From christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com Tue Mar 01 03:08:34 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 71178 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 11:08:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.166) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 11:08:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.45) by mta5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 11:08:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.6] by n16.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 11:06:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.83] by mailer6.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 11:06:07 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 11:06:04 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1401 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.45 From: "christinaleestemaker" X-Originating-IP: 83.85.214.69 Subject: A present from my privat collection to all of you.The Rainbow way. X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=162317756 X-Yahoo-Profile: christinaleestemaker --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "anand19822001" wrote:Dear Anand and others: The Rainbow way. All what I feel and all what I can know I'll be in tune with the Rainbow I'll be in tune with the Rainbow way of today. meeting together the Rainbow way All what my heart knows to say is the love of the Rainbow way it is the time flooding really high that you may kiss the Sky. All what I know , what I want to say it is that you meet the Rainbow way and you flooding in so high that your soul may kiss the sky that your soul may kiss the sky. All what I know what I want to see it is that you meet the Rainbow way and you flooding in so high that your soul may kiss the Sky that your soul may kiss the Sky. All what I know I've got to see people meet now the Rainbow way getting higher get to high that your soul may kiss the Sky All what I know I want to say meet the Rainbow way All I know to say meet the Rainbow way All what I want need to see people need the Rainbow way getting higher that your soul may kiss the Sky that you soul getting high getting higher getting high that your soul may kiss the Sky >>From CD Rainbow way of Oliver Shanti & Friends Christina > > > > http://www.shareintl.org > > > Extraordinary Times, Extraordinary Beings: Experiences of an American > Diplomat With Maitreya and the Masters of Wisdom > by Wayne S. Peterson > ISBN: 1571743766 From dalval14@earthlink.net Tue Mar 01 03:21:06 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: dalval14@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 63065 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 11:21:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.166) by m18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 11:21:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpauth03.mail.atl.earthlink.net) (209.86.89.63) by mta5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 11:21:04 -0000 Received: from [209.179.128.51] (helo=DALLAS) by smtpauth03.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1D65Qq-0007mO-UC; Tue, 01 Mar 2005 06:20:55 -0500 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=simple; s=test1; d=earthlink.net; h=Reply-To:From:To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:Importance:In-Reply-To:X-MimeOLE; b=ASVM3gq75V3BO4SUlzNkLb/hRe8tOztdmPMcKdUF9ezlTs8AE0eFoPe6ZvRFoDXP; To: "AA-BNStudy" Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 03:20:33 -0800 Message-ID: <001b01c51e50$baf0fe20$3380b3d1@DALLAS> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 1 (Highest) X-MSMail-Priority: High X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Importance: High In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-ELNK-Trace: c552449649a8b16d1aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec79d91a8150354bbe84a78d2ef66606f025350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 209.86.89.63 From: "W.Dallas TenBroeck" Reply-To: X-Originating-IP: 209.179.128.51 Subject: RE: Self X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=52898573 X-Yahoo-Profile: dalval2 Mar 1 2005 RE: Self Friends:=20=20 This (see below) generates many questions for "my-self."=20 Presumably "I am" now -- and have been before -- and also will probably continue to be "my-self" for a while ?=20 In 'law' there is held to be a responsible continuity -- correct ? Is this true in Karma and the Universe?=20 What caused Descartes to say: "I think, therefore I am." -- Descartes.=20 If "you" think of "yourself," you are already thinking of a "self" that has passed into memory. You are looking backward at what "you (memory) did." Or, am I wrong? However the SELF (undefinable?) ploughs on -- living and experiencing all the time.=20 Our body, brain, senses, memories, etc... are only a part of the SELF -- Ca= n we call them the transitory "self?" May be even the "Lower self?"=20 What causes its existence? What causes its motion? What is its purpose? Is there indeed a ["Higher" SELF] that transcends the personal concept of "self?"=20 How is that to be defined? And if and when defined, how is such knowledge to be used? I need help in solving this. What are the most basic principles involved?=20 Thanks,=20 Dallas ----------------------------------------- P S Here are some more observations on this: In man (humanity) does the mind and thinking ever stop? If so, what is it in us that is able to make such an observation?=20=20 Is it another aspect (perhaps 'higher?' of the SELF ?)=20 We may think it is inconsequent or something else, but to the one who uses and has a mind, it is important (I think) in many ways.=20=20 As I understand it: It is quite different from our "feelings," which, (to me) when used as an expression, means we have a vague idea of something -- = a tendency -- but, we are not really sure of it, because we have not made ourselves so, by the use of our own power of mental analysis and determination. It may be, as we deem it, only "Lower Manas," but it is still the potential link between the personality (our feelings) and the INDIVIDUAL ( our Knowledge), and cannot be ignored or erased, can it ? But we can present alternatives and let them freely elect to follow their own choices. Is not this the theosophical method?=20 Consider the vow of Kwan Yin: "Never will I seek nor receive private individual salvation. Never will I enter into final peace alone. But forever and everywhere will I live and strive for the redemption of every creature throughout the world." Let us also, perhaps consider the following: Our laboratories cannot devise any kind of analytical method to detect or rationalize MORAL, VIRTUOUS and COMPASSIONATE thinking, choosing, living and behaviour. They don't know the difference between vice and virtue - s= o how can they presume to say anything valid, or of practical daily use to us ?=20=20 This is precisely what THEOSOPHY teaches us -- (and I think I could add:) i= f we are careful to study and try to understand the teachings on the subject, implied and embodied in The VOICE OF THE SILENCE . Some aspects of ancient Hindu learning on psychology have been found and translated -- but they are designed to throw readers off the real inner spiritual track into psychism and its curious dead ends. They do not give any hint about the ideal, or the universal and impersonal operations of the spiritual side of life and Nature as a whole.=20=20 A study of PATANJALI's sutras shows us the difference, I think.=20 They (modern psychologists) do not show, for instance, that a knowledge tha= t we are all IMMORTALS living together under a uniform benevolent and fair la= w -- KARMA - makes for a cooperative and conjoined progress - towards a GOAL we all share : PERFECTION.=20=20 They only focus on the physical and selfish powers that some acquire in order to dominate others - and this may last, as a condition, for a single life -- until death mercifully terminates the torture.=20=20 I have looked at this long and deeply, and have tried to carry out thought, power of logic, and imagination to the ultimate end -- which, for you and me, and others -- is WHAT ?=20=20 Is it: Immortality of the imperishable INDIVIDUALITY, or, the effacement o= f a personality that has failed to make its connection with its own HIGHER SELF effective and a matter of daily reference?=20 Why are we all in the same general indecisive and continually questioning condition and either helping or hindering each other ? How do we attain poise and security, or stability ?=20=20 What would be the steady uniform and universal principles involved ?=20 As I see it: The primary thought to keep in front of us, is the sacrifice made by the SPIRITUAL DIVINE SELF (Atma-Buddhi-Manas) in incarnating into our physical environment.=20 It does this, not for itself, but to assist the "monads of lesser development" to raise themselves individually as well as collectively, to the nature and stature of the Universally Resident, Inner "God." [To give you an idea of the importance of this read in the SECRET DOCTRINE I 207-210, II 1567, TRANSACTIONS OF THE BLAVATSKY LODGE. pp. 63-68). That there may be in each of us a "Resident, Inner "God" may appear questionable, as such a concept is difficult to trace among the philosophies, religious tents and doctrines of the past.=20 Every night (says "Transactions") our Lower Manas in its aspirations has the opportunity of rising to consult with the Higher Manas (Buddhi-Manas and the HIGHER SELF -- the "ray" of the universal One spirit: ATMA in each of us).=20=20 It brings the memory of this back to waking consciousness, if, in our wakin= g consciousness, we devote a regular time to study and learning about our own virtuous, spiritual potentials and capacities. For it is in our period of waking consciousness that we have to focus those virtues that are spiritual realities -- and as Kwan-Yin suggests, make them "a living power in our lives."=20 THEOSOPHY provides the rationale and the logic to make this quite plain to the honest and sincere waking and working lower mind -- that's the reason we study and try to grasp that which is within every man's reach. (If he will search for it, test it, and see if the application is impersonal and benevolent -- so he can adopt it for his own use.)=20 There are centers and meridians in the physical body. Ancient Indian and Chinese medicine knows these are effective and uses them pretty well fo= r health reasons. Mesmer and Paracelsus taught and practised this knowledge in the West in historical times, but today, few medical men know or understand the MORAL IMPLICATIONS of such information. [As a result we are warned in THEOSOPHY of the evils of hypnotism.]=20 But consider that the HEAD is the primary resting place in our physical environment of the CONTACT POINT of the INNER and REAL MAN with his physica= l vehicle.=20 The body to put it briefly, exists to support the head -- and particularly the BRAIN -- in which are certain centers made of specialized and sensitive "monads," (or "life-atoms and skandhas") -- peculiarly related to the spiritual thought and the moral and virtuous choices and behaviour of all humans.=20 Such higher centers have on this physical plane corresponding centers of sensitivity. Their nature is not entirely clear to the physiologist. But they are known to regulate and affect health, both psychic and physical. Most have no clue as to the spiritual nature of man, and its purpose in incarnating into a body time after time. So this area of doctrine is not relevant or is viewed with suspicion. What we all can learn (as I see it) in THEOSOPHY (and from "within" -- from our own HIGHER SELF) is the SPIRITUAL, universal and impersonal, benevolent and compassionate approach. That is (to me) important and supersedes any other. Best wishes, DTB =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =20 -----Original Message----- From: Mark Kusek [mailto:mark@withoutwalls.com]=20 Sent: Monday, February 28, 2005=20 To:=20 Subject: Re: Self From: "Gerald Schueler" Self-consciousness is simply being conscious of our own imputation of a self as if it were real when it is not.=20 ------------------------------------ This statement is a gem. Thank you. -- M =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D From christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com Tue Mar 01 04:16:08 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 85059 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 12:16:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 12:16:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.47) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 12:16:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.1] by n18.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 12:14:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.92] by mailer1.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 12:14:45 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 12:14:41 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000201c51df9$681de8e0$9c93b3d1@DALLAS> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 13437 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.47 From: "christinaleestemaker" X-Originating-IP: 83.85.214.69 Subject: Chakras X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=162317756 X-Yahoo-Profile: christinaleestemaker --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "W.Dallas TenBroeck" wrote: Here you put a point A real important point. In theosophy we have the leadbeater version. In psychological(technical) teachings Motoyama Neurological investigation, much more is done as well as in America as in our country. Dangerous things allways happened if incapable people get to use this. But there have visit the market too much of that stuff. Anodea Judith, etc You would not believe what I have seen in our Hospital, where I have worked for 25 years. And what I have seen in bookstores and by publishers. Mistakes and wrong expression of the work, but as you should know all is material and selfish on that grade. I shall not tell you what kind of stuff the Alternatives bring on the market Angle,Cosmic remedies and all for the purification and not without mentioning the masters they use for making that also with un pure people, what kind of touch will be in that products? I know! I have seen idiots (people incapable) working with that!!! As you know if your brains and heart sitting on the places were they belongs to sit, not every Surgeon can work with Laser to operate with.Therefore you need people with very special qualities and in a optimal condition; otherwise they make more deaths than to cure the people. Also there needs to be an equillibrium not only from manas to heart, but even in the brains the left and right parts need to be in BALANCE FIRST!!at ALL!!!!!!!!! And in our coutry, oke the allopathy is not the best way ( we needs the way of Hippocrates), but the alternatives as it is working now. Every "Idiot"can start his own business here. Makes my blood overcooking!!! If I go to write a book! The Greatest bestseller you ever have seen. But I should be stupid to do that.Better in my personal MIND Computer. And where I see people misusing the Knowledge I am a TIGER for sure to make work of it to stop them, where I can.Because I am not everywhere at the same time it will not be easy. Publishing is the same mistake as the give a little child a gun, better to give him a gum by making drawings. So now I go to my cappucino Greetings Christina > Why is it that THEOSOPHY does not deal immediately with information about > the "chakras?" They must stop to publish!!!! But allready have done