From dharao4@yahoo.co.uk Wed Dec 01 02:49:08 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: dharao4@yahoo.co.uk X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 41390 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2004 10:49:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2004 10:49:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web86906.mail.ukl.yahoo.com) (217.12.13.58) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2004 10:49:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 23575 invoked by uid 60001); 1 Dec 2004 10:48:48 -0000 Message-ID: <20041201104848.23573.qmail@web86906.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.207.134.34] by web86906.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 01 Dec 2004 10:48:48 GMT Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2004 10:48:48 +0000 (GMT) To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 217.12.13.58 From: robert searle Subject: Faqir Chand, and the Higher Self. X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=174372458 X-Yahoo-Profile: dharao4 Dear ALL, I am replying essentially here to Mr. Caldwell, and Mr. Coles. The former makes the very interesting point that it is the Higher Self which is the REAL GURU. Personally, I concur. However, an external master is also vital as he, or she offers something visible, and accessible to our limited five senses to love, and respect. You may have heard of Faqir Chand easily traceable on the internet. He was a respected shabd yoga mystic who was regarded as God in human form by his devotees. However, whenever they wrote or talked about their inner, and outer miracles with Him Chand confessed that he knew nothing about them...even though He was meant to be omniscient, omnipresent, and omnipotent!!! To some RS purists this suggested that he was not a real master, or Sant Satguru. Yet, Chand gave an interesting, and unusual spin on this situation. He said that it was the devotees belief, and love in Him which prompted a whole variety of inner, and outer miracles connected with Himself. He also notably made the point that the same thing would happen even if the master were not perfect!!! I personally believe the above is the most likely truth. I feel there is a part of us all that exists beyond time, and space. It is our Higher Self or rather our future Perfected Self which can using a variety of guises help us in our spiritual evolution. Outer gurus, or teachers act as the visible means to reach the invisible. It may well be that no Sant Satguru has to be perfect absolutely in the moral sense as our Higher Self, or Perfected Self in this bizarre Mono-Drama. When Sant Mat says we need to seek a Perfect Master, it may well really mean we need to seek our Perfect, or Higher Self via a visible guru. Since, the Self is really our God it would through a Sat Satguru being able to connect us to the Sound Current. It is important to understand that shabd yoga should not be confused with nada yoga. Though both are concerned with inner sound the latter only deals with the lower ones of the astral planes. I see Mr. Coles and someone called Babara have been hearing the audible manifestation of spirit. Scott-Rogo once wrote a two volume book on this subject simply called NAD. ___________________________________________________________ Moving house? Beach bar in Thailand? New Wardrobe? Win £10k with Yahoo! Mail to make your dream a reality. Get Yahoo! Mail www.yahoo.co.uk/10k From dalval14@earthlink.net Wed Dec 01 03:34:10 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: dalval14@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 7035 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2004 11:34:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2004 11:34:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net) (209.86.89.69) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2004 11:34:08 -0000 Received: from [209.179.128.83] (helo=DALLAS) by smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1CZSdw-0002eN-5P; Wed, 01 Dec 2004 06:27:34 -0500 To: "AA-BNStudy" Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2004 03:27:11 -0800 Message-ID: <000101c4d798$bf2d14a0$5380b3d1@DALLAS> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 1 (Highest) X-MSMail-Priority: High X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Importance: High X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 In-Reply-To: X-ELNK-Trace: c552449649a8b16d1aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec7976bdb58979f661640ba20fa8cb2f1228350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 209.86.89.69 From: "W.Dallas TenBroeck" Reply-To: X-Originating-IP: 209.179.128.83 Subject: RE: [theosophia] Re: A Prophecy about the T.S. in India X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=52898573 X-Yahoo-Profile: dalval2 Nov 30 2004 AN OLD PROPHECY=20 This old prophecy about the THEOSOPHICAL SOCIETY has been published before, but ought to be given consideration, now that we have just passed the 129th year of its founding on November 17th. Best wishes, Dallas =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D AN OLD PROPHECY ABOUT THE THEOSOPHICAL SOCIETY=20 A PRECURSOR TO THEOSOPHICAL SOCIETY =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =20 A Yogis Prophecy =20=20 What appears to have been a forerunner of The Theosophical Society=20 in India was the Samarasa Veda Sanmarga Sangham, founded in 1867 by=20 Ramalingam Swami a famous South Indian Yogi, to spread the=20 principle of Universal Brotherhood and propagate the true doctrine of the= =20 Vedas.=20 The lofty ethics of this teachings were not popular, mostly=20 because he preached against caste, saying that the distinction=20 between races and castes would eventually cease and Universal=20 Brotherhood would be accepted.