=20 > On 3/1/08, Martin wrote: > > > > Agreed, Theosophy didn't start with HPB, however she > > reinvented the word with HSO for use a a name for the > > Society, so when spoken about Theosophy one should > > distinquise between Theosophy in general or the > > teachings given by HPB. > > The SD3 is not a part3 but a collected bunch of papers > > lying around in HPB's apartment, collected and edited > > by A.Besant who on herself wasn't too much to be > > trusted on Theosophy as she proved later... > > Geoffrey Hodson was greatly under the influence of > > Leadbeater and Besant, and we all know how Leadbeater > > abused Theosophy. Hudson wrote about faeries, dwarfs, > > angels etc. He was a clairvoyant but no Seer. > > > > --- christinaleestemaker > > >=20 wrote: > > > > > It is not from Alice Bailey, she mentioned different > > > names and you > > > are right, HPB did not mentioned rays and names from > > > Masters, but she > > > gives good sight on te working aspects.Most of all > > > to be read in SDIII > > > Geoffrey Hudson wrote about the names in his Light > > > of the Sanctuary. > > > By the way, the question was in Theosophical > > > philosophy and not only > > > from the HPB writings.Theosophy does not end or > > > start with only HPB, > > > although she gives great masterwork in her way. > > > Christina > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com , Martin > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Erhmm, you mean its from Alice Bailey's Theosophy, > > > > which is quite different than Blavatsky's...I > > > never > > > > read a written thing by HPB telling on what ray's > > > some > > > > adepts are..I also don't think its helpfull for > > > anyone > > > > to know...One thing IS important though: the soul > > > > works on ALL rays, since the (Atmic) soul knows > > > > all...and after all its the soul which is > > > important , > > > > not the personalities embodying her. Personalities > > > are > > > > just temporary appearances..so here my 2 dollars > > > > worth. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- christinaleestemaker > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Fred, maybe I can help you with the following > > > . > > > > > Maha Choha, till this moment I cannot find his > > > rule > > > > > for one ray > > > > > especially.I think he is working on all rays. > > > > > > > > > > Here follows : > > > > > > > > > > Master the prince Rakoczy is a great Lord of > > > Fohat > > > > > or cosmic electric > > > > > fire and head of the seventh ray.The Master is > > > also > > > > > of course, a very > > > > > wonderful superhuman Being highly developed in > > > > > every aspect of human > > > > > nature, a glorious, perfected man, a very high > > > > > Adept. > > > > > Other aspects are therefore fully and perfectly > > > > > developed and > > > > > expressed in him.He deals with creative forces > > > of > > > > > the Solar system > > > > > and planet.He is also a great Lord of Wisdom > > > and > > > > > Love and an > > > > > embodiment of the Cosmic Will.He is also a > > > Master, > > > > > an Adept who takes > > > > > pupils.Ray seven and the first are associated > > > with > > > > > each other.Some > > > > > information gives master St Germain for this > > > ray. > > > > > > > > > > Master of the first ray is Master Morya.Also the > > > > > rays are > > > > > corresponding into colors, crystals,sounds, > > > angels > > > > > and chakras, > > > > > planets and days of the week and social > > > functions. > > > > > Not that the first ray is corresponding to the > > > first > > > > > chakra, it is > > > > > not .It is to the vicuddha or fifth troath > > > chakra > > > > > with planets mars > > > > > and jupiter and the day tuesday and do=3DC > > > crystal > > > > > and angel Michael. > > > > > > > > > > Master Koot Hoomi is one of the second ray, a > > > ray of > > > > > Wisdom and Love > > > > > corresponding to sahasrara or seventh, crown > > > chakra > > > > > and sunday and of > > > > > course star Sun.and sound re=3DD sapphire and > > > angel > > > > > Gabri=EBl. > > > > > > > > > > Master of the third Ray is Paul the Venetian > > > > > anahata=3D fourth,heartchakra and associated with > > > > > wednesday sound > > > > > mi=3DE emerald and angel Rafa=EBl. > > > > > Specialized in to be aware and viveka or ability > > > of > > > > > distinction. > > > > > This three aspects of 1.2 and 3 ray are directly > > > > > from the > > > > > willpower,love-wisdom and ability of > > > distinction. > > > > > > > > > > Ray 4,5 and 6 are resp from Harmony,Knowledge > > > and > > > > > Devotion > > > > > > > > > > Masters are Serapis Bey,Hilarion and Lord > > > Maitreya > > > > > Jezus, > > > > > > > > > > 4 Ray=3Dsound fa=3DF muladhara=3D first rootchakra , > > > > > saturday, planet > > > > > earth. > > > > > > > > > > 5 Ray sound sol=3DG anja,sixth foreheadchakra , > > > > > monday ,planet > > > > > saturnus. > > > > > > > > > > 6 Ray sound la=3DA manipura, solar plex > > > > > thirdchakra, thursday, > > > > > planet Venus and Mercurius. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7 Ray sound si=3DB(es) second chakra, swadhistana > > > or > > > > > spleenchakra.planet moon and friday. > > > > > > > > > > Hope I give you some info from my literature > > > from > > > > > several books and > > > > > lectures in Theosophy. > > > > > > > > > > Christina > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com , > > "fsgonzales1" > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > I would like to ask other people who are > > > > > interested in Theosophy > > > > > to > > > > > > share their views on what are the > > > characteristics > > > > > of each of the > > > > > Seven > > > > > > Rays. > > > > > > And also what Ray is the Mahachohan=B4s ? He > > > is > > > > > said to be in the > > > > > 7th, > > > > > > 4th or 3rd Ray. Is the Mahachohan the Venetian > > > > > Master or another > > > > > one? > > > > > > Frederico > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________________ > > > > Be a better friend, newshound, and > > > > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. > > > http:// > > > mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=3DAhu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________________ > > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > >=20 > > >=20 >=20 > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > From christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com Sat Mar 01 08:05:54 2008 Return-Path: X-Sender: christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 93715 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 16:05:26 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.96) by m50.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 16:05:26 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO n52a.bullet.mail.sp1.yahoo.com) (66.163.168.146) by mta17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 16:05:26 -0000 X-Received: from [216.252.122.217] by n52.bullet.mail.sp1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 16:05:26 -0000 X-Received: from [66.218.69.5] by t2.bullet.sp1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 16:05:26 -0000 X-Received: from [66.218.66.84] by t5.bullet.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 16:05:26 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 16:05:25 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-Originating-IP: 66.163.168.146 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:6:0:0:0 X-Yahoo-Post-IP: 83.87.102.145 From: "christinaleestemaker" Subject: Theos-World Re: Definition of the 7 Rays X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=162317756; y=R3MWxNfzyCDrKy5yCtShq69B_ttI7SzXZ56tuw5RHvuE8NURz42GaRP95UAYPd8 X-Yahoo-Profile: christinaleestemaker X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43172 Ernest Wood's complete book to read at http://www.theosophical.ca/SevenRays.htm#11 --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, MKR wrote: > > Hodson was a clairvoyant in his own right and many who had known=20 him would > vouch for it. >=20 > On seven rays, the comprehensive first book ever written was by=20 Ernest Wood. >=20 > mkr >=20 > On 3/1/08, Martin wrote: > > > > Agreed, Theosophy didn't start with HPB, however she > > reinvented the word with HSO for use a a name for the > > Society, so when spoken about Theosophy one should > > distinquise between Theosophy in general or the > > teachings given by HPB. > > The SD3 is not a part3 but a collected bunch of papers > > lying around in HPB's apartment, collected and edited > > by A.Besant who on herself wasn't too much to be > > trusted on Theosophy as she proved later... > > Geoffrey Hodson was greatly under the influence of > > Leadbeater and Besant, and we all know how Leadbeater > > abused Theosophy. Hudson wrote about faeries, dwarfs, > > angels etc. He was a clairvoyant but no Seer. > > > > --- christinaleestemaker > > >=20 wrote: > > > > > It is not from Alice Bailey, she mentioned different > > > names and you > > > are right, HPB did not mentioned rays and names from > > > Masters, but she > > > gives good sight on te working aspects.Most of all > > > to be read in SDIII > > > Geoffrey Hudson wrote about the names in his Light > > > of the Sanctuary. > > > By the way, the question was in Theosophical > > > philosophy and not only > > > from the HPB writings.Theosophy does not end or > > > start with only HPB, > > > although she gives great masterwork in her way. > > > Christina > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com , Martin > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Erhmm, you mean its from Alice Bailey's Theosophy, > > > > which is quite different than Blavatsky's...I > > > never > > > > read a written thing by HPB telling on what ray's > > > some > > > > adepts are..I also don't think its helpfull for > > > anyone > > > > to know...One thing IS important though: the soul > > > > works on ALL rays, since the (Atmic) soul knows > > > > all...and after all its the soul which is > > > important , > > > > not the personalities embodying her. Personalities > > > are > > > > just temporary appearances..so here my 2 dollars > > > > worth. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- christinaleestemaker > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Fred, maybe I can help you with the following > > > . > > > > > Maha Choha, till this moment I cannot find his > > > rule > > > > > for one ray > > > > > especially.I think he is working on all rays. > > > > > > > > > > Here follows : > > > > > > > > > > Master the prince Rakoczy is a great Lord of > > > Fohat > > > > > or cosmic electric > > > > > fire and head of the seventh ray.The Master is > > > also > > > > > of course, a very > > > > > wonderful superhuman Being highly developed in > > > > > every aspect of human > > > > > nature, a glorious, perfected man, a very high > > > > > Adept. > > > > > Other aspects are therefore fully and perfectly > > > > > developed and > > > > > expressed in him.He deals with creative forces > > > of > > > > > the Solar system > > > > > and planet.He is also a great Lord of Wisdom > > > and > > > > > Love and an > > > > > embodiment of the Cosmic Will.He is also a > > > Master, > > > > > an Adept who takes > > > > > pupils.Ray seven and the first are associated > > > with > > > > > each other.Some > > > > > information gives master St Germain for this > > > ray. > > > > > > > > > > Master of the first ray is Master Morya.Also the > > > > > rays are > > > > > corresponding into colors, crystals,sounds, > > > angels > > > > > and chakras, > > > > > planets and days of the week and social > > > functions. > > > > > Not that the first ray is corresponding to the > > > first > > > > > chakra, it is > > > > > not .It is to the vicuddha or fifth troath > > > chakra > > > > > with planets mars > > > > > and jupiter and the day tuesday and do=3DC > > > crystal > > > > > and angel Michael. > > > > > > > > > > Master Koot Hoomi is one of the second ray, a > > > ray of > > > > > Wisdom and Love > > > > > corresponding to sahasrara or seventh, crown > > > chakra > > > > > and sunday and of > > > > > course star Sun.and sound re=3DD sapphire and > > > angel > > > > > Gabri=EBl. > > > > > > > > > > Master of the third Ray is Paul the Venetian > > > > > anahata=3D fourth,heartchakra and associated with > > > > > wednesday sound > > > > > mi=3DE emerald and angel Rafa=EBl. > > > > > Specialized in to be aware and viveka or ability > > > of > > > > > distinction. > > > > > This three aspects of 1.2 and 3 ray are directly > > > > > from the > > > > > willpower,love-wisdom and ability of > > > distinction. > > > > > > > > > > Ray 4,5 and 6 are resp from Harmony,Knowledge > > > and > > > > > Devotion > > > > > > > > > > Masters are Serapis Bey,Hilarion and Lord > > > Maitreya > > > > > Jezus, > > > > > > > > > > 4 Ray=3Dsound fa=3DF muladhara=3D first rootchakra , > > > > > saturday, planet > > > > > earth. > > > > > > > > > > 5 Ray sound sol=3DG anja,sixth foreheadchakra , > > > > > monday ,planet > > > > > saturnus. > > > > > > > > > > 6 Ray sound la=3DA manipura, solar plex > > > > > thirdchakra, thursday, > > > > > planet Venus and Mercurius. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7 Ray sound si=3DB(es) second chakra, swadhistana > > > or > > > > > spleenchakra.planet moon and friday. > > > > > > > > > > Hope I give you some info from my literature > > > from > > > > > several books and > > > > > lectures in Theosophy. > > > > > > > > > > Christina > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com , > > "fsgonzales1" > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > I would like to ask other people who are > > > > > interested in Theosophy > > > > > to > > > > > > share their views on what are the > > > characteristics > > > > > of each of the > > > > > Seven > > > > > > Rays. > > > > > > And also what Ray is the Mahachohan=B4s ? He > > > is > > > > > said to be in the > > > > > 7th, > > > > > > 4th or 3rd Ray. Is the Mahachohan the Venetian > > > > > Master or another > > > > > one? > > > > > > Frederico > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________________ > > > > Be a better friend, newshound, and > > > > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. > > > http:// > > > mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=3DAhu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________________ > > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > >=20 > > >=20 >=20 > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > From global-theosophy@stofanet.dk Sat Mar 01 09:30:53 2008 Return-Path: X-Sender: global-theosophy@stofanet.dk X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 39179 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 17:30:25 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.95) by m47.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 17:30:25 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO mx02.stofanet.dk) (212.10.10.12) by mta16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 17:30:24 -0000 X-Received: from 56341115.rev.stofanet.dk ([86.52.17.21] helo=khidr) by mx02.stofanet.dk (envelope-from ) with smtp id 1JVVXQ-0000mn-1F for theos-talk@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 01 Mar 2008 18:30:20 +0100 Message-ID: <056101c87bc2$242b2ba0$15113456@khidr> To: References: <22481.70333.qm@web52108.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 18:31:53 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Originating-IP: 212.10.10.12 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0:0:0 From: "Morten Nymann Olesen" Subject: Re: Theos-World - Fools rush in X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=206055933; y=VhCo_EsH-y15-ThPou44VUaYpPpCXHOJ-iR3Wi1F24MN X-Yahoo-Profile: kidhr7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43173 I find that to be a personal matter, which it is not wise to answer you and others at this place about. M. Sufilight ----- Original Message ----- From: Cass Silva To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2008 3:32 AM Subject: Re: Theos-World - Fools rush in What test did you fail Morten? Cass Morten Nymann Olesen wrote: Dear Frank I wrote in the email in mention: "No, I have not passed the latest test. I have failed utterly, and that is why I suffer every day." If you can turn that into something covering the 7th initiation, it is your choice. I was simply talking about my latest test and nothing else. - - - - - - - In a previous email.... Frank wrote: "Mmmh. To me the link was broken some decades ago. Your play on politicians in contact with Masters frightens and remember me on the silly claims of Benjamin Creme and his Maitraya cant." I do not agree with Benjamin Creme's views and a number of his statements. I think you already is aware of this. But, I would really like to know if you think, that the Masters are - not - involved in communication with politicians on the most highest levels on this planet? I do think that they are. M. Sufilight ----- Original Message ----- From: Frank Reitemeyer To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 6:48 PM Subject: Re: Theos-World - Fools rush in Morten, you were writing about the passing of the last test. Before you wrote about your contects with the Mahatmans. So I guess you are talking about the 7th initiation. That you no say my emotional body is out of control is to be regarded as some kind of rejection. So please explain me, what you mean by last test, if it's not the 7th initiation? Frank ----- Original Message ----- From: Morten Nymann Olesen To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 6:22 PM Subject: Re: Theos-World - Fools rush in Frank wrote: "In other words - you admit publicly, that you underwent the 7th initiation!" I do not think I said that in my email. And I am a bit baffled as to why you reach such a conclusion unless your emotional body was out of control, when you wrote this email. M. Sufilight ----- Original Message ----- From: Frank Reitemeyer To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 5:54 PM Subject: Re: Theos-World - Fools rush in Morten: Honestly you will have to admit, that you do not at all know whether what you say here is true or not. I, on the other hand, claim I know, that you are in error. Yet I cannot prove this to you. ---------------------------------- Frank: I admit, that you know the truth, I am not, I am still searching the truth. - - - - - - - Morten: The unbroken link. Frank, I must assume that the "link" is unbroken and always will be one way or the other. To me this is obvious. Some politicians have contact. Some spiritual leaders have contact. Actually prove it I cannot. And I will not pin point who I think have contact, because I find that would be immoral of me. I say this, because I myself have contact in part. ---------------------------------- Frank: Mmmh. To me the link was broken some decades ago. Your play on politicians in contact with Masters frightens and remember me on the silly claims of Benjamin Creme and his Maitraya cant. When I talk about the link I mean the connection between Theosophy/theosophist/TS with Masters. I congratulate you for your partly contact to the Masters, although I am now a little bit puzzled as you seemed not to understand HPB's words about later messengers. Perhaps you are too shy to share your knowledge here and your sceptical words about HPB are but a blind to fool the fools. - - - - - - - Morten: No, I have not passed the latest test. I have failed utterly, and that is why I suffer every day. ---------------------------------- Frank: In other words - you admit publicly, that you underwent the 7th initiation! I congratulate you again! No wonder, that you have so much insight into the occult. Please, could you kindly comment on Purucker - from your above perspective? It seems, he was a lower grade initiate? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] --------------------------------- Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jokelap@dnainternet.net Sat Mar 01 10:18:24 2008 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 32533 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 18:18:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.67.96) by m35.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 18:18:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20d.bullet.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.67.246) by mta17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 18:18:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.6] by n20.bullet.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 18:18:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.85] by t6.bullet.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 18:18:18 -0000 X-Sender: jokelap@dnainternet.net X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 99323 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2008 21:26:44 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.95) by m49.