this! > > their cause, or the reason for investigation. > > Some aspects of ancient Hindu learning on psychology have been found and > translated -- but they are designed to throw readers off the real inner > spiritual track into psychism and its curious dead ends. They do not give > any hint about the ideal or the universal and impersonal operations of the > spiritual side of life and Nature as a whole. > > They do not show, for instance, that a knowledge that we are all IMMORTALS > living together under a uniform benevolent and fair law -- KARMA - makes for > a cooperative and conjoined progress - towards a GOAL we all share : > PERFECTION. > > They only focus on the physical and selfish powers that some acquire in > order to dominate over others - and lasts, as a condition, for a single life > - until death mercifully terminates the torture. > > Look at this long and deeply, and carry out your thought, power of logic, > and imagination to the ultimate end -- which, for you and me, and others > -- is WHAT ? > > Is it: Immortality of the imperishable INDIVIDUALITY, or, the effacement of > a personality that has failed to make the connection with their HIGHER SELF > effective and a matter of daily reference? > > Why are we all in the same condition and either helping or hindering each > other ? > > The primary thought to keep in front of us, (as I see it) is the sacrifice > made by the SPIRITUAL DIVINE SELF (Atma-Buddhi-Manas) in incarnating into > our physical environment. > > It does this, not for itself, but to assist the "monads of lesser > development" to raise themselves individually and also eventually, > collectively, to the nature and stature of the Universally Resident, Inner > "God." [To give you an idea of the importance of this read in the SECRET > DOCTRINE I 207-210, II 1567, TRANSACTIONS OF THE BLAVATSKY LODGE. pp. > 63-68). > > Every night our Lower Manas in its aspirations has the opportunity of rising > to consult with the Higher Manas (Buddhi-Manas and the HIGHER SELF -- the > ATMA). > > It brings the memory of this back to waking consciousness, if, in our waking > consciousness, we devote a regular time to study and learning about our own > virtuous, spiritual potentials and capacities. For it is in our period of > waking consciousness that we have to focus those virtues that are spiritual > realities -- and as Kwan-Yin suggests make them "a living power in our > lives." > > THEOSOPHY provides the rationale and the logic to make this quite plain to > the honest and sincere waking and working lower mind -- that's the reason > we study and try to grasp that which is within every man's reach. (If he > will search for it, test it, and see if the application is impersonal and > benevolent -- so he can adopt it for his own use.) > > The "chakras" are not dealt with in our early study because of this tendency > to reduce everything in the human psyche and lower mind to material > locations and physical bodily organs (or centers and meridians) . And there > is among some, a great curiosity about these, without there being any > definite object to acquiring such information -- and why should that be the > case for some? > > Yes there are centers and meridians in the physical body. Ancient Indian > and Chinese medicine knows these are effective and uses them pretty well for > health reasons. Mesmer and Paracelsus taught and practised this knowledge > in the West in historical times, but today, few medical men know or > understand the MORAL IMPLICATIONS of such information. [As a result we are > warned in THEOSOPHY of the evils of hypnotism.] > > But consider that the HEAD is the primary resting place in our physical > environment of the CONTACT POINT of the INNER and REAL MAN with his physical > vehicle. > > The body to put it briefly, exists only to support the head -- and > particularly the BRAIN -- in which are certain centers made of specialized > and sensitive "monads," (or "life-atoms and skandhas") -- peculiarly related > to the spiritual thought and the moral and virtuous choices and behaviour of > all humans. > > Such higher centers have on this physical plane corresponding centers of > sensitivity. Their nature is not entirely clear to the physiologist. But > they are known to regulate and affect health, both psychic and physical. > Most have no clue as to the spiritual nature of man, and its purpose in > incarnating into a body time after time. > > But these physical centers, when attuned by our SPIRITUAL WILL to the higher > spiritual and moral MAN, cannot in any way be dissected or made to reveal > anything of the inner nature of the INDIVIDUALITY (Atma-Buddhi- Manas) > > What we all can learn in THEOSOPHY (and from "within" -- from our own HIGHER > SELF) is the SPIRITUAL, universal and impersonal, benevolent and > compassionate approach. That is (to me) important and supersedes any other. > > Best wishes, > > Dallas > > ======================= > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Steven Levey > Sent: Monday, February 28, 2005 6:25 AM > To: theosophia@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [theosophia] Re: Theosophy and our times > > > > Laura- > > > I appreciate your reply to Dallas and myself about > the "Transitonal Age" we are in. > > Regarding non-violence, humility and Spirituality in general > as the needs of democracy, I couldn't agree more. > > There seems to be a kind of rampant tendency towards violence in our > cultures these days. > > > To my mind it may be connected to a growing internal state of > frustration in the sense of a way to express outwardly, what has > become a condition of impotency within the minds of everyday folks. > > > This is an impotency, where the outward conditions of the world seem > so uncontrollable by the everyday person, and I think that therefore > there is a feeling in which most folks feel as if they are helpless > in effecting the world scene. Of course, to a great extent this is > true. Once the 9/11 rabbit was out of the hat, and the country > responded the way it did, things have only escalated since. > > The only way that it seems possible to put the 9/11 rabbit > back in the hat is through a humility of thought, word and deed on > the part of those in whom we have invested political responsibility, > on the one hand, and the powerful issuance of Theosophical ideation > on the other. > > People will have to admit to their Spiritual Nature as > a reality, before they will expect their political leaders to act > accodingly on their behalf. > > This is the work of the Theosophical > Movement. It must choose to find a way into the world of the very > people who neglect such a mental and moral position. > > As far as Manas goes, if it appears to be an inactive organ, at > the moment, let us activate that which is active. > > Steve > > ============================== > > --- In theosophia@yahoogroups.com, "Steven Levey" > wrote: > > > > From Laura Grey-ULT in Victoria, Canada > > > > Hi Steve > > > > I wish I had more time! > > > > Your letter to Dallas came to me by way of his email response to > you. > > > > An interesting observation on this period of the Transition, is in > > the collection of speeches by Vaclav Havel, called "The Art of the > > Impossible". It is well worth reading. Havel indicates that > > Democracy needs to evolve and embrace Spirituality, in order for > the > > world to take it seriously. He also indicated that evolution must > > happen from within the individuals of the world and this takes > time. > > It cannot be imposed from without (violence). This is what is > > missing from the western method of democracy, there is no > > humbleness. To me humbleness is the realization that truth is not > > in "me" or in a particular group, but Truth in inherent in each and > > all and must be realized by each and all from their own inner > > awakening. We cannot blast it into them, but as Havel indicates > > there are a few things we can do to add a little pressure. He uses > > the example of the equal rights movement. > > > > In the past much of this kind of dialogue was accomplished in Manas > > Magazine. Maybe someone could take the Manas Reprints (effort by > > Dallas and others) and using past articles and new articles with > the > > events of the day make it a thought force once again. > > > > In a brief dialogue with Jane Jacobs she indicated to me that Manas > > Magazine could be a basis for a new kind of university, one that > > charged no tuition and offered no degree. The only true kind of > > University. Henry Gieger thought this was a good idea and offered > > the challenge. > > > > Theosophy has so much to offer to us when we step out of the > > temporary and look at the patterns of the age. It helps us to > think > > and act in a non-separate way, which we as individuals, then apply > > to our daily interactions. During Theosophical Meetings it is best > > to reconnect with these Ideas, then when fueled with them, we move > > back out into our work, and efforts. The results of all this work > by > > students will be seen, but not necessarily by those same students. > > > > Have a good day. > > > > Laura > > ================================== > > > > --- In theosophia@yahoogroups.com, "Steven Levey" > > wrote: > > > > > > Dal-Thank you for presenting what ULT has brought into our lives, > as > > > it rekindles, really, the intent of the old Academys. I think that > > > this must be seen as a powerful effect upon the mind of our day. I > > > know that there have been other attempts at presenting music, > dance > > > and poetry as the tools used to open the mind of students. > Guerdgief > > > seems to have had this in mind, as portrayed in his "Meeting with > > > Remarkable Men", but I think he went to extremes along with > > decidedly > > > overlooking a classical sense of philisophical ethics. > > > Also, I believe Theosophical thought, through students of the > > ULT, > > > was an open conduit for the Sufi writings of Rumi, which poetic > > beauty > > > mixed with unerring, nearly Taoist thought, has hardly any equal > in > > > our time. > > > But my questions remain. What has been the discernable effect > of > > > these powerful "tools" to the mind of our time to those not > > > consciously involved with Theosophic thought? And what has it to > do > > > with this time being seen as a "Transition Period"? Does the > > violence, > > > which is prevailant in all forms of media and in personal lives, > > have > > > to do with these profoundly positive methods? Remember, Gandhi > > nearly > > > gave up on Satyagraha or non-violence in action, because of the > > > violence which erupted in the face of it in India. What can we > learn from this? > > > > > > Steve From christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com Tue Mar 01 05:14:18 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 89970 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 13:14:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.167) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 13:14:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.38) by mta6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 13:14:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.5] by n4.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 13:14:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.90] by mailer5.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 13:14:08 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 13:14:07 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 392 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.38 From: "christinaleestemaker" X-Originating-IP: 83.85.214.69 Subject: Re: Maitreya X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=162317756 X-Yahoo-Profile: christinaleestemaker --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "anand19822001" wrote: I have seen this site before!! Better we can ask him to show his left hand! And we will see!!! Vr Gr Christina > > > http://www.shareintl.org > > > Extraordinary Times, Extraordinary Beings: Experiences of an American > Diplomat With Maitreya and the Masters of Wisdom > by Wayne S. Peterson > ISBN: 1571743766 From mhart@idirect.ca Tue Mar 01 06:13:08 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: mhart@idirect.ca X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 48722 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 14:12:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 14:12:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gozer.look.ca) (207.136.80.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 14:12:52 -0000 Received: from [199.243.58.5] (helo=idirect.ca) by gozer.look.ca with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1D687F-00052D-VC for theos-talk@yahoogroups.com; Tue, 01 Mar 2005 14:12:50 +0000 Message-ID: <422479E5.7090702@idirect.ca> Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 09:19:17 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win 9x 4.90; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com References: <001b01c51e50$baf0fe20$3380b3d1@DALLAS> X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: mhart@idirect.ca Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psi.look.ca X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-100.0 required=9.0 tests=USER_IN_WHITELIST autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Version: 3.1 (built Tue Feb 24 05:09:27 GMT 2004) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 207.136.80.10 From: Mauri Subject: Re: Theos-World RE: Self X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60894584 X-Yahoo-Profile: sunzenn W.Dallas TenBroeck wrote: > Mar 1 2005 > > RE: Self > If "you" think of "yourself," you are already thinking of a "self" that has > passed into memory. You are looking backward at what "you (memory) did." > Or, am I wrong? Dallas, are you equating "you" and "self" with "memory" and ... But "memory" has parts to it, so does one pick and choose parts from one's memory to represent "one's self," or what ... and, if so, "who" does that choosing ... and, if so, if that "who" is defined in some manner, "who" does that choosing ... and, if so, if that "who" is defined in some manner, "who" does that choosing ... etc, etc ... ^:-/ ... My more or less current speculation about "self" would seem to suggest that it might be likened (at a stretch ...) to what "one" sees when looking trough a multi-colored, patterned window like the one's they have in some churches (where the "self/one" Is the seeing, itself, rather than some interpretive, second-hand, dualistic memory or karmic influence or colored window). "Just being" meditation for me seems to suggest that it might evolve, at some point, into a kind of transcending of the colors and patterns (karma/maya) in that window. Speculatively, Mauri From krishtar_a@brturbo.com.br Tue Mar 01 06:40:01 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: krishtar_a@brturbo.com.br X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 88230 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 14:40:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.172) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 14:40:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp4.brturbo.com.br) (200.199.201.180) by mta4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 14:40:00 -0000 Received: from versus (unknown [200.138.244.44]) by smtp4.brturbo.com.br (Postfix) with SMTP id A26AB33F50 for ; Tue, 1 Mar 2005 11:39:54 -0300 (BRT) Message-ID: <00b301c51e6c$ad466460$0301010a@versus> To: References: Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 11:18:56 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 200.199.201.180 From: "krishtar" Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Maitreya IS BACK X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=213301758 X-Yahoo-Profile: krishtar_a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit HI! CHRIS YES, I HAVE ALSO SEEN THAT. ANOTHER CHANELLING MAN WHO CLAIMS TO TALK DIRECTLY WITH A BUDDHA OR A MASTER, LIKE THOUSANDS... YOU SAID ..." HIS LEFT HAND..." , WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? THE EVIL FORCES? I PERSONALLY THINK THAT THERE ARE SO MANY PEOPLE IN THE WORLD WHO ARE CLAIMMING CONTACT THROUGH MEDIUMSHIP OR CHANNELING WITH SOME MASTER OR FAMOUS SPIRITUAL CHARACTER THAT NO ONE LISTENS TO ANYTHING ANYMORE. RELIGIONS EAGER TO GET YOUR MONEY AND FALSE PROPHETS EAGER TO CATCH YOUR FAITH...WHO IS THE WORST? DARK FORCES IN ACTION... KRISHTAR ----- Original Message ----- From: christinaleestemaker To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 10:14 AM Subject: Theos-World Re: Maitreya --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "anand19822001" wrote: I have seen this site before!! Better we can ask him to show his left hand! And we will see!!! Vr Gr Christina > > > http://www.shareintl.org > > > Extraordinary Times, Extraordinary Beings: Experiences of an American > Diplomat With Maitreya and the Masters of Wisdom > by Wayne S. Peterson > ISBN: 1571743766 Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com Tue Mar 01 06:50:35 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 10700 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 14:50:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 14:50:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.42) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 14:50:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.1] by n8.