=20 Towards the end of his life Ramalingam Yogi made the following=20 astonishing prophecy, and made it repeatedly: =20 "You are not ready to become members of this Society of Universal=20 Brotherhood. The real members of that Brotherhood are living far=20 away, towards the north of India. You do not listen to me. Yet the=20 time is not far off when persons from Russia, America and other=20 foreign lands will come to India and preach to you the same=20 doctrine of Universal Brotherhood. Then only will you know and=20 appreciate the grand truths that I am vainly trying to make you to=20 accept.=20 You will soon find that the Brothers who live in the far North will work a= =20 great many wonders in India, and thus confer incalculable benefits=20 upon this our country." =20 These facts are recorded in " Hints on Esoteric Theosophy" by=20 Pandit Velayudam, a pupil of Ramalingam and Tamil Professor of the=20 Presidency College, Madras, who adds this note: "This prophecy has in my opinion just been literally fulfilled. The=20 facts that the Mahatmas in the North exist is no new idea to us=20 Hindus; and the strange fact that the advent of Madame Blavatsky=20 and Colonel Olcott from Russia and America was foretold several years=20 before they came to India is an incontrovertible proof that my guru=20 was in contact with those Mahatmas under whose direction the=20 Theosophical Society was subsequently founded."=20 =20 H.P. Blavatsky comments on these remarks of Pandit Velayudam: This is one of those cases of previous foretelling of a coming=20 event, which is least of all open to suspicious of bad faith. The=20 honorable character of the witness, the wide publicity of his=20 Guru's announcements, and the impossibility that he could have got from=20 public rumor, or the journals of the day, any intimation that the=20 Theosophical Society would operate in India - all these conspire to=20 support the inference that Ramalingam Yogi was verily in the=20 counsels of Those who ordered us to found the Society.=20 In March 1873 we were directed to proceed from Russia to Paris.=20 In June 1873 we were told to proceed to the United States where we=20 arrived July 6th .=20 This was the very time when Ramalingam was most forcibly=20 refiguring the events that should happen.=20 In October 1874 we received an intimation to do to Chittenden, Vermont,=20 where, at the famous homestead of the Eddy family, Colonel Olcott was=20 engaged in making his investigations - now so celebrated in the annals of= =20 Spiritualism - of the so called "materialization of Spirits."=20=20=20 =20 November 1975 the Theosophical Society was founded, and it was not=20 until 1878 that the correspondence began with friends in India=20 which resulted in the transfer of the Society's Headquarters to Bombay=20 in February 1879. =20 Note. Ramalingam Yogi died or rather "disappeared," in 1874, at=20 Valadur near Chidambaram his birthplace.=20 At Valadur he built a dharmasala, or mission house, where the poor were=20 given and are still given, food and shelter free. He is credited with occult=20 powers which enable him to perform what are called miracles,=20 quenching fire, turning water into oil, changing carnivorous people=20 into vegetarians.=20 His Tiru Arutpa (Path of Light) is among the masterpieces of the Tamil literature. ------------------------------------------- =20 Extracted from the article: "The Progressive Founding of the T.S."=20=20 written by J. L. Davidge=20 published in THEOSOPHIST, July 1939. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Many thanks Erica and Steve I am going to give this a wider circulation if you don't mind Thanks for finding it. Dallas=20=20=20 Nov 30 2004 From compiler@wisdomworld.org Wed Dec 01 12:05:59 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: compiler@wisdomworld.org X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 79811 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2004 20:05:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2004 20:05:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ams006.ftl.affinity.com) (216.219.253.152) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2004 20:05:57 -0000 Received: from wisdomworld.org ([68.55.92.204]) by ams006.ftl.affinity.com with ESMTP id <366451-18539>; Wed, 1 Dec 2004 15:05:03 -0500 Message-ID: <41AE238B.C471FC4D@wisdomworld.org> Date: Wed, 01 Dec 2004 15:03:22 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 216.219.253.152 From: Compiler Subject: 24 articles about JESUS in the "LIGHT OF THEOSOPHY" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=46028585 X-Yahoo-Profile: john_compiler_wisdomworld I hope that many readers, especially newcomers to theosophy, will find this collection of articles about JESUS, all presented in the bright and profound "Light of Theosophy", to be very informative and useful and that they will greatly add to the various views that people everywhere have about him -- giving much food-for-thought for everyone to ponder over, concerning what he was all about. All of the articles are from THEOSOPHY magazine, and are on my WisdomWorld.org web site. These 1st two articles are taken from the 166-article "Setting the Stage" Introductory book. They are the 2nd and 3rd articles in the 29-part "GREAT THEOSOPHISTS" series that runs from article number 130 to 158 in the book. This is the link to the index page where you can see the titles of all 166 articles in the book. They are numbers (131) and (132): http://www.wisdomworld.org/setting.html If you don't want to scroll down the Index page to get to them, these are their direct links: (131) Great Theosophists: Jesus, the Christ (Part 1 of 2): http://www.wisdomworld.org/setting/jesusone.html (132) Great Theosophists: Jesus, the Christ (Part 2 of 2): http://www.wisdomworld.org/setting/jesustwo.html ================================================ These next 6 articles about Jesus are from THE CHRISTIAN SCHEME, 36-part series. They are numbers 11, 21, 22, 23, 24, and 25 in it -- followed by a 7th article here which is an additional article that follows the series, and is number (37). If for some reason the links to them are broken because of their length, this shorter link is to the 5th of 18 sections on the "Additional" articles Index page that is entitled "CHRISTIANITY IN THE 'LIGHT OF THEOSOPHY'". The link to the series is the 1st one that's listed in it: http://www.wisdomworld.org/additional/index.html#5 If you don't want to scroll down the Index page to get to them, and they are not broken here, these are their direct links: (11) GNOSIS AND CHRISTIANITY: Jesus-Logos-Christos: http://www.wisdomworld.org/additional/christianity/Jesus-Logos-Christos.html (21) JESUS: A True Nazarene: http://www.wisdomworld.org/additional/christianity/Jesus-ATrueNazarene.html (22) JESUS: A Great Reformer: http://www.wisdomworld.org/additional/christianity/Jesus-AGreatReformer.html (23) JESUS: Various Views: http://www.wisdomworld.org/additional/christianity/Jesus-VariousViews.html (24) JESUS: Was He Unique?: http://www.wisdomworld.org/additional/christianity/Jesus-WasHeUnique.html (25) JESUS: Buddha, Jesus, Apollonius: http://www.wisdomworld.org/additional/christianity/JesusBuddhaApollonius.html This next one is the "additional" article. It's about the first of the so-called Christian "heresies". It's all about the physical death of Jesus and his physical resurrection: (37) THE DOCETAE: http://www.wisdomworld.org/additional/christianity/TheDocetae.html ====================================== These next articles about Jesus are a 12-part series that is entitled: JESUS: INITIATE AND TEACHER The articles all have the same name and are only numbered under the title. And as with the above 6 articles from "The Christian Scheme" series, it's also found in the 5th of 18 sections on the "Additional" articles Index page that is entitled "CHRISTIANITY IN THE 'LIGHT OF THEOSOPHY'". The link to the series is the 5th one that's listed in it: http://www.wisdomworld.org/additional/index.html#5 ================================================== These next 3 articles about Jesus are from the grouping of articles entitled: A LISTING OF 329 COLLATED ARTICLES If for some reason the links are broken because of their length, this shorter link is to the section on the "Additional" articles Index page that is entitled "A Listing of 329 Collated Articles" (it's the 12th of 18 sections on the page). Then click on the only link that's found in it to the alphabetized Index page, and scroll down to the articles which are each listed the way you see the titles just below: http://www.wisdomworld.org/additional/index.html#12 If you don't want to scroll down the Index page to get to them, and they are not broken here, these are their direct links: JESUS AND HIS TEACHING: http://www.wisdomworld.org/additional/ListOfCollatedArticles/JesusAndHisTeaching.html JESUS: PHILOSOPHER AND REFORMER: http://www.wisdomworld.org/additional/ListOfCollatedArticles/JesusPhilosAndReformer.html WHO CRUCIFIES THE CHRIST?: http://www.wisdomworld.org/additional/ListOfCollatedArticles/WhoCrucifiesTheChrist.html ================================ Dear newcomers to Theosophy: I sincerely do hope that my web site offers a well-rounded overall view of Theosophy and the Theosophical Movement. The 3 main links to everything on it are found below. Please know that I'm only the compiler of all the articles found on my web site; I'm not a scholar; and also that I personally do not like to take part in conversations, even though I do hope that what I present from time to time will help a little in the discussions being carried on by others. So please do not be insulted when I do not respond if someone addresses me, or addresses anything that is found in any of the articles on my web site; I leave that for others to deal with if they want to -- whether pro, con, neutral, friendly or unfriendly. John DeSantis (Compiler) ------- You may find a great deal of the Truth that you are searching for here: WisdomWorld.org web site (Main Page): http://www.wisdomworld.org This is the Index page of the "Introductory", "Setting the Stage" book, which was especially compiled for newcomers to Theosophy: http://www.wisdomworld.org/setting.html The page where "Additional" articles are slowly being added (which contains 18 sections that can each be clicked on at the top of the page in order to go directly down to them, as well as to get the link to any particular section that you may want to use in a posting on a discussion board, or in an e-mail to someone): http://www.wisdomworld.org/additional/index.html "PUBLIC & PRIVATE ENTERPRISE DEVELOPMENT FORUM": This next link is to the most updated version of my economic proposal to humanity, a practical project to help our suffering world that I also consider to be Theosophical. In it you will find a new and unique, but mostly unknown, economic system model that might be able to put an end to involuntary poverty on earth. How? It presents a way to fully finance everything of importance that is needed in every nation. Because of this it's well worth pointing to. Please note that, for strategic reasons, of wanting it to have the best chance of being accepted by all peoples worldwide, no matter what their religious, philosophical, and scientific beliefs are, I've put it on a completely different web site; it contains no mention of, or link to, the Theosophy and the Theosophical Movement that is presented on my WisdomWorld.org web site: http://www.PublicAndPrivateEnterprise.org ------- From dharao4@yahoo.co.uk Wed Dec 01 13:46:14 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: dharao4@yahoo.co.uk X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 10598 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2004 21:46:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2004 21:46:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web86906.mail.ukl.yahoo.com) (217.12.13.58) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2004 21:46:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 92098 invoked by uid 60001); 1 Dec 2004 21:46:07 -0000 Message-ID: <20041201214607.92091.qmail@web86906.