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2008 21:26:44 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO satakieli.dnainternet.net) (87.94.96.108) by mta16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2008 21:26:44 -0000 X-Received: from [127.0.0.1] (239-78.adsl.lpoy.dnainternet.fi [78.27.93.78]) by satakieli.dnainternet.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E25F4C8B3 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2008 23:26:42 +0200 (EET) Message-ID: <47C4841A.2010102@dnainternet.net> Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 23:26:50 +0200 User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.9 (Windows/20071031) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com References: <546406.19409.qm@web52106.mail.re2.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Originating-IP: 87.94.96.108 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 2:3:4:0:0 From: Jokela Petri Subject: Re: Theos-World women in the LCC priesthood X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=281705993; y=6q-Qr5sJR1DOGGaz70q_8oGfuBpdC1rlm0y65C5ctj9a5PWUqk1v X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-system X-eGroups-Approved-By: eldon_tucker via web; 01 Mar 2008 18:18:14 -0000 X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43174 Laotse wrote in Tao Te Ching something like: When being a man one becomes a woman but still stays as man one becomes a channel of the Eternity. Why wouldnt it be vice versa? Maybe priests needs women or maybe it is just important that those two energies meet each other in mass as well in every day life. We still live in this cycle where we are sexually divided. One of the Mahatmas said that they recommended co-operation with women though in their orders it was not allowed, but still they was in connection and co-operation with Madam. In Egypt they had lots of priestess. Aslo Subba Row has written about women avatars in his esoteic teachings. But in buddhism they have very little amount of nuns, as far as I know. Anyway I belive that LCC brings out a good view of esoteric side of christian religion and stands therefore for reason in its own place. PJ kolad beth kirjoitti: > > > >From what I understand the men need the energy of the women in the > group. ever wonder why the number of priests (in RC church) has > diminished when the nuns started leaving the convents? > ________________________________ > > To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com > > From: kay_ziatz@yahoo.com > > Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 10:24:03 +0000 > > Subject: Re: Theos-World women in the LCC priesthood > > > > > >> MKR > __________________________________________________________ > Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your Hotmail®-get > your "fix". > http://www.msnmobilefix.com/Default.aspx > > > From global-theosophy@stofanet.dk Sat Mar 01 10:56:28 2008 Return-Path: X-Sender: global-theosophy@stofanet.dk X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 98203 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 18:56:26 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.96) by m55.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 18:56:26 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO mx02.stofanet.dk) (212.10.10.12) by mta17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 18:56:25 -0000 X-Received: from 56341115.rev.stofanet.dk ([86.52.17.21] helo=khidr) by mx02.stofanet.dk (envelope-from ) with smtp id 1JVWsb-0002fn-0v for theos-talk@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 01 Mar 2008 19:56:18 +0100 Message-ID: <058d01c87bce$2666a640$15113456@khidr> To: References: Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 19:57:51 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Originating-IP: 212.10.10.12 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0:0:0 From: "Morten Nymann Olesen" Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Definition of the 7 Rays X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=206055933; y=zHuZMtOTpr8wNpBKimQ6UVEe0iIkV-D17nCA-eoZSnQX X-Yahoo-Profile: kidhr7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43175 To all readers My views are: Maybe the following could be helpful to contemplate when talking about whic= h ray a Master is on.... 1. In the below quote we find, that it is not of importance which master o= ne is guided by. Later one will know, which one and learn to distinguish th= e various Masters from each other. So I will conclude, that writing about w= hich ray a Master is on is of small value. *** E.S.T. INSTRUCTIONS "The real Head of the Esoteric Section is a Master, of whom H. P. Blavatsky= is the mouthpiece for this Section. He is one of those Adepts referred to = in theosophical literature, and concerned in the formation of the Theosophi= cal Society. It is through H. P. Blavatsky that each member Page 489 of this Section will be brought more closely than hitherto under His influe= nce and care if found worthy of it. No student, however, need inquire which= of the Masters it is. For it does not matter in reality; nor is there any = necessity for creating one more chance for indiscretion. Suffice to say, su= ch is the law in the East.=20 Each person will receive in the way of enlightenment and assistance, just a= s much as he or she deserves and no more; and it is to be distinctly unders= tood that in this Body and these relations no such thing is known as favour= =E2=80=93=E2=80=93all depends upon the person=E2=80=99s merits=E2=80=93=E2= =80=93and no member has the power or knowledge to decide what either he or = another is entitled to. This must be left to those who know=E2=80=93=E2=80= =93alone. The apparent favour shown to some, and their consequent apparent = advancement, will be due to the work they do, to the best of their power, i= n the cause of Universal Brotherhood and the elevation of the Race. No man or woman is asked or supposed to do any more than his or her best; b= ut each is expected to work to the extent of their ability and powers. The value of the work of this Section to the individual member will depend = entirely upon: 1st. The person=E2=80=99s power to assimilate the teachings and make them a= part of his being; and 2nd. Upon the unselfishness of the motives with which he seeks for this kno= wledge; that is to say, upon whether he has entered this Section determined= to work for humanity, or with only the desire to benefit or gain something= for himself alone. Let all members, therefore, take warning in time, and seriously examine int= o their motives, for to all those who join this Section certain consequence= s will ensue." (H. P. Blavatsky Collected Writings online, vol. 12. - p. 48= 8-489) http://www.tonh.net/theosofie/hpb_cw_online/articles/v12/y1890_052.htm So all this nonsense in various groups about beginners calling upon a certa= in Master is not quite what it all is about. The Master needed will be help= ing the beginner Seeker or chela, and not always the one which the beginner= Seeker or chela wants. - - - - - - - 2. The Secret Doctrine=20 "As the invisible Logos, with its seven hierarchies (represented or personi= fied each by its chief angel or rector), form one POWER, the inner and the = invisible; so, in the world of Forms, the Sun and the seven chief Planets c= onstitute the visible and active potency; the latter "Hierarchy" being, so = to speak, the visible and objective Logos of the invisible and (except in t= he lowest grades) ever-subjective angels." (The Secret Doctrine vol. 2, p.2= 3) http://www.phx-ult-lodge.org/SDVolume2.htm "It is said by Krishna, the Logos incarnate, in the Bhagavat-git=C3=A2, "Th= e seven great Rishis, the four preceding Manus, partaking of my nature, wer= e born from my mind: from them sprang (emanated or was born) the human race= and the world," (Chap. X. Verse 6.) Here, by the seven great Rishis, the seven great rupa hierarchies or cl= asses of Dhyan Chohans, are meant. Let us bear in mind that the Saptarshi (= the seven Rishis) are the regents of the seven stars of the Great Bear, the= refore, of the same nature as the angels of the planets, or the seven great= Planetary Spirits. They were all reborn, all men on earth in various Kalpa= s and races. Moreover, "the four preceding Manus" are the four classes of t= he originally arupa gods =E2=80=94 the Kum=C3=A2ras, the Rudras, the Asuras= , etc.: who are also said to have incarnated." (The Secret Doctrine vol. 2, p.318) http://www.phx-ult-lodge.org/SDVolume2.htm - - - - - - - 3. Blavatsky says, that there are seven Paths: "But they had already separated before the ray of divine reason had enlight= ened the dark region of their hitherto slumbering minds, and had sinned. Th= at is to say, they had committed evil unconsciously, by producing an effect= which was unnatural. Yet, like the other six primitive brother or fellow r= aces, even so this seventh, henceforth degenerated race, which will have to= bide its time for its final development on account of the sin committed, = =E2=80=94 even this race will find itself on the last day on one of the sev= en paths. For "the wise * guard the home of nature's order, they assume exc= ellent forms in secret."=E2=80=A0 But we must see whether the "animals" tam= pered with, were of the same kind as those known to zoology. =E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2= =80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80= =94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94= =E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94 * This verse in the Veda (X. 5-6), "The seven wise ones (rays of wisdom, Dh= yanis) fashion seven paths (or lines as also Races in another sense). To on= e of these may the distressed mortal come" =E2=80=94 which is interpreted s= olely from the astronomical and cosmic aspect =E2=80=94 is one of the most = pregnant in occult meaning. The "paths" may mean lines (maryadah), but they= are primarily beams of light falling on the paths leading to wisdom. (See = Rig Veda IV. 5-13.) It means "ways" or paths. They are, in short, the seven= Rays which fall free from the macrocosmic centre, the seven principles in = the metaphysical, the seven Races in the physical sense. All depends upon t= he key used. =E2=80=A0 "Rig Veda," X. 10, 5, 2. " (The Secret Doctrine, vol. 2, p. 191) - - - - - - - 4. The seven chakras in the Head: "Our seven Chakras are all situated in the head, and it is these Master Cha= kras which govern and rule the seven (for there are seven) principal plexus= es in the body, and the forty-two minor ones to which Physiology refuses th= at name. The fact that no microscope can detect such centres on the objecti= ve plane goes for nothing; no microscope has ever yet detected, nor ever wi= ll, the difference between the =E2=80=9Cmotor=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9Csensory= =E2=80=9D nerve-tubes, the conductors of all our bodily and psychic sensati= ons; and yet physiological logic alone would show that such difference =E2=80=93=E2=80=93=E2=80=93=E2=80=93=E2=80=93=E2=80=93=E2=80=93=E2=80=93=E2= =80=93=E2=80=93 * In the Greek Eastern Church no child is allowed to go to confession befor= e the age of seven, after which he is considered to have reached the age of= reason. =E2=80=A0 G. B. Morgagni, De sedibus, et causis morborum, etc., Vol XII.