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 14:49:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.85] by mailer1.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 14:49:03 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 14:48:48 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 6971 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.42 From: "christinaleestemaker" X-Originating-IP: 83.85.214.69 Subject: Theosophy and information . X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=162317756 X-Yahoo-Profile: christinaleestemaker --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "christinaleestemaker" wrote: So back to Theosophy;vervolg > > > > Why is it that THEOSOPHY does not deal immediately with information > about > > the "chakras?" > > > > > > their cause, or the reason for investigation. > > > > Some aspects of ancient Hindu learning on psychology have been > found and > > translated -- but they are designed to throw readers off the real > inner > > spiritual track into psychism and its curious dead ends. They do > not give > > any hint about the ideal or the universal and impersonal operations > of the > > spiritual side of life and Nature as a whole. That is why we have diseases and the wrong kind of cure. First we need to give this lessons,teachings on UNIVERSITIES for Mental and Body Health and forget the Pathology for the moment. We want to perfect, so we need to stay HEALTH for ALL of our bodies. So anyone needs to know how much there are.(7) Here the most Dr's never heared about Chakra's. My personal Dr ( I only needs for my bloodpressure) ask me what are Chakra's . So I told him and he has ears and eyes for what I told. But the most of that guys prefere to keep all in the old ways. So on the Universities they need to teach THEOSOPHY to the ones have the brains ready and their heart on the right place to study and use it for general health care ! > > They do not show, for instance, that a knowledge that we are all > IMMORTALS > > living together under a uniform benevolent and fair law -- KARMA - How to know KARMA in the time of destruction, degeneration by not learning REGENERATION. > makes for > > a cooperative and conjoined progress - towards a GOAL we all share : > > PERFECTION. Time is comming Boss. We work on it very heart-ly. > > They only focus on the physical and selfish powers that some > acquire in > > order to dominate over others - and lasts, as a condition, for a > single life > > - until death mercifully terminates the torture. > > > > Look at this long and deeply, and carry out your thought, power of > logic, > > and imagination to the ultimate end -- which, for you and me, and > others > > -- is WHAT ? First need: to recognize the wolves in sheepclothes. To make distinction. Not every Surgeon you can give a laser to operate!!! For sure not in a time of UNNOBLES. > > > > Is it: Immortality of the imperishable INDIVIDUALITY, or, the > effacement of > > a personality that has failed to make the connection with their > HIGHER SELF > > effective and a matter of daily reference? > > > > Why are we all in the same condition and either helping or > hindering each > > other ? Blindness is the answer. Blindness through the GREAT SLIGHER of MIND; the LOWER thinking power. > > The primary thought to keep in front of us, (as I see it) is the > sacrifice > > made by the SPIRITUAL DIVINE SELF (Atma-Buddhi-Manas) in > incarnating into > > our physical environment. > > > > It does this, not for itself, but to assist the "monads of lesser > > development" to raise themselves individually and also eventually, > > collectively, to the nature and stature of the Universally > Resident, Inner > > "God." [To give you an idea of the importance of this read in the > SECRET > > DOCTRINE I 207-210, II 1567, TRANSACTIONS OF THE BLAVATSKY > LODGE. pp. > > 63-68). > > > > Every night our Lower Manas in its aspirations has the opportunity > of rising > > to consult with the Higher Manas (Buddhi-Manas and the HIGHER > SELF -- the > > ATMA). What if you must work some nights and the other half day through ????? What do you think that happened for that? The endorfines goiing to work. > > It brings the memory of this back to waking consciousness, if, in > our waking > > consciousness, we devote a regular time to study and learning about > our own > > virtuous, spiritual potentials and capacities. For it is in our > period of > > waking consciousness that we have to focus those virtues that are > spiritual > > realities -- and as Kwan-Yin suggests make them "a living power in > our > > lives." > > > > THEOSOPHY provides the rationale and the logic to make this quite > plain to > > the honest and sincere waking and working lower mind -- that's the > reason > > we study and try to grasp that which is within every man's reach. > (If he > > will search for it, test it, and see if the application is > impersonal and > > benevolent -- so he can adopt it for his own use.) > > > > The "chakras" are not dealt with in our early study because of this > tendency > > to reduce everything in the human psyche and lower mind to material > > locations and physical bodily organs (or centers and meridians) . > And there > > is among some, a great curiosity about these, without there being > any > > definite object to acquiring such information -- and why should > that be the > > case for some? > > > > Yes there are centers and meridians in the physical body. Ancient > Indian > > and Chinese medicine knows these are effective and uses them pretty > well for > > health reasons. Mesmer and Paracelsus taught and practised this > knowledge > > in the West in historical times, but today, few medical men know or > > understand the MORAL IMPLICATIONS of such information. [As a result > we are > > warned in THEOSOPHY of the evils of hypnotism.] Exact, the SELFISH way of the UNNOBLES Inner Cultivation,we need to have. > > > > But consider that the HEAD is the primary resting place in our > physical > > environment of the CONTACT POINT of the INNER and REAL MAN with his > physical > > vehicle. > > > > The body to put it briefly, exists only to support the head -- and > > particularly the BRAIN -- in which are certain centers made of > specialized > > and sensitive "monads," (or "life-atoms and skandhas") -- > peculiarly related > > to the spiritual thought and the moral and virtuous choices and > behaviour of > > all humans. > > > > Such higher centers have on this physical plane corresponding > centers of > > sensitivity. Their nature is not entirely clear to the > physiologist. But > > they are known to regulate and affect health, both psychic and > physical. > > Most have no clue as to the spiritual nature of man, and its > purpose in > > incarnating into a body time after time. > > > > But these physical centers, when attuned by our SPIRITUAL WILL to > the higher > > spiritual and moral MAN, cannot in any way be dissected or made to > reveal > > anything of the inner nature of the INDIVIDUALITY (Atma-Buddhi- > Manas) > > > > What we all can learn in THEOSOPHY (and from "within" -- from our > own HIGHER > > SELF) is the SPIRITUAL, universal and impersonal, benevolent and > > compassionate approach. That is (to me) important and supersedes > any other. > > > > Best wishes, > > > > Dallas Thanks, Unanimous Christina > From christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com Tue Mar 01 06:59:29 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 73241 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 14:59:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 14:59:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.51) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 14:59:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.1] by n22.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 14:58:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.84] by mailer1.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 14:58:22 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 14:58:18 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00b301c51e6c$ad466460$0301010a@versus> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1686 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.51 From: "christinaleestemaker" X-Originating-IP: 83.85.214.69 Subject: Theos-World Re: Maitreya IS BACK X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=162317756 X-Yahoo-Profile: christinaleestemaker --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "krishtar" wrote: Hi Krishtar, I hope my vision I give on the other messages gives an answer, just as you say here FALSE PROFETS out of their OWN PROFET !!! To see his left hand , shows the life in total. His living, his marriages his career and so on. Christina. > HI! CHRIS > > YES, I HAVE ALSO SEEN THAT. > ANOTHER CHANELLING MAN WHO CLAIMS TO TALK DIRECTLY WITH A BUDDHA OR A MASTER, LIKE THOUSANDS... > YOU SAID ..." HIS LEFT HAND..." , WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? THE EVIL FORCES? > I PERSONALLY THINK THAT THERE ARE SO MANY PEOPLE IN THE WORLD WHO ARE CLAIMMING CONTACT THROUGH MEDIUMSHIP OR CHANNELING WITH SOME MASTER OR FAMOUS SPIRITUAL CHARACTER THAT NO ONE LISTENS TO ANYTHING ANYMORE. > RELIGIONS EAGER TO GET YOUR MONEY AND FALSE PROPHETS EAGER TO CATCH YOUR FAITH...WHO IS THE WORST? > DARK FORCES IN ACTION... > > KRISHTAR > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: christinaleestemaker > To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 10:14 AM > Subject: Theos-World Re: Maitreya > > > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "anand19822001" > wrote: > I have seen this site before!! > Better we can ask him to show his left hand! And we will see!!! > Vr Gr Christina > > > > > > http://www.shareintl.org > > > > > > Extraordinary Times, Extraordinary Beings: Experiences of an > American > > Diplomat With Maitreya and the Masters of Wisdom > > by Wayne S. Peterson > > ISBN: 1571743766 > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From lalaya7@yahoo.com.br Tue Mar 01 07:06:14 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: lalaya7@yahoo.com.br X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 5039 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 15:06:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.172) by m25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 15:06:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.39) by mta4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 15:06:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.6] by n5.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 15:05:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.92] by mailer6.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 15:05:13 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:04:45 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 13134 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.39 From: "Alaya" X-Originating-IP: 161.148.208.156 Subject: Re: Theos-World Master K.H. confirmed Annie Besant as successor X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=160996087 X-Yahoo-Profile: lalaya7 we can find in the blavatskyarchieves about Mrs. Tingley ". . . Mrs. Katherine Tingley. . . [was] a professional psychic and=20 trance medium in New York. . . .For those of us who followed Mr.=20 Judge in 1895, later discovered that about the time of H.P.B.'s death=20 or soon after (the exact date is not known to me), Mr. Judge came=20 under the influence of this woman, who is possessed of considerable=20 hypnotic and other dangerous powers. He had consulted her, in her=20 capacity as a medium, which led eventually to her obtaining a=20 complete hold over him, and also over Theosophical friends whom he=20 introduced to her, and to their accepting her as a Chela of the=20 Masters; one for whom Mr. Judge believed he had been told to seek.=20=20 She gave him "messages" purporting to be from Them, but subsequently=20 I discovered that most - if not all- of those which he gave out as=20 having been received by him had come "through" Mrs. Tingley. The=20 whole history of this extraordinary delusion is a long and=20 complicated one, some of it being contained in the E.S. documents in=20 my possession.". . .=20 T. Collins said: "in the Tibetan tradition high incarnations are found and taught from an early age." Anyone can be taught from an early age Not necessarily this means a `high incarnation' "It is not only a question of anyones accomplishments and performance of one's duties but also of degrees of consciousness." Yeah, the degree of consuousness is extremely important... And besan was a chela on probation only While Judge was an accepted chela 30 years standing Even though... they were not a HPB... >>>>>In a message dated 01/29/05 2:03:37 PM, Anand Gholap... writes: In 1900 Master K.H. wrote letter to Annie Besant who was the head of ES-Adyar with following words " The greatest of your trials is yet to come. We watch over you but you must put forth all your strength- K.H." It is clear from words of Master that Annie Besant was Their true agent in Esoteric matters and Adyar TS as only true Theosophical Is it so clear, or you just want to believe on that? Now, about the letter from the Master in 1900 We should analyse it carefully. First of all.. many people received letters from the masters, the=20 vast majority as HPB atests us, failed... and Damodar was the only=20 true sucess. Maybe the SAINT pedophyle Leadbeater was also a failure... Besant having received a letter doesn't mean that SHE was THEIR TRUE=20 AGENT... this is an exageration. Whoever a little usefull would be leading the T.S, this person would=20 receive a letter... it is not because she is Annie Besant, is because=20 at that present moment it was she, not other, that was responsible=20 for the T.S..=20 1900 was the last year the Masters could have their influence (as we=20 learn from HPB who sais that every last quarter os a century the=20 Masters exercise their influence. If they still cared at least a bit=20 about the T.S they would surely send a last advice... The letter seem to be sent with an intention of saying `don't let it=20 die' (the society) It doesn't seem a letter to give authority to Besant or confirme her=20 as the only anr true sucesssor of HPB (and we know she wasn't.. and=20 the E.S Council responsible for the T.S after H.P.B's death nominated=20 Judge and Besant, and avid for power she couldn't accept not to be=20 the only one) You can find some information on the sucessorship right after H.P.B's=20 death here http://groups.yahoo.com/group/theos-talk/message/22531 The letter's intention seems to be beg Besant to stop the way the T.S=20 was being led... a last hope... The same letter would be sent to other if other was in charge... Now, let us notice something about the letter What about its content? It begins with a strong criticism by the master about the way the T.S=20 was going... "A psychic and a pranayamist who has got confused by the vagaries of=20 the members. The T.S. And its members are slowly MANUFACTURING a=20 CREED. Says a Tibetan proverb "credulity breeds credulity and ends in=20 HYPOCRISY." How FEW are they who can KNOW ANYTHINGABOUT US. Are we to=20 be propitiated and made idols of? Is the worship of a new trinity=20 made up of the blessed M., Upasika and yourself to take the place of=20 exploded creeds? We ask NOT for the WORSHIP OF OURSELVES. The=20 disciple should in no way be fettered. BEWARE OF AN ESOTERIC POPERY." Doesn't all this support the quotes I posted from Alice Cleather's=20 book on 25/02? Besant was being acused by old members to create a creed. And the=20 Master is warning that the T.S is going on the way to hypocrisy. She=20 was being criticized by the old and tried members who knew H.P.B that=20 she didn't accept that someone could think differently from her. And=20 notice that it was only 7 years latter (if my memory doesn't fail)=20 that she was caught in Leadbeater's trap... and things went worse and=20 worse... The master even compares the T.S with POPERY.. this doesn't seem a=20 good thing to me Is this the `wonderfull letter confirming the saint besant as a true=20 and only sucessor'? as some seem to think.... And they ask her to stop the worship of themselves... To give=20 authorithy to her own sayings she started to talk a lot about them..=20 something you can see that they didn't like... And if the Master felt necessity to atest that FEW know anything=20 about them... probably there were some people saying things about=20 them and and telling that their teachings come from them.. and that=20 was a lie.=20 What else can we notice from this letter? "The intense desire to see upasika reincarnate at once has raised a=20 MISLEADING MAYAVIC IDEATION. Upasika has useful work to do on higher=20 planes and cannot come again so soon. The T.S. must safely be ushered=20 into the new century. You have for some time been UNDER DELUDING=20 INFLUENCES. Shun PRIDE, VANITY and LOVE OF POWER. Be not guided by=20 emotion but learn to stand alone. Be accurate and critical rather=20 than CREDULOUS. The mistakes of the past in the old religions must=20 not be glossed over with imaginary explanations." All this statements from the Master support what Mrs. Alice Cleather=20 was trying to show on her book "H.P.B - a great betrayal" The first sentence refers to something that alice also explains, that=20 Besant believed that H.P.B was reborn in india and was a child that=20 was under Besant's influnce. With this argument she publishes the=20 secret material from the Inner Group (breaking her secrecy pledge,=20 which should have been sacred to her, unfortunatelly it wasn't...)=20 She says that the `little HPB' asked her to do so and also that=20 the "little HPB" asked her to revised and correct [mislead] the S.D=20 and many other things... And then the Master himself tells her that she is under a mayavic=20 ideation. And the Master himself warned her that she was under delunding=20 influences (and this is all Mrs. Alice Cleather, M. L=E9vy, W.=20 Kingsland and others war trying to prove, to protect the new member=20 to fall into the same trap =96 so what is so wrong about warning people=20 of something even the master admited to be wrong on Mrs. Besant?) And the master also seem to agree with Mrs. Cleather and all the=20 others that Mrs. Besant was showing pride, vanity and love of power,=20 and that was what was leading her.. not the true `feelings' a real=20 theosophist should have. The masters don't interfere in worlds affairs... Besant was head of=20 the T.S by her own politics and fakes (like confirming that she=20 herself has destroyed all the proofs that were in favour to Judge).=20 They didn't nominate her... all they could do is to asure that the=20 the T.S wasn't going to lead the foul road to popery... and if the=20 T.S was working well they would NOT have felt the necessity to send a=20 last letter trying to correct the mistakes The only good thing we can find in the letter is the final sentence ,=20 that they STILL haven't given up... But considering the way things=20 were few years latter this letter... I guess unfortunately we can be=20 quite sure that the T.S was a dead letter... Still in the letter "NO ONE HAS THE RIGHT TO CLAIM AUTHORITY OVER A PUPIL or his=20 conscience. Ask him not what he believes. All who are sincere and=20 pure minded must have admittance. The crest wave of intellectual=20 advancement must be taken hold of and guided into spirituality. It=20 CANNOT BE FORCER INTO BELIEFS AND EMOTIONAL WORSHIP." >> and what has Mr. Leadbeater , supported by Besant, done????? (with=20 Krishnamurti and maybe others)=20 and more criticizm by the Master on the letter "Misleading secrecy has given the death blow to numerous=20 organizations." =96 this was arising in the T.S.. little by little... "The CANT (hipocrisy) ABOUT the "Masters" MUST be silently but firmly=20 PUT DOWN.... THE CONTINUAL REFERENCES TO OURSELVES AND THE REPETITION=20 OF OUR NAMES RAISES UP A CONFUSED AURA THAT HINDERS OUR WORK" And what have Mr. Leadbeater and Besant done??? Published works on=20 the Masters, open to the unfiting public their sacred lifes and=20 names, and made disrespecful and ridiculous statmens like this ones=20 above in one of their books "In the course of their investigations these two (Besant and Leadbeater) look up on the one side, the past incarnations of him whom Mrs. Besant calls the "Master Jesus", that is, of the "Jesus" born in 105 b.C; and on the other side, the past lives of the being whom she calls the "Lord Maitreya, the present Bodhisattva, the Supreme Teacher of the World" whose ego at a given moment replaced that of "Jesus", this being the last incarnation of the Christ whose immediate return (as Krishnamurti) she is announcing. "Let us quote from their account of the incarnations of the "Supreme Teacher"... `In the Fourth Root Race we again find the personage supposed to be "Maitreya" as the husband of the ego claimed by these authors as that of "Master K.H". Mrs. Besant is again incarnated in the family as daughter, the eldest sister of the "Master M."; "Maitreya", being at this time the head of the trime." >>Has Mrs. Besant given atention to Master K.H request to stop=20 refering to them and using their names? Has she respected his will No, she made quite the contrary And for many years the T.S did turned into a creed under Leadbeater's=20 guidance. And now.. Do we have the right to criticize the Masters criticism on=20 her.. is she this Splendind, wonderful and santificated woman some=20 are here trying to prove? Maybe the Inner group members weren't so wrong to criticize her.. And who are we to judge them.. and to judge assertions of the Master=20 himself? --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Truth Collins"=20 wrote: >=20 > Did W.Q. Judge appoint Tingley as his successer? I don't think he=20 > did. I have read articles to this effect. Look in the ULT=20 articles=20 > online about Crosbie for more on this. >=20 > In my opinion, people like H.P. Blavatsky and W.Q. Judge are born=20 > already having reached a certain degree of consciousness. Not to=20 > mention the efforts after being born. For example, in the Tibetan=20 > tradition high incarnations are found and taught from an early age. >=20 > The question of successorship is more compicated than it first=20 > looks. It is not only a question of anyones accomplishments and=20 > performance of one's duties but also of degrees of consciousness. >=20 > What is the attitude of someone with the degrees of consciousness=20 > of say H.P. Blavatsky or H.P. Blavatsky? Well, whatever it is, it=20 > is beneficiant. >=20 > Blavatsky and Judge helped the people that are now being argued=20 > about. This is the attitude that I recommend. An attitude that=20 > helps the other, if anything. >=20 > A. Besant and K. Tingley too. They helped as they saw fit. >=20 > This is the common denominator between them. >=20 > There is a saying that the least common denominator usually rules a=20 > conversation. This in a world dominated by the three rulers:=20 money,=20 > power and sex. >=20 > The inverse seems to be closer to the truth for people like H.P.=20 > Blavatsky. The higher triad of atma, buddhi, manas is not=20 > subjugated by peer pressure. >=20 > Namaste, Truth C. >=20 >=20 >=20 > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, leonmaurer@a... wrote: > > Unfortuunately, Besant's strengh ran out and she couldn't hack it=20 > after she=20 > > fell for and got caught up in the black magical snares of the=20 > impostor=20 > > Leadbeater. I'm sure K.H. was, to say the least, very=20 > disappointed by that. :-) > >=20 > > Lenny Maurer > >=20 > > In a message dated 01/29/05 2:03:37 PM, AnandGholap@A... writes: > >=20 > > >After splitting of the TS, in 1890s, some people were and still=20 > are=20 > > >confused about which society is actually Masters' Society. Judge=20 > died=20 > > >in 1896 after appointing Katherin Tingley as his successor.=20 > > >In 1900 Master K.H. wrote letter to Annie Besant who was the=20 head=20 > of=20 > > >ES-Adyar with following words " The greatest of your trials is=20 > yet to=20 > > >come. We watch over you but you must put forth all your strength- =20 > > >K.H."=20 > > > > > >It is clear from words of Master that Annie Besant was Their=20 true=20 > > >agent in Esoteric matters and Adyar TS as only true Theosophical=20 > > >Society.=20 > > > > > >Anand Gholap From lalaya7@yahoo.com.br Tue Mar 01 07:17:41 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: lalaya7@yahoo.com.br X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 34249 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 15:17:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 15:17:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.45) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 15:17:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.59] by n16.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 15:17:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.82] by mailer8.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 15:17:37 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:17:36 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3075 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.45 From: "Alaya" X-Originating-IP: 161.148.208.156 Subject: Theos-World Re: Maitreya IS BACK X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=160996087 X-Yahoo-Profile: lalaya7 In a few years there will be maybe as much "Maitreyas" as there ar "Jesus" even in the T.S we see things like Krishnamurti will 'incarnate' maitreya and there's a group in the South o Brazil that claims that Maitreya is alive among them, and is from Sagitarius, and is 48 years old And I guess in England there is another Maytreia, who will give teachings by Television and stuff And you even have a Picture of him http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Thebes/6507/maitreya.html sorry the page is in portuguese... i didn't search in English.. but you can see right above that Maitreya is the Anticrist!!! and we also have (or had, for he is already dead) a man from Colombia )who commited pagiarism from H.P.B's writings (he says she is a kind os John Baptist preparing the way yo him) and from Oupenskyand Gurdigeff writings and others... His name is Victor Emanuel, but he calls himself Samael awn weor and he says that he is MAYTREYA, the ADEPT of the Aquarian Age, the Third Logos and other absurdities... How far will humanity get in all this madness?? We should have a good discrimination, and take care on what we believe.. --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "christinaleestemaker" wrote: > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "krishtar" wrote: > Hi Krishtar, > > I hope my vision I give on the other messages gives an answer, just > as you say here FALSE PROFETS out of their OWN PROFET !!! > > To see his left hand , shows the life in total. > His living, his marriages his career and so on. > Christina. > > > > > > > > > HI! CHRIS > > > > YES, I HAVE ALSO SEEN THAT. > > ANOTHER CHANELLING MAN WHO CLAIMS TO TALK DIRECTLY WITH A BUDDHA OR > A MASTER, LIKE THOUSANDS... > > YOU SAID ..." HIS LEFT HAND..." , WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? THE EVIL > FORCES? > > I PERSONALLY THINK THAT THERE ARE SO MANY PEOPLE IN THE WORLD WHO > ARE CLAIMMING CONTACT THROUGH MEDIUMSHIP OR CHANNELING WITH SOME > MASTER OR FAMOUS SPIRITUAL CHARACTER THAT NO ONE LISTENS TO ANYTHING > ANYMORE. > > RELIGIONS EAGER TO GET YOUR MONEY AND FALSE PROPHETS EAGER TO CATCH > YOUR FAITH...WHO IS THE WORST? > > DARK FORCES IN ACTION... > > > > KRISHTAR > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: christinaleestemaker > > To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 10:14 AM > > Subject: Theos-World Re: Maitreya > > > > > > > > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "anand19822001" > > wrote: > > I have seen this site before!! > > Better we can ask him to show his left hand! And we will see!!! > > Vr Gr Christina > > > > > > > > > http://www.shareintl.org > > > > > > > > > Extraordinary Times, Extraordinary Beings: Experiences of an > > American > > > Diplomat With Maitreya and the Masters of Wisdom > > > by Wayne S. Peterson > > > ISBN: 1571743766 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From krishtar_a@brturbo.com.br Tue Mar 01 09:16:13 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: krishtar_a@brturbo.com.br X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 3234 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 17:16:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 17:16:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp3.brturbo.com.br) (200.199.201.164) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 17:16:11 -0000 Received: from versus (unknown [200.138.244.44]) by smtp3.brturbo.com.br (Postfix) with SMTP id 94C2033FAE for ; Tue, 1 Mar 2005 14:15:44 -0300 (BRT) Message-ID: <002701c51e82$721fde00$0301010a@versus> To: References: Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 14:16:44 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 200.199.201.164 From: "krishtar" Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Maitreya IS BACK X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=213301758 X-Yahoo-Profile: krishtar_a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Oh yeah, I just didn=B4t catch the meaning of your expression " Left hand "= because here we know " left hand " as the evil path, or, black sorcery. What you meant was " by the fruits we get to know the tree". Right? Regards K ----- Original Message -----=20 From: christinaleestemaker=20 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com=20 Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 11:58 AM Subject: Theos-World Re: Maitreya IS BACK --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "krishtar" wrote: Hi Krishtar,=20 I hope my vision I give on the other messages gives an answer, just=20 as you say here FALSE PROFETS out of their OWN PROFET !!! To see his left hand , shows the life in total. His living, his marriages his career and so on. Christina. > HI! CHRIS >=20 > YES, I HAVE ALSO SEEN THAT. > ANOTHER CHANELLING MAN WHO CLAIMS TO TALK DIRECTLY WITH A BUDDHA OR=20 A MASTER, LIKE THOUSANDS... > YOU SAID ..." HIS LEFT HAND..." , WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? THE EVIL=20 FORCES? > I PERSONALLY THINK THAT THERE ARE SO MANY PEOPLE IN THE WORLD WHO=20 ARE CLAIMMING CONTACT THROUGH MEDIUMSHIP OR CHANNELING WITH SOME=20 MASTER OR FAMOUS SPIRITUAL CHARACTER THAT NO ONE LISTENS TO ANYTHING=20 ANYMORE. > RELIGIONS EAGER TO GET YOUR MONEY AND FALSE PROPHETS EAGER TO CATCH=20 YOUR FAITH...WHO IS THE WORST? > DARK FORCES IN ACTION... >=20 > KRISHTAR >=20 >=20 > ----- Original Message -----=20 > From: christinaleestemaker=20 > To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com=20 > Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 10:14 AM > Subject: Theos-World Re: Maitreya >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "anand19822001" =20 > wrote: > I have seen this site before!! > Better we can ask him to show his left hand! And we will see!!!