=20 =E2=80=A1 J. E. Greding, Adversaria medica practica.=20 =C2=A7 J. G. G=C3=BCnz, Prolusio capillos glandulae pinealis in quinque men= te alienatis proponit, Lipsiae, 1753. =E2=80=93=E2=80=93=E2=80=93=E2=80=93=E2=80=93=E2=80=93=E2=80=93=E2=80=93=E2= =80=93=E2=80=93 Page 620 exists. And if the term plexus, in this application, does not represent to = the Western mind the idea conveyed by the term of the anatomist, then call = them Chakras or Padmas, or the Wheels, the Lotus Hearts and Petals. Remembe= r that Physiology, imperfect as it is, shows septenary groups all over the = exterior and interior of the body; the seven head orifices, the seven =E2= =80=9Corgans=E2=80=9D at the base of the brain, the seven plexuses (the pha= ryngeal, laryngeal, cavernous, cardiac, epigastric, prostatic, and the sacr= al plexus), etc., etc. When the time comes, the members of the E.S.T. will be given the minute det= ails about the Master Chakras and taught to use them; till then, less diffi= cult subjects have to be learned. If asked whether the seven plexuses, or T= attvic centres of action, are the centres where the seven rays of the Logos= vibrate, I answer in the affirmative, simply remarking that the rays of th= e Logos vibrate in every atom, for the matter of that." http://www.tonh.net/theosofie/hpb_cw_online/articles/v12/y1890_055.htm A comment: In H. P. Blavatsky's Esoteric Section papers in the latest link we find a t= able, which uses colours and make them correspond to various parts of the b= ody and the Nafs. Interestingly Blavatsky at that page also refer to a seri= es of articles by Rama Prasad published in the Theosophist magazine, which = is teaching a part of the Gupta-Vidya. These vital articles is not availabl= e on any theosophical website from any of the major Theosophical groups. I = can only wonder why?=20 Rama Prasad later published a work about the same issues, but not a copy of= the articles. (Natures Finer forces by Rama Prasad, - http://www.rexresea= rch.com/prana/essays.htm and The later edition - http://www.hermetics.org/p= rasad.html ) http://www.tonh.net/theosofie/hpb_cw_online/articles/v12/y1890_055.htm Did this help? M. Sufilight ----- Original Message -----=20 From: christinaleestemaker=20 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com=20 Sent: Saturday, March 01, 2008 2:41 PM Subject: Theos-World Re: Definition of the 7 Rays It is not from Alice Bailey, she mentioned different names and you=20 are right, HPB did not mentioned rays and names from Masters, but she=20 gives good sight on te working aspects.Most of all to be read in SDIII Geoffrey Hudson wrote about the names in his Light of the Sanctuary. By the way, the question was in Theosophical philosophy and not only=20 from the HPB writings.Theosophy does not end or start with only HPB,=20 although she gives great masterwork in her way. Christina --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Martin wrote: > > Erhmm, you mean its from Alice Bailey's Theosophy, > which is quite different than Blavatsky's...I never > read a written thing by HPB telling on what ray's some > adepts are..I also don't think its helpfull for anyone > to know...One thing IS important though: the soul > works on ALL rays, since the (Atmic) soul knows > all...and after all its the soul which is important , > not the personalities embodying her. Personalities are > just temporary appearances..so here my 2 dollars > worth.=20 >=20 >=20 > --- christinaleestemaker > wrote: >=20 > > Hi Fred, maybe I can help you with the following . > > Maha Choha, till this moment I cannot find his rule > > for one ray=20 > > especially.I think he is working on all rays. > >=20 > > Here follows : > >=20 > > Master the prince Rakoczy is a great Lord of Fohat > > or cosmic electric=20 > > fire and head of the seventh ray.The Master is also > > of course, a very=20 > > wonderful superhuman Being highly developed in > > every aspect of human=20 > > nature, a glorious, perfected man, a very high > > Adept. > > Other aspects are therefore fully and perfectly > > developed and=20 > > expressed in him.He deals with creative forces of > > the Solar system=20 > > and planet.He is also a great Lord of Wisdom and > > Love and an=20 > > embodiment of the Cosmic Will.He is also a Master, > > an Adept who takes=20 > > pupils.Ray seven and the first are associated with > > each other.Some=20 > > information gives master St Germain for this ray. > >=20 > > Master of the first ray is Master Morya.Also the > > rays are=20 > > corresponding into colors, crystals,sounds, angels > > and chakras,=20 > > planets and days of the week and social functions. > > Not that the first ray is corresponding to the first > > chakra, it is=20 > > not .It is to the vicuddha or fifth troath chakra > > with planets mars=20 > > and jupiter and the day tuesday and do=3DC crystal > > and angel Michael. > >=20 > > Master Koot Hoomi is one of the second ray, a ray of > > Wisdom and Love=20 > > corresponding to sahasrara or seventh, crown chakra > > and sunday and of=20 > > course star Sun.and sound re=3DD sapphire and angel > > Gabri=C3=ABl. > >=20 > > Master of the third Ray is Paul the Venetian > > anahata=3D fourth,heartchakra and associated with > > wednesday sound=20 > > mi=3DE emerald and angel Rafa=C3=ABl. > > Specialized in to be aware and viveka or ability of > > distinction. > > This three aspects of 1.2 and 3 ray are directly > > from the=20 > > willpower,love-wisdom and ability of distinction. > >=20 > > Ray 4,5 and 6 are resp from Harmony,Knowledge and > > Devotion > >=20 > > Masters are Serapis Bey,Hilarion and Lord Maitreya > > Jezus,=20 > >=20 > > 4 Ray=3Dsound fa=3DF muladhara=3D first rootchakra , > > saturday, planet=20 > > earth. > >=20 > > 5 Ray sound sol=3DG anja,sixth foreheadchakra , > > monday ,planet=20 > > saturnus. > >=20 > > 6 Ray sound la=3DA manipura, solar plex=20 > > thirdchakra, thursday,=20 > > planet Venus and Mercurius. > >=20 > >=20 > > 7 Ray sound si=3DB(es) second chakra, swadhistana or=20 > > spleenchakra.planet moon and friday. > >=20 > > Hope I give you some info from my literature from > > several books and=20 > > lectures in Theosophy.=20 > >=20 > > Christina > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "fsgonzales1" > > =20 > > wrote: > > > > > > I would like to ask other people who are > > interested in Theosophy=20 > > to > > > share their views on what are the characteristics > > of each of the=20 > > Seven > > > Rays. > > > And also what Ray is the Mahachohan=C2=B4s ? He is > > said to be in the=20 > > 7th, > > > 4th or 3rd Ray. Is the Mahachohan the Venetian > > Master or another=20 > > one? > > > Frederico > > > > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 __________________________________________________________ > Be a better friend, newshound, and=20 > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http:// mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=3DAhu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ > =20=20=20 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From global-theosophy@stofanet.dk Sat Mar 01 11:00:57 2008 Return-Path: X-Sender: global-theosophy@stofanet.dk X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 25519 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 19:00:57 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.96) by m52.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 19:00:57 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO mx02.stofanet.dk) (212.10.10.12) by mta17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 19:00:56 -0000 X-Received: from 56341115.rev.stofanet.dk ([86.52.17.21] helo=khidr) by mx02.stofanet.dk (envelope-from ) with smtp id 1JVWwy-0005oQ-1X for theos-talk@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 01 Mar 2008 20:00:52 +0100 Message-ID: <059401c87bce$c8111020$15113456@khidr> To: Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 20:02:21 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Originating-IP: 212.10.10.12 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0:0:0 From: "Morten Nymann Olesen" Subject: The Book of Discipline in the Schools of Dzyan X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=206055933; y=L2lhL-ZSKmY6RONDylDN4UgRysNzoVwkfWuN0V6CZsTW X-Yahoo-Profile: kidhr7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43176 To all readers My views are: Just a few words I find to be important to email.... STRICTLY PRIVATE AND CONFIDENTIAL NOT THE PROPERTY OF ANY MEMBER, AND TO BE RETURNED ON DEMAND TO THE AGENT OF THE HEAD OF THE E.S.T. INSTRUCTION NO. III "For, as saith the Book of Discipline in the Schools of Dzyan: "Speak not the mysteries to the common vulgar, nor to the casual friend, or new disciple. With prudent eye to the possible consequences, keep locked within your breast the teachings received, until you find a listener who will understand your words and sympathize with your aspirations." This does not mean that you are at liberty to repeat what you have learned to anyone whom you believe to answer that description, but that you can exchange views with your co-disciples who are pledged as you are yourself. I can do no better, I believe, than give at once some of the oral and written precepts from the same book above mentioned, and as pointed out by the Master. "1. To the earnest Disciple his Teacher takes the place of Father and Mother. For, whereas they give him his body and its faculties, its life and casual form, the Teacher shows him how to develop the inner faculties to the acquisition of the Eternal Wisdom. "2. To the Disciple each Fellow-Disciple becomes a Brother and Sister, a portion of himself.