=20 > Vr Gr Christina=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > http://www.shareintl.org > >=20 > >=20 > > Extraordinary Times, Extraordinary Beings: Experiences of an=20 > American=20 > > Diplomat With Maitreya and the Masters of Wisdom > > by Wayne S. Peterson > > ISBN: 1571743766 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20=20=20=20 > Yahoo! Groups Links >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20=20=20=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] =20=20=20 Yahoo! Groups Links =20=20=20 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From krishtar_a@brturbo.com.br Tue Mar 01 09:19:31 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: krishtar_a@brturbo.com.br X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 68701 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 17:19:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.172) by m20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 17:19:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp1.brturbo.com.br) (200.199.201.163) by mta4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 17:19:27 -0000 Received: from versus (unknown [200.138.244.44]) by smtp1.brturbo.com.br (Postfix) with SMTP id D6C463516 for ; Tue, 1 Mar 2005 14:19:24 -0300 (BRT) Message-ID: <003201c51e82$f55e31e0$0301010a@versus> To: References: Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 14:20:25 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 200.199.201.163 From: "krishtar" Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Maitreya IS BACK X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=213301758 X-Yahoo-Profile: krishtar_a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi=20 I know these "legends"... I don=B4t know why there are so many people claiming to be Maytrea when the= original one is me. ( lol) Krishtar ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Alaya=20 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com=20 Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 12:17 PM Subject: Theos-World Re: Maitreya IS BACK In a few years there will be maybe as much "Maitreyas" as there=20 ar "Jesus" even in the T.S we see things like Krishnamurti will 'incarnate'=20 maitreya and there's a group in the South o Brazil that claims that Maitreya=20 is alive among them, and is from Sagitarius, and is 48 years old And I guess in England there is another Maytreia, who will give=20 teachings by Television and stuff And you even have a Picture of him http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Thebes/6507/maitreya.html sorry the page is in portuguese... i didn't search in English.. but you can see right above that Maitreya is the Anticrist!!! and we also have (or had, for he is already dead) a man from=20 Colombia )who commited pagiarism from H.P.B's writings (he says she=20 is a kind os John Baptist preparing the way yo him) and from=20 Oupenskyand Gurdigeff writings and others... His name is Victor Emanuel, but he calls himself Samael awn weor and he says that he is MAYTREYA, the ADEPT of the Aquarian Age, the=20 Third Logos and other absurdities... How far will humanity get in all this madness?? We should have a good discrimination, and take care on what we=20 believe.. --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "christinaleestemaker"=20 wrote: >=20 > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "krishtar" =20 wrote: > Hi Krishtar,=20 >=20 > I hope my vision I give on the other messages gives an answer, just=20 > as you say here FALSE PROFETS out of their OWN PROFET !!! >=20 > To see his left hand , shows the life in total. > His living, his marriages his career and so on. > Christina. >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > > HI! CHRIS > >=20 > > YES, I HAVE ALSO SEEN THAT. > > ANOTHER CHANELLING MAN WHO CLAIMS TO TALK DIRECTLY WITH A BUDDHA=20 OR=20 > A MASTER, LIKE THOUSANDS... > > YOU SAID ..." HIS LEFT HAND..." , WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? THE EVIL=20 > FORCES? > > I PERSONALLY THINK THAT THERE ARE SO MANY PEOPLE IN THE WORLD WHO=20 > ARE CLAIMMING CONTACT THROUGH MEDIUMSHIP OR CHANNELING WITH SOME=20 > MASTER OR FAMOUS SPIRITUAL CHARACTER THAT NO ONE LISTENS TO=20 ANYTHING=20 > ANYMORE. > > RELIGIONS EAGER TO GET YOUR MONEY AND FALSE PROPHETS EAGER TO=20 CATCH=20 > YOUR FAITH...WHO IS THE WORST? > > DARK FORCES IN ACTION... > >=20 > > KRISHTAR > >=20 > >=20 > > ----- Original Message -----=20 > > From: christinaleestemaker=20 > > To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com=20 > > Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 10:14 AM > > Subject: Theos-World Re: Maitreya > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "anand19822001"=20 =20 > > wrote: > > I have seen this site before!! > > Better we can ask him to show his left hand! And we will see!!!=20 > > Vr Gr Christina=20 > > >=20 > > >=20 > > > http://www.shareintl.org > > >=20 > > >=20 > > > Extraordinary Times, Extraordinary Beings: Experiences of an=20 > > American=20 > > > Diplomat With Maitreya and the Masters of Wisdom > > > by Wayne S. Peterson > > > ISBN: 1571743766 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20=20=20=20 > > Yahoo! Groups Links > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20=20=20=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] =20=20=20 Yahoo! Groups Links =20=20=20 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com Tue Mar 01 14:06:12 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 71726 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 22:05:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 22:05:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.20) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 22:05:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.2] by n12.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 22:03:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.85] by mailer2.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 22:03:42 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 22:03:20 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3581 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.20 From: "christinaleestemaker" X-Originating-IP: 83.85.214.69 Subject: Re: Maitreya IS BACK X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=162317756 X-Yahoo-Profile: christinaleestemaker --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Alaya" I think, the chickenheads goes as far as (several literature is warning) "they see not the trees between the forest"and follow the wrong guy. Most of them needs torches and bearers, and likewise see nothing! christina > > In a few years there will be maybe as much "Maitreyas" as there > ar "Jesus" > even in the T.S we see things like Krishnamurti will 'incarnate' > maitreya > and there's a group in the South o Brazil that claims that Maitreya > is alive among them, and is from Sagitarius, and is 48 years old > And I guess in England there is another Maytreia, who will give > teachings by Television and stuff > And you even have a Picture of him > http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Thebes/6507/maitreya.html > sorry the page is in portuguese... i didn't search in English.. > but you can see right above that Maitreya is the Anticrist!!! > and we also have (or had, for he is already dead) a man from > Colombia )who commited pagiarism from H.P.B's writings (he says she > is a kind os John Baptist preparing the way yo him) and from > Oupenskyand Gurdigeff writings and others... > His name is Victor Emanuel, but he calls himself Samael awn weor > and he says that he is MAYTREYA, the ADEPT of the Aquarian Age, the > Third Logos and other absurdities... > > How far will humanity get in all this madness?? > We should have a good discrimination, and take care on what we > believe.. > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "christinaleestemaker" > wrote: > > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "krishtar" > wrote: > > Hi Krishtar, > > > > I hope my vision I give on the other messages gives an answer, just > > as you say here FALSE PROFETS out of their OWN PROFET !!! > > > > To see his left hand , shows the life in total. > > His living, his marriages his career and so on. > > Christina. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > HI! CHRIS > > > > > > YES, I HAVE ALSO SEEN THAT. > > > ANOTHER CHANELLING MAN WHO CLAIMS TO TALK DIRECTLY WITH A BUDDHA > OR > > A MASTER, LIKE THOUSANDS... > > > YOU SAID ..." HIS LEFT HAND..." , WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? THE EVIL > > FORCES? > > > I PERSONALLY THINK THAT THERE ARE SO MANY PEOPLE IN THE WORLD WHO > > ARE CLAIMMING CONTACT THROUGH MEDIUMSHIP OR CHANNELING WITH SOME > > MASTER OR FAMOUS SPIRITUAL CHARACTER THAT NO ONE LISTENS TO > ANYTHING > > ANYMORE. > > > RELIGIONS EAGER TO GET YOUR MONEY AND FALSE PROPHETS EAGER TO > CATCH > > YOUR FAITH...WHO IS THE WORST? > > > DARK FORCES IN ACTION... > > > > > > KRISHTAR > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: christinaleestemaker > > > To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com > > > Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 10:14 AM > > > Subject: Theos-World Re: Maitreya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "anand19822001" > > > > wrote: > > > I have seen this site before!! > > > Better we can ask him to show his left hand! And we will see!!! > > > Vr Gr Christina > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.shareintl.org > > > > > > > > > > > > Extraordinary Times, Extraordinary Beings: Experiences of an > > > American > > > > Diplomat With Maitreya and the Masters of Wisdom > > > > by Wayne S. Peterson > > > > ISBN: 1571743766 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com Tue Mar 01 14:14:31 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 44554 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 22:14:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 22:14:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.44) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 22:14:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.3] by n10.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 22:13:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.82] by mailer3.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 22:13:54 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 22:13:54 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002701c51e82$721fde00$0301010a@versus> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 3333 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.44 From: "christinaleestemaker" X-Originating-IP: 83.85.214.69 Subject: Theos-World Re: Maitreya IS BACK X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=162317756 X-Yahoo-Profile: christinaleestemaker --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "krishtar" wrote: Also what you say of tree and fruits is right. Left hand path =3D for a part in the left, is black magic, likewise in=20 the Right path is a side of black magic in the 6 th principle. But that is not so easy to explain. That all have to do with the selfish way of the human being and his=20 lower(lunar) manas.He must integrate that and bringing up to the=20 HIGHER MIND. So many times Dallis gives the SD teachings of that.So I think he=20 better can stop this, let everybody look for himself Only then he will see!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! All you can reed back in HPB's writings. What I meant with that left hand is the physical left hand(with=20 lines in it) and not the PATH ! Christina Oh yeah, I just didn=B4t catch the meaning of your expression " Left=20 hand " because here we know " left hand " as the evil path, or,=20 black sorcery. > What you meant was " by the fruits we get to know the tree". Right? > Regards >=20 > K > ----- Original Message -----=20 > From: christinaleestemaker=20 > To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com=20 > Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 11:58 AM > Subject: Theos-World Re: Maitreya IS BACK >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "krishtar" =20 wrote: > Hi Krishtar,=20 >=20 > I hope my vision I give on the other messages gives an answer,=20 just=20 > as you say here FALSE PROFETS out of their OWN PROFET !!! >=20 > To see his left hand , shows the life in total. > His living, his marriages his career and so on. > Christina. >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > > HI! CHRIS > >=20 > > YES, I HAVE ALSO SEEN THAT. > > ANOTHER CHANELLING MAN WHO CLAIMS TO TALK DIRECTLY WITH A=20 BUDDHA OR=20 > A MASTER, LIKE THOUSANDS... > > YOU SAID ..." HIS LEFT HAND..." , WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? THE EVIL=20 > FORCES? > > I PERSONALLY THINK THAT THERE ARE SO MANY PEOPLE IN THE WORLD=20 WHO=20 > ARE CLAIMMING CONTACT THROUGH MEDIUMSHIP OR CHANNELING WITH SOME=20 > MASTER OR FAMOUS SPIRITUAL CHARACTER THAT NO ONE LISTENS TO=20 ANYTHING=20 > ANYMORE. > > RELIGIONS EAGER TO GET YOUR MONEY AND FALSE PROPHETS EAGER TO=20 CATCH=20 > YOUR FAITH...WHO IS THE WORST? > > DARK FORCES IN ACTION... > >=20 > > KRISHTAR > >=20 > >=20 > > ----- Original Message -----=20 > > From: christinaleestemaker=20 > > To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com=20 > > Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 10:14 AM > > Subject: Theos-World Re: Maitreya > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "anand19822001"=20 =20 > > wrote: > > I have seen this site before!! > > Better we can ask him to show his left hand! And we will=20 see!!!=20 > > Vr Gr Christina=20 > > >=20 > > >=20 > > > http://www.shareintl.org > > >=20 > > >=20 > > > Extraordinary Times, Extraordinary Beings: Experiences of=20 an=20 > > American=20 > > > Diplomat With Maitreya and the Masters of Wisdom > > > by Wayne S. Peterson > > > ISBN: 1571743766 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20=20=20=20 > > Yahoo! Groups Links > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20=20=20=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20=20=20=20 > Yahoo! Groups Links >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20=20=20=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com Tue Mar 01 14:22:50 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 76694 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 22:22:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.166) by m23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 22:22:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.41) by mta5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 22:22:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.5] by n7.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 22:22:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.70] by mailer5.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 22:22:16 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 22:22:15 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003201c51e82$f55e31e0$0301010a@versus> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 507 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.41 From: "christinaleestemaker" X-Originating-IP: 83.85.214.69 Subject: Theos-World Re: Maittreya cleans everything X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=162317756 X-Yahoo-Profile: christinaleestemaker --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "krishtar" wrote: > Hi Simple, for what the people is waiting? For the one cleaning his mess.(rabbish) We have many Maroccans for you; give us your adresses and stayments for them and we rule it for you! Christina > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From samblo@cs.com Tue Mar 01 14:33:13 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: Samblo@cs.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 10777 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 22:33:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.167) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 22:33:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d21.mx.aol.com) (205.188.144.207) by mta6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 22:33:09 -0000 Received: from Samblo@cs.com by imo-d21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v37_r3.8.) id r.13d.e0826f5 (4340) for ; Tue, 1 Mar 2005 17:32:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <13d.e0826f5.2f56479a@cs.com> Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 17:32:58 EST To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 6.0 sub 10512 X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 205.188.144.207 From: samblo@cs.com Subject: Re: Theos-World Theosophy and information . X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=27151446 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Christina, Well your mention of allotropic remedys coaxed me into posting this link. It details how a young Kalmyk came to study tibetan medicine in a sudden detour from his conventional study of Medicine. Interview with Dr. Sona Koldev http://www.ittm.org/publications/AyurVijnana/Vol_06/AV_V06_7.htm John [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From silva_cass@yahoo.com Tue Mar 01 15:29:19 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: silva_cass@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 99615 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2005 23:29:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.172) by m24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2005 23:29:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.24) by mta4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2005 23:29:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.4] by n13.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 23:27:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.81] by mailer4.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2005 23:27:17 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 23:26:50 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1790 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.24 From: "silva_cass" X-Originating-IP: 211.28.163.222 Subject: The Search for Truth comes from the Broken Heart X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=203519531 X-Yahoo-Profile: silva_cass Leonard Cohen says that only when the heart is broken or worn down from living in the known will it seek to find meaning, order in the disharmony and in the uncomfortableness it feels in the world. All of its belief systems have been broken down or shown to be hypocritical and false. It is their discomfort, their suffering, that drives them to seek new paths to truth. They seek for something to give meaning to their life. That we should never judge other paths, as those paths, in whatever form give sustenance to that searching soul. That the path of hedonism is taken by those souls who are most courageous and brave as they will go where many will not and will risk eventual annihilation. Many of these souls,through understanding the depths of selfishness that man is capable of, clearly understand that selfishness cannot lead to anything except greater selfishness and isolation in the long term and will eventually find salvation. Some do not and there fate is sealed. Cass: When such a soul finds a new truth, a new way of looking at "being" feels truly elated, and then discovers that the new truth they have embraced, is built on sand, could this notlead to the path of hedonism? When a soul finally finds some truth that resounds with them in some teaching, and then discovers that their truth came from a dubious source that soul is tempted to throw out the good with the bad. Many souls may throw up their arms in despair and say "what's the point?" they have all got it wrong. To remain true to a teaching that has dubious teachers,(misinterpreters of the truth) requires of a soul great perseverence and trust in the original teachings and great honesty on the part of those that are preserving the doctrine as "the truth". Cass From AnandGholap@AnandGholap.org Tue Mar 01 23:02:05 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: AnandGholap@AnandGholap.org X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 45687 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2005 07:01:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2005 07:01:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.47) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2005 07:01:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.2] by n18.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2005 07:01:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.99] by mailer2.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2005 07:01:51 -0000 Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 07:01:31 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 14147 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.47 From: "Anand Gholap" X-Originating-IP: 61.1.104.117 Subject: Re: Theos-World Master K.H. confirmed Annie Besant as successor X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=187713566 X-Yahoo-Profile: anand_gholap_1 Apparently though Katherine Tingley succeeded Judge, she was=20 not 'appointed' by Judge as his successor. This is despite the fact=20 that Judge was ill for long time and it was natural for him to=20 imagine who would be successor if he dies. Yet information available=20 shows he did not 'appoint' anybody as his successor.=20 Anand Gholap --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Alaya" wrote: >=20 > we can find in the blavatskyarchieves about Mrs. Tingley > ". . . Mrs. Katherine Tingley. . . [was] a professional psychic and=20 > trance medium in New York. . . .For those of us who followed Mr.=20 > Judge in 1895, later discovered that about the time of H.P.B.'s=20 death=20 > or soon after (the exact date is not known to me), Mr. Judge came=20 > under the influence of this woman, who is possessed of considerable=20 > hypnotic and other dangerous powers. He had consulted her, in her=20 > capacity as a medium, which led eventually to her obtaining a=20 > complete hold over him, and also over Theosophical friends whom he=20 > introduced to her, and to their accepting her as a Chela of the=20 > Masters; one for whom Mr. Judge believed he had been told to seek.=20=20 > She gave him "messages" purporting to be from Them, but=20 subsequently=20 > I discovered that most - if not all- of those which he gave out as=20 > having been received by him had come "through" Mrs. Tingley. The=20 > whole history of this extraordinary delusion is a long and=20 > complicated one, some of it being contained in the E.S. documents=20 in=20 > my possession.". . .=20 > T. Collins said: > "in the Tibetan > tradition high incarnations are found and taught from an early age." >=20 > Anyone can be taught from an early age > Not necessarily this means a `high incarnation' >=20 > "It is not only a question of anyones accomplishments and > performance of one's duties but also of degrees of consciousness." >=20 > Yeah, the degree of consuousness is extremely important... > And besan was a chela on probation only > While Judge was an accepted chela 30 years standing > Even though... they were not a HPB... >=20 >=20 > >>>>>In a message dated 01/29/05 2:03:37 PM, Anand Gholap... writes: > In 1900 Master K.H. wrote letter to Annie Besant who was the head > of > ES-Adyar with following words " The greatest of your trials is > yet to > come. We watch over you but you must put forth all your strength- > K.H." > It is clear from words of Master that Annie Besant was Their true > agent in Esoteric matters and Adyar TS as only true Theosophical >=20 > Is it so clear, or you just want to believe on that? > Now, about the letter from the Master in 1900 > We should analyse it carefully. > First of all.. many people received letters from the masters, the=20 > vast majority as HPB atests us, failed... and Damodar was the only=20 > true sucess. > Maybe the SAINT pedophyle Leadbeater was also a failure... >=20 > Besant having received a letter doesn't mean that SHE was THEIR=20 TRUE=20 > AGENT... this is an exageration. > Whoever a little usefull would be leading the T.S, this person=20 would=20 > receive a letter... it is not because she is Annie Besant, is=20 because=20 > at that present moment it was she, not other, that was responsible=20 > for the T.S..=20 > 1900 was the last year the Masters could have their influence (as=20 we=20 > learn from HPB who sais that every last quarter os a century the=20 > Masters exercise their influence. If they still cared at least a=20 bit=20 > about the T.S they would surely send a last advice... > The letter seem to be sent with an intention of saying `don't let=20 it=20 > die' (the society) > It doesn't seem a letter to give authority to Besant or confirme=20 her=20 > as the only anr true sucesssor of HPB (and we know she wasn't.. and=20 > the E.S Council responsible for the T.S after H.P.B's death=20 nominated=20 > Judge and Besant, and avid for power she couldn't accept not to be=20 > the only one) > You can find some information on the sucessorship right after=20 H.P.B's=20 > death here > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/theos-talk/message/22531 >=20 > The letter's intention seems to be beg Besant to stop the way the=20 T.S=20 > was being led... a last hope... > The same letter would be sent to other if other was in charge... >=20 > Now, let us notice something about the letter > What about its content? > It begins with a strong criticism by the master about the way the=20 T.S=20 > was going... > "A psychic and a pranayamist who has got confused by the vagaries=20 of=20 > the members. The T.S. And its members are slowly MANUFACTURING a=20 > CREED. Says a Tibetan proverb "credulity breeds credulity and ends=20 in=20 > HYPOCRISY." How FEW are they who can KNOW ANYTHINGABOUT US. Are we=20 to=20 > be propitiated and made idols of? Is the worship of a new trinity=20 > made up of the blessed M., Upasika and yourself to take the place=20 of=20 > exploded creeds? We ask NOT for the WORSHIP OF OURSELVES. The=20 > disciple should in no way be fettered. BEWARE OF AN ESOTERIC=20 POPERY." > Doesn't all this support the quotes I posted from Alice Cleather's=20 > book on 25/02? > Besant was being acused by old members to create a creed. And the=20 > Master is warning that the T.S is going on the way to hypocrisy.=20 She=20 > was being criticized by the old and tried members who knew H.P.B=20 that=20 > she didn't accept that someone could think differently from her.=20 And=20 > notice that it was only 7 years latter (if my memory doesn't fail)=20 > that she was caught in Leadbeater's trap... and things went worse=20 and=20 > worse... > The master even compares the T.S with POPERY.. this doesn't seem a=20 > good thing to me > Is this the `wonderfull letter confirming the saint besant as a=20 true=20 > and only sucessor'? as some seem to think.... > And they ask her to stop the worship of themselves... To give=20 > authorithy to her own sayings she started to talk a lot about=20 them..=20 > something you can see that they didn't like... > And if the Master felt necessity to atest that FEW know anything=20 > about them... probably there were some people saying things about=20 > them and and telling that their teachings come from them.. and that=20 > was a lie.=20 > What else can we notice from this letter? >=20 > "The intense desire to see upasika reincarnate at once has raised a=20 > MISLEADING MAYAVIC IDEATION. Upasika has useful work to do on=20 higher=20 > planes and cannot come again so soon. The T.S. must safely be=20 ushered=20 > into the new century. You have for some time been UNDER DELUDING=20 > INFLUENCES. Shun PRIDE, VANITY and LOVE OF POWER. Be not guided by=20 > emotion but learn to stand alone. Be accurate and critical rather=20 > than CREDULOUS. The mistakes of the past in the old religions must=20 > not be glossed over with imaginary explanations." >=20 > All this statements from the Master support what Mrs. Alice=20 Cleather=20 > was trying to show on her book "H.P.B - a great betrayal" > The first sentence refers to something that alice also explains,=20 that=20 > Besant believed that H.P.B was reborn in india and was a child that=20 > was under Besant's influnce. With this argument she publishes the=20 > secret material from the Inner Group (breaking her secrecy pledge,=20 > which should have been sacred to her, unfortunatelly it wasn't...)=20 > She says that the `little HPB' asked her to do so and also that=20 > the "little HPB" asked her to revised and correct [mislead] the S.D=20 > and many other things... > And then the Master himself tells her that she is under a mayavic=20 > ideation. > And the Master himself warned her that she was under delunding=20 > influences (and this is all Mrs. Alice Cleather, M. L=E9vy, W.=20 > Kingsland and others war trying to prove, to protect the new member=20 > to fall into the same trap =96 so what is so wrong about warning=20 people=20 > of something even the master admited to be wrong on Mrs. Besant?) > And the master also seem to agree with Mrs. Cleather and all the=20 > others that Mrs. Besant was showing pride, vanity and love of=20 power,=20 > and that was what was leading her.. not the true `feelings' a real=20 > theosophist should have. > The masters don't interfere in worlds affairs... Besant was head of=20 > the T.S by her own politics and fakes (like confirming that she=20 > herself has destroyed all the proofs that were in favour to Judge).