* For his interests and aspirations are theirs his progress helped or hindered by their intelligence, morality, and behavior through the intimacy brought about by their co-discipleship. "3. A co-disciple cannot backslide or fall out of the line without affecting those who stand firm through the sympathetic tie between themselves and the psychical currents between them and their Teacher. "4. Woe to the deserter, woe also to all who help to bring his soul to the point where desertion first presents itself before his mind's eye as the lesser of two evils. Gold in the crucible is he who stands the melting heat of trial, and lets only the dross be burnt out of his heart; accursed by Karmic action will find himself he, who throws dross into the melting-pot of discipleship for the debasement of his fellow-pupil. As the members to the body, so are the disciples to each other, and to the Head and Heart which teach and nourish them with the life stream of Truth. "5. As the limbs defend the head and heart of the body they belong to, so have the disciples to defend the head and the heart of the body they belong to [in this case Theosophy] from injury." Before I proceed, let me explain, for fear of being misunderstood again, that by "Teacher" I neither mean myself--as I am but the humble mouthpiece of the true Teacher--nor do I write the above in order to stimulate any one to defend or stand by my own personality, but verily to make it clear, once for all, that to defend the E.S. and Theosophy ---------- * "So shalt thou be in full accord with all that lives, bear love to men as though they were thy brother-pupils, disciples of one Teacher, the sons of one sweet mother." (Vide Fragment III in The Voice of the Silence, p. 49.) ---------- Page 591 (the heart and the soul of the T.S., its visible body) is the duty of every good Theosophist, of the E.S. especially. So is it his "bounden duty" to protect from attack and defend every fellow-brother, if he knows him to be innocent, and try and help him morally, if he thinks he is guilty. Nor is verse 5 intended to convey the idea that aggressiveness is the best course to take, for it is not: passive resistance and a firm refusal to listen to any slanderous reports about one another, in the case of a member as well as of a stranger or an ex-Fellow, is all that would be necessary in some cases to defeat entirely conspiracy and malevolence."....... And the text continues with more info. M. Sufilight [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From silva_cass@yahoo.com Sat Mar 01 15:26:33 2008 Return-Path: X-Sender: silva_cass@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 31064 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 23:26:31 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.96) by m46.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 23:26:31 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO web52108.mail.re2.yahoo.com) (206.190.48.111) by mta17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 23:26:30 -0000 X-Received: (qmail 6873 invoked by uid 60001); 1 Mar 2008 23:26:30 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: m66WXwIVM1nb9xFd4jBBa8F9gpZrUbOvmGTbaBNPiGHIk4mifFe4ENRQkt1WzODIOyCeESU92qWJtO2onch2g8bqcVDxwXItpySftFyBCpM3oP8LzutD6kGyziDhB77Rd1nnBq84blxAMwLF_JyMupMlIOaQqYU68nIY X-Received: from [58.107.40.201] by web52108.mail.re2.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 01 Mar 2008 15:26:30 PST Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 15:26:30 -0800 (PST) To: Theosophy MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <444120.6691.qm@web52108.mail.re2.yahoo.com> X-Originating-IP: 206.190.48.111 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 2:4:8:0:0 From: Cass Silva Subject: Who was Frank Bardon X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=203519531; y=lJ2PjFAxMXVkYomMsGv3z05LzfpsOvzIxWk5XncHFgqtk0cQfw X-Yahoo-Profile: silva_cass Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43177 Anyone heard of him? Cass =20=20=20 Who Was Franz Bardon?=20 http://www.crow- caw.com Franz Bardon is one of the most important but least known occultists and = magicians of the Twentieth Century. He is mainly known through four books h= e wrote which were published in the 1950's. Many have borrowed his techniqu= es and terminology without giving him proper credit, sometimes unknowingly,= but not always. I recommended his book "Initiation Into Hermetics" to a pe= rson who had studied occultism for some years. He was stunned to find that = a teacher of his in the past had distributed Bardon's materials pretending = he had written them himself.=20 Bardon was unusual in that he stressed practice and practicality above al= l else. Although his books contained lengthy theoretical sections, his emph= asis was on the tangible, usable results of magickal training. His stated p= urpose was to give the serious student of magick the most complete and best= possible magickal instruction obtainable outside of an occult lodge and wi= thout the benefit of a personal teacher. Did he succeed? The only way to ju= dge is by trying his curriculum yourself.=20 Bardon's Life and Work Bardon did not appear to be trying to create a legend about himself. The on= ly self-references in his works are occasional attestations that he had him= self tried this of that experiment or ritual. I can't resist comparing this= to a much more famous magician of this century who wrote voluminously abou= t his own life and adventures, and had no qualms about glorifying himself i= n so doing=20 According to his student and close friend Otti Votavova, Franz Bardon was= the oldest of 13 children, and the only son of a very devout Christian mys= tic, Viktor Bardon. Although he had achieved a certain amount of spiritual = advancement, Viktor felt that he was unable to obtain any advanced initiati= on, and prayed that he receive this blessing. The story is that an advanced= soul entered the body of his son Franz to become Viktor's initiator.=20 In later life, Bardon became a stage magician who gained some fame in Ger= many in the 1920's and 1930's under the stage name "Frabato".=20 As Adolf Hitler and his Nazi party ascended to power in the 1930's variou= s groups such as the O.T.O.[ Ordo Templi Orientis ] and the Freemasons were= banned and some of their members arrested. Otti Votavova avers that Hitler= belonged to the legendary "FOCG" or "99 Lodge" of black magick, described = in Frabato The Magician and Fire And Ice (see the bibliography) . Apart fro= m this, Hitler and some of his intimate friends were supposed to be members= of the "Thule Order," which was the external instrument of a group of powe= rful Tibetan black magicians (these dark Tibetans are mentioned in some ess= ays posted at www.educate- yourself. org by ZS Livingstone and referred to = as "Yellow Hats"...Ken Adachi) Arrest & Imprisonment by the 3rd Reich=20 Through the negligence of one of Bardon's disciples (who had not destroyed = their correspondence as Bardon had ordered) the Nazis arrested and imprison= ed them both in late 1941 or early 1942. While the prisoners were being whi= pped, the disciple lost his control and uttered a Qabalistic formula to imm= obilize the torturers. However, the effects of the formula were eventually = canceled and the disciple was shot as revenge. Adolf Hitler offered Bardon = high positions in the Third Reich under the condition that he help win the = war with his magick. Bardon was further expected to reveal to Hitler the ad= dress of the other 98 of the 99 Lodges spread all over the world. When he r= efused to help, the Nazis cruelly tortured him. Among other things, they pe= rformed operations on Bardon without anesthesia, and forged iron rings arou= nd his ankles and fixed heavy iron balls to them.=20 After the war Bardon found, with the help of his magick abilities, that H= itler had escaped abroad. For fear of recognition, Hitler had undergone sev= eral of surgical operations on his face.=20 [Note from Ken Adachi: This is NO doubt that Hitler did not commit suic= ide in the Berlin bunker in 1945. The burned bodies found outside of the bu= nker by Russian troops were not those of Alolf Hitler and Eva Braun. Both h= ad escaped and eventually wound up in America. Arizona Wilder reports in he= r 1999 video interview with David Icke, Revelations of a Mother Goddess, th= at she saw Hitler and Eva Braun in 1969 in the underground base below China= Lake Naval station in southern California. Cisco Wheeler told me in a tele= phone conversation in November of 2004 that her father (a high level Illumi= nati mind control programmer) had a long and close association with both Dr= . Josep Mengele (known as "Dr. Green" to Arizona Wilder) and Adolf Hitler h= ere in America after the Second World War. Hitler apparently lived for many= years in Oregon. Cisco was given a folder by her father, when he was on hi= s deathbed, that included a photograph of her father, Mengele, and Hitler p= osing together in the Oregon house where Hitler had lived. ] Dieter Ruggeberg (publisher of Bardon's books) makes this comment on the = above statements: "So much for Otti Votavova's recital of facts.In the year= s of my acquaintance with her I was able to convince myself of her love of = truth."=20 After regaining his freedom, Bardon recommenced his occult work and heali= ng. It was apparently this last work that got him in trouble with the Czech= authorities. They strongly discouraged this type of thing in the very repr= essive political climate of postwar Czechoslovakia.=20 Arrest and Death Regarding Bardon's last years, Ruggeberg wrote to me as follows: "The profe= ssion of Bardon was natural healer. He was able to cure cancer until the 2n= d degree, without steel and rays, only with his own medicine made from plan= ts and treated with alchemical means. For this reason the doctors of the of= ficial medicine became very jealous, because they could not reach such succ= ess with their chemical and nuclear treatments. After the publication of hi= s books in 1956, a number of people came from Germany to visit him. The doc= tors took this opportunity to accuse Bardon to be a spy from the West, and = that was the reason he was arrested in 1958 in Opava, Czechoslovakia. " by = Russian Communist ideologies, thus they persecuted free-thinkers, Gypsies, = Jews, Freemasons and anyone interested in the occult or esoteric subjects.= =20 Bardon died July 10th, 1958. What connection, if any, his death had with = the arrest I have been unable to determine. If he was a professional stage = magician in Germany in the 1920's and 1930's, we could assume that he was b= orn roughly around the turn of the century, and thus would not have been ve= ry old at his death.