=20 > They didn't nominate her... all they could do is to asure that the=20 > the T.S wasn't going to lead the foul road to popery... and if the=20 > T.S was working well they would NOT have felt the necessity to send=20 a=20 > last letter trying to correct the mistakes > The only good thing we can find in the letter is the final=20 sentence ,=20 > that they STILL haven't given up... But considering the way things=20 > were few years latter this letter... I guess unfortunately we can=20 be=20 > quite sure that the T.S was a dead letter... >=20 > Still in the letter > "NO ONE HAS THE RIGHT TO CLAIM AUTHORITY OVER A PUPIL or his=20 > conscience. Ask him not what he believes. All who are sincere and=20 > pure minded must have admittance. The crest wave of intellectual=20 > advancement must be taken hold of and guided into spirituality. It=20 > CANNOT BE FORCER INTO BELIEFS AND EMOTIONAL WORSHIP." > >> and what has Mr. Leadbeater , supported by Besant, done?????=20 (with=20 > Krishnamurti and maybe others)=20 >=20 > and more criticizm by the Master on the letter > "Misleading secrecy has given the death blow to numerous=20 > organizations." =96 this was arising in the T.S.. little by little... >=20 > "The CANT (hipocrisy) ABOUT the "Masters" MUST be silently but=20 firmly=20 > PUT DOWN.... THE CONTINUAL REFERENCES TO OURSELVES AND THE=20 REPETITION=20 > OF OUR NAMES RAISES UP A CONFUSED AURA THAT HINDERS OUR WORK" >=20 > And what have Mr. Leadbeater and Besant done??? Published works on=20 > the Masters, open to the unfiting public their sacred lifes and=20 > names, and made disrespecful and ridiculous statmens like this ones=20 > above in one of their books >=20 > "In the course of their investigations these two (Besant and > Leadbeater) look up on the one side, the past incarnations of him > whom Mrs. Besant calls the "Master Jesus", that is, of the "Jesus" > born in 105 b.C; and on the other side, the past lives of the being > whom she calls the "Lord Maitreya, the present Bodhisattva, the > Supreme Teacher of the World" whose ego at a given moment replaced > that of "Jesus", this being the last incarnation of the Christ whose > immediate return (as Krishnamurti) she is announcing. > "Let us quote from their account of the incarnations of the "Supreme > Teacher"... > `In the Fourth Root Race we again find the personage supposed to > be "Maitreya" as the husband of the ego claimed by these authors as > that of "Master K.H". Mrs. Besant is again incarnated in the family > as daughter, the eldest sister of the "Master M."; "Maitreya", being > at this time the head of the trime." >=20 >=20 > >>Has Mrs. Besant given atention to Master K.H request to stop=20 > refering to them and using their names? Has she respected his will > No, she made quite the contrary > And for many years the T.S did turned into a creed under=20 Leadbeater's=20 > guidance. >=20 > And now.. Do we have the right to criticize the Masters criticism=20 on=20 > her.. is she this Splendind, wonderful and santificated woman some=20 > are here trying to prove? > Maybe the Inner group members weren't so wrong to criticize her.. > And who are we to judge them.. and to judge assertions of the=20 Master=20 > himself? >=20 >=20 >=20 > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Truth Collins"=20 > wrote: > >=20 > > Did W.Q. Judge appoint Tingley as his successer? I don't think=20 he=20 > > did. I have read articles to this effect. Look in the ULT=20 > articles=20 > > online about Crosbie for more on this. > >=20 > > In my opinion, people like H.P. Blavatsky and W.Q. Judge are=20 born=20 > > already having reached a certain degree of consciousness. Not to=20 > > mention the efforts after being born. For example, in the=20 Tibetan=20 > > tradition high incarnations are found and taught from an early=20 age. > >=20 > > The question of successorship is more compicated than it first=20 > > looks. It is not only a question of anyones accomplishments and=20 > > performance of one's duties but also of degrees of consciousness. > >=20 > > What is the attitude of someone with the degrees of=20 consciousness=20 > > of say H.P. Blavatsky or H.P. Blavatsky? Well, whatever it is,=20 it=20 > > is beneficiant. > >=20 > > Blavatsky and Judge helped the people that are now being argued=20 > > about. This is the attitude that I recommend. An attitude that=20 > > helps the other, if anything. > >=20 > > A. Besant and K. Tingley too. They helped as they saw fit. > >=20 > > This is the common denominator between them. > >=20 > > There is a saying that the least common denominator usually rules=20 a=20 > > conversation. This in a world dominated by the three rulers:=20 > money,=20 > > power and sex. > >=20 > > The inverse seems to be closer to the truth for people like H.P.=20 > > Blavatsky. The higher triad of atma, buddhi, manas is not=20 > > subjugated by peer pressure. > >=20 > > Namaste, Truth C. > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, leonmaurer@a... wrote: > > > Unfortuunately, Besant's strengh ran out and she couldn't hack=20 it=20 > > after she=20 > > > fell for and got caught up in the black magical snares of the=20 > > impostor=20 > > > Leadbeater. I'm sure K.H. was, to say the least, very=20 > > disappointed by that. :-) > > >=20 > > > Lenny Maurer > > >=20 > > > In a message dated 01/29/05 2:03:37 PM, AnandGholap@A... writes: > > >=20 > > > >After splitting of the TS, in 1890s, some people were and=20 still=20 > > are=20 > > > >confused about which society is actually Masters' Society.=20 Judge=20 > > died=20 > > > >in 1896 after appointing Katherin Tingley as his successor.=20 > > > >In 1900 Master K.H. wrote letter to Annie Besant who was the=20 > head=20 > > of=20 > > > >ES-Adyar with following words " The greatest of your trials is=20 > > yet to=20 > > > >come. We watch over you but you must put forth all your=20 strength- >=20=20 > > > >K.H."=20 > > > > > > > >It is clear from words of Master that Annie Besant was Their=20 > true=20 > > > >agent in Esoteric matters and Adyar TS as only true=20 Theosophical=20 > > > >Society.=20 > > > > > > > >Anand Gholap From dalval14@earthlink.net Wed Mar 02 02:27:35 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: dalval14@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 51438 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2005 10:27:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.167) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2005 10:27:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpauth01.mail.atl.earthlink.net) (209.86.89.61) by mta6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2005 10:27:34 -0000 Received: from [209.179.216.104] (helo=DALLAS) by smtpauth01.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1D6R48-0005Sc-8q; Wed, 02 Mar 2005 05:26:53 -0500 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=simple; s=test1; d=earthlink.net; h=Reply-To:From:To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:Importance:In-Reply-To:X-MimeOLE; b=sc43rsqQmmFaEM1V5LH3GYWmrlEF0IxQe1ivNreBg2hOppNxTDWVP9Af7wqvw+j+; To: "AA-BNStudy" Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 02:26:47 -0800 Message-ID: <000401c51f12$599f9470$4bdeb3d1@DALLAS> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 1 (Highest) X-MSMail-Priority: High X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Importance: High In-Reply-To: <422479E5.7090702@idirect.ca> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-ELNK-Trace: c552449649a8b16d1aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec79d2bc57f4996d75d3f6e9fd2797e0840e350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 209.86.89.61 From: "W.Dallas TenBroeck" Reply-To: X-Originating-IP: 209.179.216.104 Subject: RE: Theos-World RE: Self X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=52898573 X-Yahoo-Profile: dalval2 March 2 2005 Dear Mauri: It's a very simple question (to me). YOU at present, this moment, are (to me) a "SELF." [ I may call it: a UNIT, MONAD, THINKER, etc...] You, the SELF, lives in a "body." As we all do. You look forward mentally, and you may have hopes, but nothing is definite until you choose and act. Looking back, (in memory) you can see your choices have made, as "you" the "SELF," in those conditions, and the choices you made then, and the current results. In effect (as I see it) your present environment is the result of your past choices. The "power to choose" resides in the SELF. But in what direction is that choice to be directed? But, ask yourself when does the SELF either 'begin' or 'end.' ? Best wishes, Dallas ========================== -----Original Message----- From: Mauri [mailto:mhart@idirect.ca] Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 6:19 AM To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Theos-World RE: Self W.Dallas TenBroeck wrote: > Mar 1 2005 > > RE: Self > If "you" think of "yourself," you are already thinking of a "self" that has > passed into memory. You are looking backward at what "you (memory) did." > Or, am I wrong? Dallas, are you equating "you" and "self" with "memory" and ... But "memory" has parts to it, so does one pick and choose parts from one's memory to represent "one's self," or what ... and, if so, "who" does that choosing ... and, if so, if that "who" is defined in some manner, "who" does that choosing ... and, if so, if that "who" is defined in some manner, "who" does that choosing ... etc, etc ... ^:-/ ... My more or less current speculation about "self" would seem to suggest that it might be likened (at a stretch ...) to what "one" sees when looking trough a multi-colored, patterned window like the one's they have in some churches (where the "self/one" Is the seeing, itself, rather than some interpretive, second-hand, dualistic memory or karmic influence or colored window). "Just being" meditation for me seems to suggest that it might evolve, at some point, into a kind of transcending of the colors and patterns (karma/maya) in that window. Speculatively, Mauri Yahoo! Groups Links From christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com Wed Mar 02 03:55:27 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 41179 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2005 11:55:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.167) by m17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2005 11:55:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.48) by mta6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2005 11:55:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.1] by n19.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2005 11:55:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.75] by mailer1.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2005 11:55:23 -0000 Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 11:55:19 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <13d.e0826f5.2f56479a@cs.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 594 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.48 From: "christinaleestemaker" X-Originating-IP: 83.85.214.69 Subject: Re: Theos-World Theosophy and information . X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=162317756 X-Yahoo-Profile: christinaleestemaker --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, samblo@c... wrote: Dear John, Do you see what you write: Allotropic, I wrote Allopathical way of treatments. You make a quite nice mix of that! Vr Gr Christina > Christina, > Well your mention of allotropic remedys coaxed me into posting this link. > It details how a young Kalmyk came to study tibetan medicine in a sudden > detour from his conventional study of Medicine. > > Interview with Dr. Sona Koldev > http://www.ittm.org/publications/AyurVijnana/Vol_06/AV_V06_7.htm > > John > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From lalaya7@yahoo.com.br Wed Mar 02 06:46:32 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: lalaya7@yahoo.com.br X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 67447 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2005 14:46:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.167) by m25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2005 14:46:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.20) by mta6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2005 14:46:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.5] by n12.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2005 14:45:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.70] by mailer5.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2005 14:45:42 -0000 Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 14:45:41 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 14988 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.20 From: "Alaya" X-Originating-IP: 200.193.248.243 Subject: Re: Theos-World Master K.H. confirmed Annie Besant as successor X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=160996087 X-Yahoo-Profile: lalaya7 neither did HPB =3D) --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Anand Gholap" =20 wrote: >=20 > Apparently though Katherine Tingley succeeded Judge, she was=20 > not 'appointed' by Judge as his successor. This is despite the fact=20 > that Judge was ill for long time and it was natural for him to=20 > imagine who would be successor if he dies. Yet information=20 available=20 > shows he did not 'appoint' anybody as his successor.=20 > Anand Gholap >=20 > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Alaya" wrote: > >=20 > > we can find in the blavatskyarchieves about Mrs. Tingley > > ". . . Mrs. Katherine Tingley. . . [was] a professional psychic=20 and=20 > > trance medium in New York. . . .For those of us who followed Mr.=20 > > Judge in 1895, later discovered that about the time of H.P.B.'s=20 > death=20 > > or soon after (the exact date is not known to me), Mr. Judge came=20 > > under the influence of this woman, who is possessed of=20 considerable=20 > > hypnotic and other dangerous powers. He had consulted her, in=20 her=20 > > capacity as a medium, which led eventually to her obtaining a=20 > > complete hold over him, and also over Theosophical friends whom=20 he=20 > > introduced to her, and to their accepting her as a Chela of the=20 > > Masters; one for whom Mr. Judge believed he had been told to=20 seek.=20=20 > > She gave him "messages" purporting to be from Them, but=20 > subsequently=20 > > I discovered that most - if not all- of those which he gave out=20 as=20 > > having been received by him had come "through" Mrs. Tingley. The=20 > > whole history of this extraordinary delusion is a long and=20 > > complicated one, some of it being contained in the E.S. documents=20 > in=20 > > my possession.". . .=20 > > T. Collins said: > > "in the Tibetan > > tradition high incarnations are found and taught from an early=20 age." > >=20 > > Anyone can be taught from an early age > > Not necessarily this means a `high incarnation' > >=20 > > "It is not only a question of anyones accomplishments and > > performance of one's duties but also of degrees of consciousness." > >=20 > > Yeah, the degree of consuousness is extremely important... > > And besan was a chela on probation only > > While Judge was an accepted chela 30 years standing > > Even though... they were not a HPB... > >=20 > >=20 > > >>>>>In a message dated 01/29/05 2:03:37 PM, Anand Gholap...=20 writes: > > In 1900 Master K.H. wrote letter to Annie Besant who was the head > > of > > ES-Adyar with following words " The greatest of your trials is > > yet to > > come. We watch over you but you must put forth all your strength- > > K.H." > > It is clear from words of Master that Annie Besant was Their true > > agent in Esoteric matters and Adyar TS as only true Theosophical > >=20 > > Is it so clear, or you just want to believe on that? > > Now, about the letter from the Master in 1900 > > We should analyse it carefully. > > First of all.. many people received letters from the masters, the=20 > > vast majority as HPB atests us, failed... and Damodar was the=20 only=20 > > true sucess. > > Maybe the SAINT pedophyle Leadbeater was also a failure... > >=20 > > Besant having received a letter doesn't mean that SHE was THEIR=20 > TRUE=20 > > AGENT... this is an exageration. > > Whoever a little usefull would be leading the T.S, this person=20 > would=20 > > receive a letter... it is not because she is Annie Besant, is=20 > because=20 > > at that present moment it was she, not other, that was=20 responsible=20 > > for the T.S..=20 > > 1900 was the last year the Masters could have their influence (as=20 > we=20 > > learn from HPB who sais that every last quarter os a century the=20 > > Masters exercise their influence. If they still cared at least a=20 > bit=20 > > about the T.S they would surely send a last advice... > > The letter seem to be sent with an intention of saying `don't let=20 > it=20 > > die' (the society) > > It doesn't seem a letter to give authority to Besant or confirme=20 > her=20 > > as the only anr true sucesssor of HPB (and we know she wasn't..=20 and=20 > > the E.S Council responsible for the T.S after H.P.B's death=20 > nominated=20 > > Judge and Besant, and avid for power she couldn't accept not to=20 be=20 > > the only one) > > You can find some information on the sucessorship right after=20 > H.P.B's=20 > > death here > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/theos-talk/message/22531 > >=20 > > The letter's intention seems to be beg Besant to stop the way the=20 > T.S=20 > > was being led... a last hope... > > The same letter would be sent to other if other was in charge... > >=20 > > Now, let us notice something about the letter > > What about its content? > > It begins with a strong criticism by the master about the way the=20 > T.S=20 > > was going... > > "A psychic and a pranayamist who has got confused by the=20 vagaries=20 > of=20 > > the members. The T.S. And its members are slowly MANUFACTURING a=20 > > CREED. Says a Tibetan proverb "credulity breeds credulity and=20 ends=20 > in=20 > > HYPOCRISY." How FEW are they who can KNOW ANYTHINGABOUT US. Are=20 we=20 > to=20 > > be propitiated and made idols of? Is the worship of a new trinity=20 > > made up of the blessed M., Upasika and yourself to take the place=20 > of=20 > > exploded creeds? We ask NOT for the WORSHIP OF OURSELVES. The=20 > > disciple should in no way be fettered. BEWARE OF AN ESOTERIC=20 > POPERY." > > Doesn't all this support the quotes I posted from Alice=20 Cleather's=20 > > book on 25/02? > > Besant was being acused by old members to create a creed. And the=20 > > Master is warning that the T.S is going on the way to hypocrisy.=20 > She=20 > > was being criticized by the old and tried members who knew H.P.B=20 > that=20 > > she didn't accept that someone could think differently from her.=20 > And=20 > > notice that it was only 7 years latter (if my memory doesn't=20 fail)=20 > > that she was caught in Leadbeater's trap... and things went worse=20 > and=20 > > worse... > > The master even compares the T.S with POPERY.. this doesn't seem=20 a=20 > > good thing to me > > Is this the `wonderfull letter confirming the saint besant as a=20 > true=20 > > and only sucessor'? as some seem to think.... > > And they ask her to stop the worship of themselves... To give=20 > > authorithy to her own sayings she started to talk a lot about=20 > them..=20 > > something you can see that they didn't like... > > And if the Master felt necessity to atest that FEW know anything=20 > > about them... probably there were some people saying things about=20 > > them and and telling that their teachings come from them.. and=20 that=20 > > was a lie.=20 > > What else can we notice from this letter? > >=20 > > "The intense desire to see upasika reincarnate at once has raised=20 a=20 > > MISLEADING MAYAVIC IDEATION. Upasika has useful work to do on=20 > higher=20 > > planes and cannot come again so soon. The T.S. must safely be=20 > ushered=20 > > into the new century. You have for some time been UNDER DELUDING=20 > > INFLUENCES. Shun PRIDE, VANITY and LOVE OF POWER. Be not guided=20 by=20 > > emotion but learn to stand alone. Be accurate and critical rather=20 > > than CREDULOUS. The mistakes of the past in the old religions=20 must=20 > > not be glossed over with imaginary explanations." > >=20 > > All this statements from the Master support what Mrs. Alice=20 > Cleather=20 > > was trying to show on her book "H.P.B - a great betrayal" > > The first sentence refers to something that alice also explains,=20 > that=20 > > Besant believed that H.P.B was reborn in india and was a child=20 that=20 > > was under Besant's influnce. With this argument she publishes the=20 > > secret material from the Inner Group (breaking her secrecy=20 pledge,=20 > > which should have been sacred to her, unfortunatelly it=20 wasn't...)=20 > > She says that the `little HPB' asked her to do so and also that=20 > > the "little HPB" asked her to revised and correct [mislead] the=20 S.D=20 > > and many other things... > > And then the Master himself tells her that she is under a mayavic=20 > > ideation. > > And the Master himself warned her that she was under delunding=20 > > influences (and this is all Mrs. Alice Cleather, M. L=E9vy, W.=20 > > Kingsland and others war trying to prove, to protect the new=20 member=20 > > to fall into the same trap =96 so what is so wrong about warning=20 > people=20 > > of something even the master admited to be wrong on Mrs. Besant?) > > And the master also seem to agree with Mrs. Cleather and all the=20 > > others that Mrs. Besant was showing pride, vanity and love of=20 > power,=20 > > and that was what was leading her.. not the true `feelings' a=20 real=20 > > theosophist should have. > > The masters don't interfere in worlds affairs... Besant was head=20 of=20 > > the T.S by her own politics and fakes (like confirming that she=20 > > herself has destroyed all the proofs that were in favour to=20 Judge).=20 > > They didn't nominate her... all they could do is to asure that=20 the=20 > > the T.S wasn't going to lead the foul road to popery... and if=20 the=20 > > T.S was working well they would NOT have felt the necessity to=20 send=20 > a=20 > > last letter trying to correct the mistakes > > The only good thing we can find in the letter is the final=20 > sentence ,=20 > > that they STILL haven't given up... But considering the way=20 things=20 > > were few years latter this letter... I guess unfortunately we can=20 > be=20 > > quite sure that the T.S was a dead letter... > >=20 > > Still in the letter > > "NO ONE HAS THE RIGHT TO CLAIM AUTHORITY OVER A PUPIL or his=20 > > conscience. Ask him not what he believes. All who are sincere and=20 > > pure minded must have admittance. The crest wave of intellectual=20 > > advancement must be taken hold of and guided into spirituality.=20 It=20 > > CANNOT BE FORCER INTO BELIEFS AND EMOTIONAL WORSHIP." > > >> and what has Mr. Leadbeater , supported by Besant, done?????=20 > (with=20 > > Krishnamurti and maybe others)=20 > >=20 > > and more criticizm by the Master on the letter > > "Misleading secrecy has given the death blow to numerous=20 > > organizations." =96 this was arising in the T.S.. little by=20 little... > >=20 > > "The CANT (hipocrisy) ABOUT the "Masters" MUST be silently but=20 > firmly=20 > > PUT DOWN.... THE CONTINUAL REFERENCES TO OURSELVES AND THE=20 > REPETITION=20 > > OF OUR NAMES RAISES UP A CONFUSED AURA THAT HINDERS OUR WORK" > >=20 > > And what have Mr. Leadbeater and Besant done??? Published works=20 on=20 > > the Masters, open to the unfiting public their sacred lifes and=20 > > names, and made disrespecful and ridiculous statmens like this=20 ones=20 > > above in one of their books > >=20 > > "In the course of their investigations these two (Besant and > > Leadbeater) look up on the one side, the past incarnations of him > > whom Mrs. Besant calls the "Master Jesus", that is, of the "Jesus" > > born in 105 b.C; and on the other side, the past lives of the=20 being > > whom she calls the "Lord Maitreya, the present Bodhisattva, the > > Supreme Teacher of the World" whose ego at a given moment replaced > > that of "Jesus", this being the last incarnation of the Christ=20 whose > > immediate return (as Krishnamurti) she is announcing. > > "Let us quote from their account of the incarnations of=20 the "Supreme > > Teacher"... > > `In the Fourth Root Race we again find the personage supposed to > > be "Maitreya" as the husband of the ego claimed by these authors=20 as > > that of "Master K.H". Mrs. Besant is again incarnated in the=20 family > > as daughter, the eldest sister of the "Master M."; "Maitreya",=20 being > > at this time the head of the trime." > >=20 > >=20 > > >>Has Mrs. Besant given atention to Master K.H request to stop=20 > > refering to them and using their names? Has she respected his will > > No, she made quite the contrary > > And for many years the T.S did turned into a creed under=20 > Leadbeater's=20 > > guidance. > >=20 > > And now.. Do we have the right to criticize the Masters criticism=20 > on=20 > > her.. is she this Splendind, wonderful and santificated woman=20 some=20 > > are here trying to prove? > > Maybe the Inner group members weren't so wrong to criticize her.. > > And who are we to judge them.. and to judge assertions of the=20 > Master=20 > > himself? > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Truth Collins"=20 > > wrote: > > >=20 > > > Did W.Q. Judge appoint Tingley as his successer? I don't think=20 > he=20 > > > did. I have read articles to this effect. Look in the ULT=20 > > articles=20 > > > online about Crosbie for more on this. > > >=20 > > > In my opinion, people like H.P. Blavatsky and W.Q. Judge are=20 > born=20 > > > already having reached a certain degree of consciousness. Not=20 to=20 > > > mention the efforts after being born. For example, in the=20 > Tibetan=20 > > > tradition high incarnations are found and taught from an early=20 > age. > > >=20 > > > The question of successorship is more compicated than it=20 first=20 > > > looks. It is not only a question of anyones accomplishments=20 and=20 > > > performance of one's duties but also of degrees of=20 consciousness. > > >=20 > > > What is the attitude of someone with the degrees of=20 > consciousness=20 > > > of say H.P. Blavatsky or H.P. Blavatsky? Well, whatever it is,=20 > it=20 > > > is beneficiant. > > >=20 > > > Blavatsky and Judge helped the people that are now being=20 argued=20 > > > about. This is the attitude that I recommend. An attitude=20 that=20 > > > helps the other, if anything. > > >=20 > > > A. Besant and K. Tingley too. They helped as they saw fit. > > >=20 > > > This is the common denominator between them. > > >=20 > > > There is a saying that the least common denominator usually=20 rules=20 > a=20 > > > conversation. This in a world dominated by the three rulers:=20 > > money,=20 > > > power and sex. > > >=20 > > > The inverse seems to be closer to the truth for people like=20 H.P.=20 > > > Blavatsky. The higher triad of atma, buddhi, manas is not=20 > > > subjugated by peer pressure. > > >=20 > > > Namaste, Truth C. > > >=20 > > >=20 > > >=20 > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, leonmaurer@a... wrote: > > > > Unfortuunately, Besant's strengh ran out and she couldn't=20 hack=20 > it=20 > > > after she=20 > > > > fell for and got caught up in the black magical snares of the=20 > > > impostor=20 > > > > Leadbeater. I'm sure K.H. was, to say the least, very=20 > > > disappointed by that. :-) > > > >=20 > > > > Lenny Maurer > > > >=20 > > > > In a message dated 01/29/05 2:03:37 PM, AnandGholap@A...=20 writes: > > > >=20 > > > > >After splitting of the TS, in 1890s, some people were and=20 > still=20 > > > are=20 > > > > >confused about which society is actually Masters' Society.=20 > Judge=20 > > > died=20 > > > > >in 1896 after appointing Katherin Tingley as his successor.=20 > > > > >In 1900 Master K.H. wrote letter to Annie Besant who was the=20 > > head=20 > > > of=20 > > > > >ES-Adyar with following words " The greatest of your trials=20 is=20 > > > yet to=20 > > > > >come. We watch over you but you must put forth all your=20 > strength- > >=20=20 > > > > >K.H."=20 > > > > > > > > > >It is clear from words of Master that Annie Besant was Their=20 > > true=20 > > > > >agent in Esoteric matters and Adyar TS as only true=20 > Theosophical=20 > > > > >Society.=20 > > > > > > > > > >Anand Gholap From danielhcaldwell@yahoo.com Wed Mar 02 06:53:09 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: danielhcaldwell@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 74142 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2005 14:53:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.172) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2005 14:53:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.35) by mta4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2005 14:53:07 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: Received: from [66.218.66.58] by n1.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2005 14:53:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.82] by mailer7.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2005 14:53:03 -0000 Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 14:53:01 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 198 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.35 From: "Daniel H. Caldwell" X-Originating-IP: 69.9.21.100 Subject: Some Testimony Concerning Mr. Judge's Close Relationship with Mrs. Tingley X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=39205895 X-Yahoo-Profile: danielhcaldwell Some Testimony Concerning Mr. Judge's Close Relationship with Mrs. Tingley See: http://blavatskyarchives.com/stokestestimonywqjkt.htm Daniel Blavatsky Study Center http://blavatskyarchives.com From danielhcaldwell@yahoo.com Wed Mar 02 06:56:11 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: danielhcaldwell@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 6881 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2005 14:56:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2005 14:56:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.44) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2005 14:56:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.1] by n10.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2005 14:56:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.90] by mailer1.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2005 14:56:10 -0000 Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 14:56:07 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 159 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.44 From: "Daniel H. Caldwell" X-Originating-IP: 69.9.21.100 Subject: William Q. Judge and Katherine A. Tingley X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=39205895 X-Yahoo-Profile: danielhcaldwell William Q. Judge and Katherine A. Tingley See: http://blavatskyarchives.com/stokeswqjktcon.htm Daniel Blavatsky Study Center http://blavatskyarchives.com From danielhcaldwell@yahoo.com Wed Mar 02 07:51:42 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: danielhcaldwell@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 53388 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2005 15:51:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.166) by m25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2005 15:51:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.32) by mta5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2005 15:51:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218