=20 The Fraternity of Saturn Bardon stoutly maintained that he was not a member of, nor under any obliga= tions to a magickal lodge or order. However, some sources indicate that he = was actually a member of the Fraternity of Saturn, an important occult lodg= e which flourished in Germany in the early part of the 20th Century. During= the ascent of the Nazi party, they closed or persecuted all Masonic, relig= ious and occult organizations. They closed and banned the Fraternity of Sat= urn Lodge sometime between 1933 and 1937, but it was revived in 1950.=20 I have not yet been able to positively identify Bardon as a member of the= Fraternity of Saturn. While recognizing the power and validity of sex magi= ck, Bardon emphatically discourages the student from dabbling in it until h= e understands its full implications.=20 Franz Bardon's Writings Each book follows a roughly similar pattern: a mainly theoretical expositio= n followed by practical instruction. Reading and understanding them is a ch= allenge, as they have been translated from German-and possibly from Czechos= lovakian before that-into non-idiomatic English.=20 Translational difficulties aside, one thing that makes an enduring impres= sion is Bardon's evident sincerity. He insists frequently that he is doing = as much as possible to transmit a system of occult development to the serio= us student who is either unable to find a teacher or work in a group. In li= ne with this, he also frequently reiterates that he has personally performe= d such and such an experiment, ritual or procedure.=20 His Sources Before describing some of Bardon's theories, it is good to keep in mind tha= t many of the words he uses have different meanings in a mundane context an= d even in other occult systems. Impregnation, fluid, condenser, sphere - al= l have special meanings.=20 For instance, Bardon appears to have originated the concept of the so-cal= led "fluid condenser." "Fluids" are magickal qualities, not fluids as we un= derstand them in daily life, and are divided into "electric" and "magnetic"= types. A "condenser" is a magick wand, mirror, or other device the magicia= n crafts to "condense", or concentrate, these fluids. An example of prepari= ng a fluid condenser is given later in this article.=20 Many of his occult ideas can be traced to earlier works, such as Eliphas = Levi and Barrett's The Magus. Bardon also seems to have been familiar with = Tibetan occultism, or at any rate the works of Alexandria David-Neel, whom = he cites now and then, and from whom he does a fair amount of borrowing. He= mentions, for example, kylichors (magickal diagrams), and tum-mo (the abil= ity of Tibetan adepts to stay warm in freezing weather). The mental exercis= es Bardon prescribes, such as one-pointedness, watching the roaming of cons= ciousness and so on, are commonplace in yogic and other occult works.=20 Although Bardon does not mention Crowley or any of his writings, "The Bea= st's" influence is present. Compare Crowley's famous dictum: "Love is the l= aw, love under will" to Bardon's: "Love is the law, but love under a strong= will."=20 Bardon's Theories:=20 The Magickal Universe Bardon postulates an energetic model of the universe = modified from Far Eastern theories, including Taoism and Hindu cosmology. H= is "electric" and "magnetic" fluids compliment each other in the same way t= hat Yin and Yang do. These are clearly not the physicist's forces by the sa= me names, but there is a certain analogy between them. "Magnetism" is a coo= l, negative force with a blue emanation; and "electricity" is a warm, posit= ive force with a red emanation.=20 In Initiation Into Hermetics Bardon refers once to the "OR" and "OB" forc= es. My guess is that these might represent the "Red"(OR =3D "Odyle Rot") an= d "Blue" (Odyle Blau") or electric and magnetic fluids. Or perhaps they are= adaptations of the OD and OB forces described in Eliphas Levi's Transcende= ntal Magic. Whatever the scientific validity of this approach, it is certai= nly rich with suggestive possibilities.=20 Bardon's "od" or "odyle" energy, which Baron Karl von Reichenbach origina= lly developed in the mid-1800's. The negative pole of a magnet, he claimed,= appeared blue to persons with high psychic sensitivity and induced a feeli= ng of coldness. The positive pole appeared red and had the property of warm= th. He elaborated this theory into a highly complex system of occult anatom= y and mysticism. Bardon usually called od "vital power" ["lebenskraft" ], b= ut once or twice reverts to the term "od."=20 Bardon teaches that each part of the body is governed by either the elect= ric or the magnetic force, or it may be neutral. Disease is caused by parts= being out of balance.=20 The Four Elements Bardon made use of the ancient four elements - Fire, Earth, Air and Water -= plus Akasha, or Quintessence. His attributions of the elements are essenti= ally the same as those in other systems and books.: Water for emotions, int= uition; Fire for aggressiveness, passion, etc. In his view, the skillful ma= gician was one who could manipulate the Elements to achieve desired effects= . Of course, before the student could become master of the Elements, he had= to harmonize and control the manifestations of all Elements in his own bei= ng.=20 Bardon taught that man was superior to all spirits, demons and angels in = that only man was a "four-pole" being - that is, combining the energies of = all the Elements . For instance, gnomes are strictly creatures of Earth, sy= lphs of Air and so forth. He cautioned the student to beware of tricks and = deceptions on the parts of these creatures, who wished to capture a part of= the human's soul.=20 In Bardon's words: "Any deliberate cause, may be such as a wish, a though= t or any imagination created in this sphere together with the dynamic conce= ntration of willpower, unshaken faith and fullest conviction is bound to be= realized with the help of the elements... . "Consciousness knows neither t= ime nor space, and is therefore an akasha principle. He also instructs the = student to re-dissolve the akasha into the universe rather than keep it acc= umulated. In other words, the "magickal" frame of mind should not be the sa= me as the everyday one.=20 Preparation of the Student A pillar of Bardon's method is the point that the magician must be balanced= in the Elements that make up his own being. A student with an excess or la= ck of any Element could not achieve great success, no matter how much work = he does. An analogy would be an auto engine: no matter how much fuel you fe= ed to it, it can only generate so much if it is not properly tuned and bala= nced. After a point, the engine will either wear out quickly or fail if you= attempt to make it perform beyond its limits. The difference with humans i= s that our limits are self-imposed.=20 Bardon also insists on the point that the student begin at the beginning = and not skip any section of his training. The student must completely maste= r each step before proceeding on to the next. Again, the analogy to other e= ndeavors is clear. If magick is a skill like flying, then the student canno= t neglect the study of airplanes, weather, safety, avionics and so forth, w= ithout serious difficulties in the future.=20 Finally, as many teachers say, the student must keep a complete and accur= ate record. Without this, it is hard to repeat successes and avoid repeatin= g mistakes.=20 Outline of Bardon's Magickal Curriculum=20 Although Bardon divides his praxis into ten steps, these are somewhat arbit= rary. Here is a summary of his main points:=20 1. Self-Analysis & Basic Exercises=20 As mentioned above, the student must work diligently on understanding and h= armonizing the four Elements within his own being before doing any further = occult work. Bardon prescribes several weeks of minute, mercilessly honest = self-observation and recording of one's faults and failings. The student cl= assifies each under the four Elemental categories to see which Elements are= out of balance in his Self. A similar exercise classifies his virtues and = strengths. Since the magician is to have control over all the Elemental worlds, he must not = be unbalanced or have any obsessions that would impede his effectiveness, o= r allow weak spots that could cause his undoing.=20 2. Intermediate Concentration & Breathing=20 In the next step, the student strengthens his ability to concentrate and pe= rforms breathing exercises and the techniques of autosuggestion. Bardon reg= ards these as the secret key to the subconscious. Bardon distinguishes care= fully between two kinds of breathing: Pulmonary (normal) and through the sk= in. This second type of breathing takes practice. The body can respire auto= matically, but the student needs to learn to control it, combine it with vo= luntary pulmonary breathing and selectively inspire the various Elements an= d Akasha.=20 3. Advanced Visualization Exercises & Element Manipulation=20 This step entails intense concentration on and visualization of increasin= gly more complex objects, and "inhaling" the Elements into the body. The st= udent also learns the "loading," or charging, of talismans, rooms, or objec= ts for protection, healing, or other purposes.=20 4. Accumulation of Elements & Rituals=20 In this part of the training the student, works to perfect the balancing = and concentrating of Elementary energies in the students own and other pers= ons's bodies. In Bardon's system, "rituals" are mot what we normally think = of as such, but rather mnemonics based on hand gestures, verbal formulas or= visual keys. He claims that once you understand the energies properly, can= recall an energy or situation with merely a surreptitious hand gesture, a = silent formula or a combination thereof.=20 5. Transplanting Consciousness & Levitation=20 This step consists of a graduated series of exercises to prepare the stud= ent for physical and astral levitation and astral travel, as a prelude to c= ommunication with astral beings. Communication with the astral world can ei= ther be active or passive. Passive techniques are simpler and safer, thus B= ardon presents them first.=20 6. Introduction to Astral Beings & Astral Travel=20 Besides astral beings and travel, this chapter deals with the creation of= non-physical beings for the magician's use. Bardon also discusses the peri= ls of accidentally creating them. This inadvertent creation of phantasms wh= ich can attach to and parasitize the operator is a great danger for the dab= bler in occultism. At this point, Bardon again insists that the student not= skip any step in his development, in order to avoid this serious problem.= =20 7. Development of Clairvoyance, Clairaudience & Other Abilities: Creation o= f Elementaries=20 Bardon gives formulas for accessories such as special eye-baths and ear-p= lugs to aid in development of supersensory perception. He also discusses ma= gick animation of pictures and statues.=20 8. "Fluid Condensers"=20 These are special tools which the magician creates to concentrate, store,= and manipulate the electric and magnetic fluids. He gives fairly detailed = instructions for making, charging and using these "condensers. " First, Bar= don teaches that even minute quantities gold can add enormously to the accu= mulative power of any condenser. Thus, he recommends preparing a gold tinct= ure to "charge" any condensers the student makes. The easiest way is to dis= solve a gram of soluble gold chloride in 20 grams of distilled water. (Gold= chloride is fairly expensive - about $50 per gram.) Here is an interesting= example of Bardon's condensers: Put a handful of fresh or dry chamomile fl= owers into a pot. Pour enough cold water over them to cover them completely= . Let the chamomile flowers boil for about 20 minutes. Cool them, but leave= the lid on the pot and strain the decoction. Put this on the fire again an= d allow it to evaporate slowly until it weighs about 50 grams. A few drops = more or less do not matter at all. Let the extract cool and, for better preservation, m= ix it with the same quantity (in this case 50 grams) of spirit or alcohol. = (Remember to never use methyl or wood alcohol in any preparation meant to b= e used in or on the body.) To this mixture add about 10 drops of the gold t= incture prepared above.=20 Bardon continues:=20 If you wish to use the condenser for your own purposes, you may still stren= gthen it, by adding a drop of your blood or sperm, if possible both togethe= r, on a swab of cotton wool, throw this afterwards without any scruples int= o the condenser and shake the lot well. Then, pour all, in a funnel, throug= h filter paper or linen into a small bottle and keep it well corked in a co= ol and dark place, ready to use. The magician can use these condensers in m= any ways: mixing them with liquids to drink, for anointing, mixing them wit= h incense compounds, or pouring them in small bowls to collect and concentr= ate certain energies. Any fluid condenser which has been prepared in this m= anner does not lose its efficiency even after many years. The condenser mus= t be well shaken each time you are going to use it, the bottle is to be cor= ked again after withdrawing some out of it. In the same way you can prepare= several universal condensers from Russian or genuine Chinese tea, from lil= y-blossoms- best are the white ones-popular leaves, alraune roots or mandragora roots,= arnica montana, acacia flowers. Any simple fluid condenser, prepared from = one plant is sufficient for normal use such as influencing through the elem= ents, or developing the astral senses by means of the fluid condensers.=20 9. Magick Mirrors for Astral Travel & Healing=20 The magick mirror (of which the crystal ball is a species) is valuable for = many experiments in clairvoyance, clairaudience and the like. After a brief= description, Bardon lists many ways the magician can use it. He describes = treatment of the sick using electro-magnetic fluids and the magickal loadin= g of talismans, amulets and gems.=20 10. Elevation of the Spirit to Higher Levels=20 This chapter discusses the various ways the student should improve his sp= iritual qualities. Bardon wraps up with a discussion of several occult topi= cs such as exteriorization, levitation, production of natural phenomena, su= ggestion, hypnosis, psychometry and long distance impregnation of rooms. An= amazing book on Communicating with Spirits Bardon's second published work,= The Practice of Magical Evocation, is a remarkable and unique work of near= ly 500 pages. The first of its two parts is an exhaustive description of th= e many tools and apparatus the magician needs to work. The topics he treats= include: The Magick Circle, Triangle, Censer, Mirror, Lamp, Wand, Sword, D= agger, Trident, Crown, Cap and Magus-Band. This book is much more ceremonia= lly oriented than the first, which requires a minimum of apparatus. The Pra= ctice of Magical Evocation is a classic magickal grimoire, or instruction m= anual - probably one of the best ever written.=20 The second part of of the book is a huge catalog of spirits or entities t= hat the student is supposed to be able to contact after perfecting the tech= niques in the first book. A short paragraph accompanies most of the entries= explaining the the specialty or purpose of the being and what skills, know= ledge or advantage it can bring the occult practitioner. Bardon states seve= ral times that he has contacted all these entities himself and is writing w= hat he knows in the first person. In fact, he says there are many more enti= ties he has omitted, because of their unsuitability for beginners. The names of these spirits are quite interesting. A few of them are the s= ame as the corresponding names in the "classical" magickal tradition. His "= 72 spirits of the Mercury sphere" are exactly the 72 angels of the Schem-ha= -mephorash. Some of them are oddly changed. For instance, "osrail" is clear= ly the same as "Azrael," and Opollogon" appears to correspond to "Apollyon.= " These spirits are described in Barrett's The Magus, among other books. Th= e changes in spelling may be due to the fact that Bardon originally wrote i= n Czechoslovakian or German. However, most of his other spirits I have been= unable to trace. For instance, here are some of the spirits of the Mars sp= here, none of which I can locate in other references: Rarum, Gibsir, Rahol,= and Adica. These names may be from an obscure medieval grimoire, have diff= erent meanings in Czechoslovakian, or have some relation to his own Qabalis= tic system - but so far I have been unable to make such a connection.=20 Bardon's Unique Qabalistic System After the second book, the coherence and organization of Bardon's work dete= riorates noticeably. His third published work was The Key to the True Qabal= ah. His Qabalistic system depends on the sounds of the various letters of t= he alphabet. It's not clear that this was exhaustively thought out, since t= here are many alphabets in use (even among Western languages). Hebrew, Cyri= llic and Arabic all have different alphabets, and some (Chinese) have no al= phabet at all. He uses his Qabala somewhat differently than other occultist= s: he connects Qabalistic formulae to various processes (e.g., a vibration = consisting of the sounds "KTM" is a formula to load a room for protections,= "AAQ" is used for remote healing, etc.).=20 Bardon also uses his Qabalah as sort of shorthand: once the occultist has= made contact with some planetary intelligence, for instance, he can re-con= tact the intelligence by using its "phone number" for simplicity.=20 Later Books of Rough Quality It is clear that after the first two books, much less time or assistance wa= s available for Bardon to get his work in print. Perhaps he was incarcerate= d or dead and unable to to help with the editing. In any case, Bardon's pro= duction after this point declined rapidly. The next book was Frabato the Ma= gician for which Bardon only had notes. In the English edition, the publish= er added extensive notes to indicate that the book (and appended material) = is, in essence, Bardon's unedited notes. However, this is an intriguing occ= ult novel somewhat along the lines of those of Dion Fortune.=20 Franz Bardon Today A few years ago, an enthusiastic student started the "Franz Bardon Foundati= on" in Denver, Colorado. He showed his devotion to the "Magus Guru", as he = called Bardon, by changing his name to "Jim Bardon." For a time, I subscrib= ed to this newsletter, which was 4 or 8 pages and issued a few time a year.= The newsletter was, I am sure, a sincere effort and often had interesting = and useful ideas. Unfortunately, it also included much peripheral material = that seemed to have no direct connection with Bardon's works. Each issue re= peated much of the same information about: Jim Bardon's" predictions of maj= or recessions and at least one world war between 1989 and 2005. I'm not sur= e if the recent Persian Gulf war would qualify. There is nothing in Franz B= ardon's own writings that would support these theories. Furthermore, Jim Ba= rdon, in his bulletins also advertised his own publications, astrological s= ervice and hermetic training.=20 I lost contact with him when he raised the yearly subscription for his ne= wsletter from $25.00 to $50.00 - in order, he said, to separate the sincere= from the frivolous. Apparently Mr. Bardon's Foundation is still in existen= ce. A classified ad in a recent issue of Llewellyn's New Times gives a phon= e number for it in Seattle, Washington.=20 (See also: Dieter R=FCggebergs comment on Jim Milligan's "Franz Bardon Fo= undation" in the U.S.A.)=20 Summary of Franz Bardon and Editorial Perhaps it is unfair to make such comparisons, but it is interesting to con= trast Franz Bardon's works with those of the of the other great magickal te= acher of the century, Aleister Crowley. Although when the spirit moved him,= Crowley could be intensely disciplined, kind and helpful to his students a= nd magnanimous, he also enjoyed a life filled with sex, drugs, alcohol and = bon vivant - all of which are integral parts of his magickal philosophy. Cr= owley was continually heaping praise on himself, excoriating those he felt = were beneath him, discarding students as unworthy, and continuously justify= ing his behavior. He praised strength and sneered at weakness. Crowley's wr= iting are full of literary practical jokes, insults to the reader's intelli= gence, and deliberate deceptions.=20 Bardon represented almost everything that Crowley was not. He appeared to= be patient, devout, non-judgmental and earnest. He insisted that only thro= ugh balance and purging of excesses could one achieve success in magick. An= d (though this probably reflects my personal biases), it seems that Bardon'= s reticence and cautionary tone concerning sexual magick is a much more rea= sonable attitude than Crowley's, especially for beginners.=20 Certainly not one occultist in a thousand has made good use of sex magick= , whereas an unfortunately large number have become obsessed, or worse. How= many people have you heard of who have improved themselves through sex mag= ick? But it's certainly a heck of a lot more fun than the drudgery of disci= pline. Similar observations apply to students whose magickal work revolves = around the use of intoxicants and narcotics.=20 I feel that Bardon does deliver what he promises: detailed magickal instr= uction for the diligent and serious student who, for whatever reason, canno= t or will not attach to a magickal order or group. It is sometimes a challe= nge to penetrate the mediocre translations of his works, but with supplemen= tary magickal study things do become clear.=20 =20=20 ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- = --------- ----- Bibliography Works by Franz Bardon=20 Der Weg zum Wahren Adepten (1st ed. 1956).=20 Die Praxis der Magischen Evokation (1st ed. 1956).=20 Der Schluessel zur Wahren Qabalah (1st ed. 1957).=20 Frabato: Ein Okkulter Roman (1st ed. 1979).=20 Initiation into Hermetics (1st English ed. 1962).=20 The Practice of Magical Evocation (1st English ed. 1967).=20 The Key to the True Qabalah (1st English ed. 1971). The formulas mentioned = above, to immobilize one's enemies, are in this book under the headings "E-= M" and "E-N."=20 Frabato the Magician (1st English ed. 1971). This is an "occult novel" whic= h Bardon's student and friend Otti Votavova claimed was based on true event= s. This edition also contains fragments from a work that Bardon was never a= ble to complete. Published under the title "the Golden Book of Wisdom" and = an unpublished tract titled "High Magic."=20 Other Related Works=20 The dates given after the titles are the years of first English publication= . Most of the works listed below have been reprinted in various formats, so= me many times.=20 Barret, Francis, The Magus, London (1801), offers information on "classic= al" demonology.=20 Blatter fur Lebenskunst, August 1956, p.3.=20 Cavendish, Richard, ed., Man, Myth and Magic (1970). See articles on "Magnetism" and "Double" for information on Baron Von Reich= enbach' s theories.=20 David-Neel, Alexandra, Magic and Mystery in Tibet (1931) and Initiation and= Initiates in Tibet (1932). Bardon refers to these in a few places.=20 Flowers, S. Edred (pseud. of S. Edred Thorsson), The Fraternity of Saturn (= 1990). This is surprisingly good. It is well documented and relatively sane= . Of course, in order to sell the books, it emphasizes the sexual magick as= pect of the Fraternity of Saturn.=20 Howe, Ellic, The Magicians of the Golden Dawn (1972). See p. 282, Note 1, o= n the banning of the Fraternity of Saturn.=20 King, Francis, Sexuality, Magic and Perversion: The Secret Rituals of the O= .T.O. (1973), The Magical World of Aleister Crowley (1977). Although long o= n sensationalism, King's works are usually reliable and relatively well-doc= umented.=20 Levi, Eliphas (pseud. of Alphonse Louis Constant, transl. by A.E.Waite), Tr= anscendental Magic (1896). This is an English edition of Dogme de la Haute = Magic (1855) and Rituel de la Haute Magic (1856).=20 Ruggeberg, Dieter, letter to the author, Oct 28, 1988. Herr Ruggeberg, the = longtime publisher of Bardon's books in English, wrote this in response to = a query for more information about Bardon's life.=20 von Reichenbach, Baron Karl, Physico-Physiologic al Researches on the Dynam= ics of Magnetism, (1850, 1851) and The Odic Force: Letters on Od and magnet= ism, (1926, reprinted 1968).=20 Wilson, Colin, The Occult (1971) offers information on von Reichenbach' s t= heories.=20 ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- = --------- ----- =A91991 by Tim Scott; tims@crow-caw. com and http://www.crow- caw.com (Ti= m Scotts homepage)=20 Reader Comments ----- Original Message -----=20 From: "Thomas Marny" To: Sent: Friday, August 05, 2005 1:11 PM Subject: Who Was Franz Bardon?=20 Frantisek Bardon's date of birth is Dec. 1st, 1909 in Opava, Czech Republ= ic, time of the birth is not known. =20=20=20 =20=20=20=20=20=20=20 --------------------------------- Looking for last minute shopping deals? 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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From bkolad@hotmail.com Sat Mar 01 15:53:49 2008 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 73278 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 23:53:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.67.97) by m53.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 23:53:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n32c.bullet.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.10) by mta18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 23:53:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.5] by n32.bullet.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 23:53:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.76] by t5.bullet.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2008 23:53:47 -0000 X-Sender: bkolad@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 52605 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2008 20:57:37 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.97) by m54.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2008 20:57:37 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO blu139-omc1-s21.blu139.hotmail.com) (65.55.175.161) by mta18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2008 20:57:36 -0000 X-Received: from BLU110-W24 ([65.55.162.181]) by blu139-omc1-s21.blu139.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Sat, 1 Mar 2008 12:50:10 -0800 Message-ID: To: Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 15:50:09 -0500 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <47C4841A.2010102@dnainternet.net> References: <546406.19409.qm@web52106.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <47C4841A.2010102@dnainternet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Mar 2008 20:50:10.0080 (UTC) FILETIME=[D6BDA200:01C87BDD] X-Originating-IP: 65.55.175.161 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0:0:0 From: kolad beth Subject: RE: Theos-World women in the LCC priesthood X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=211186001 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-system X-eGroups-Approved-By: eldonbtucker via web; 01 Mar 2008 23:53:46 -0000 X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43178 It probably is vice versa too. A man as man lacks receptive energy. Of cour= se the ideal is as in Jung or alchemy where both active and receptive, male= and female are in one body, the androgyne (though this has nothing to do w= ith sexuality at this point). ________________________________ > To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com > From: jokelap@dnainternet.net > Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 23:26:50 +0200 > Subject: Re: Theos-World women in the LCC priesthood >=20 >=20 > Laotse wrote in Tao Te Ching something like: >=20 > When being a man one becomes a woman but still stays > as man one becomes a channel of the Eternity. >=20 > Why wouldnt it be vice versa? >=20 > Maybe priests needs women or maybe it is just important > that those two energies meet each other in mass as well in > every day life. We still live in this cycle where we are sexually divided= . > One of the Mahatmas said that they recommended co-operation with women > though in their orders it was not allowed, but still they was in > connection and > co-operation with Madam. In Egypt they had lots of priestess. Aslo Subba = Row > has written about women avatars in his esoteic teachings. But in > buddhism they have > very little amount of nuns, as far as I know. >=20 > Anyway I belive that LCC brings out a good view of esoteric side of > christian > religion and stands therefore for reason in its own place. >=20 > PJ >=20 > kolad beth kirjoitti: >> >> >>>>From what I understand the men need the energy of the women in the >> group. ever wonder why the number of priests (in RC church) has >> diminished when the nuns started leaving the convents? >> ________________________________ >>> To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _________________________________________________________________ Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your Hotmail=AE-get yo= ur "fix". http://www.msnmobilefix.com/Default.aspx From silva_cass@yahoo.com Sat Mar 01 16:13:10 2008 Return-Path: X-Sender: silva_cass@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 3234 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2008 00:13:08 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.94) by m54.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2008 00:13:08 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO web52106.mail.re2.yahoo.com) (206.190.48.109) by mta15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2008 00:13:08 -0000 X-Received: (qmail 69876 invoked by uid 60001); 2 Mar 2008 00:13:07 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: XhAZ2b0VM1n2.WYV75L1linFvVj2POMG6t0ROgJGbFmkRlep2.3sfEtd9p4RLWmvijSeErdUA4z.P3QIHkHmz2Bu1C.tZTT6J3dOfd07Y5RpVDjoKWw- X-Received: from [58.107.40.201] by web52106.mail.re2.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 01 Mar 2008 16:13:07 PST Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 16:13:07 -0800 (PST) To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <03c401c87afd$ab383040$152ca8c0@captainp6d3981> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <874428.69501.qm@web52106.mail.re2.yahoo.com> X-Originating-IP: 206.190.48.109 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0:0:0 From: Cass Silva Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: The Coming Teacher? X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=203519531; y=6xjODa1gFJCRzdKmORPFzEMdyVzaP_4r8uHjPCNxvZZ2W9N3rQ X-Yahoo-Profile: silva_cass Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 43179 Thanks for your response Frank, I suppose we all have our favourites. I was never able to tweak with Judge, don't ask me why, nothing to do with what he had to say, just a personal difference. Purucker I enjoy, always have, and find he has the ability to transform difficult occult questions into relatively simplistic terms. Did Purucker actually state that he was in verbal contact with the Masters or was it more that he was inspired by them? I hope Books 3 and 4 are discovered before its too late for me to read them! Cass Frank Reitemeyer wrote: Cass wrote: Frank and Nigel I had another read of the article and it seems to me that 1975 was a big year in terms of KH contacts. These contacts justified the establishment of these fringe societies and demean the intelligence of a Master. Why would any Master be interested in sharing his initiations with anyone? This would be a strictly private matter and to be shared only with his closest adepts and chelas. As far as I am concerned there has been no direct contact from the masters since HPB left this plane. ----------------------- Cass, so far as I know, HPB handed out he