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.207.134.106] by web86906.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 01 Dec 2004 21:46:07 GMT Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2004 21:46:07 +0000 (GMT) To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 217.12.13.58 From: robert searle Subject: Theosophical Economics, and DeSantis........... X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=174372458 X-Yahoo-Profile: dharao4 Dear ALL Apart from DeSantis collection of Christian literature put on-line at Theos-Talk I was fascinated to see his ideas on Economics. Apart from Multi-Dimensional Science in R&D I am also the inventor of Transfinancial Economics in R&D. DeSantis might be interested in the latter, and can find out more at the XAT community website but would have to use the cached button to get a copy of my writings. Robert Searle ___________________________________________________________ ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun! http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From leonmaurer@a... Wed Dec 01 20:00:07 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: LeonMaurer@a... X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 57851 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2004 04:00:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2004 04:00:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d20.mx.aol.com) (205.188.139.136) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2004 04:00:05 -0000 Received: from LeonMaurer@a... by imo-d20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v37_r3.8.) id r.df.7d39739 (14374) for ; Wed, 1 Dec 2004 22:58:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2004 22:58:21 EST To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Mac sub 45 X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 205.188.139.136 From: leonmaurer@a... Subject: Re: Theos-World Theosophical Economics, and DeSantis........... X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4099972 X-Yahoo-Profile: leonmaurer1 Can't read your articles -- since the only things that are cached are the dead links on xat home page. As for "Multi-Dimensional Science, check out... http://tellworld.com/Astro.Biological.Coenergetics. Be interested in reading your take on the subject. Leon Maurer In a message dated 12/01/04 6:00:03 PM, dharao4@y... writes: >Dear ALL > > > > Apart from DeSantis collection of Christian > >literature put on-line at Theos-Talk I was fascinated > >to see his ideas on Economics. Apart from > >Multi-Dimensional Science in R&D I am also the > >inventor of Transfinancial Economics in R&D. DeSantis > >might be interested in the latter, and can find out > >more at the XAT community website but would have to > >use the cached button to get a copy of my writings. > > > > Robert Searle From dharao4@y... Thu Dec 02 03:02:53 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: dharao4@y... X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 69600 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2004 11:02:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2004 11:02:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web86901.mail.ukl.yahoo.com) (217.12.13.53) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2004 11:02:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 58332 invoked by uid 60001); 2 Dec 2004 11:02:47 -0000 Message-ID: <20041202110247.58330.qmail@w...> Received: from [217.207.134.34] by web86901.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 02 Dec 2004 11:02:47 GMT Date: Thu, 2 Dec 2004 11:02:47 +0000 (GMT) To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 217.12.13.53 From: robert searle Subject: Leon Mauren, and the XAT Website. X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=174372458 X-Yahoo-Profile: dharao4 Dear Mr. Mauren, and Company There should be no problem accessing my material on the XAT website using the Cached button even though the links are dead. Again use google and key Multi-Dimensional Science, and the Progress of Humanity and you should get a whole series of writings readily accessible. Likewise, use google key in Non-Taxation Revolution which should lead to cached entries on the contents of this paper, and to a basic introduction on the subject of Transfinancial Economics in R&D. Multi-Dimensional Science is also in R&D. Using google key in the words Greater Clarification on Inflation Control, and this should lead you to a contents page (of recent posts), and to a whole series of writings. Please note that the first part of the Transifinancial Economics paper can be found after section or "chapter" 9 of it if I recall rightly, and is titled Legal Access to Financial Power. I am may be setting up an independant site not hosted by XAT community as I have been having some problems with them. Stay tuned. I must thank Leon Maurens link to his website, and I have yet to fully understand it before passing any comments. ___________________________________________________________ Moving house? Beach bar in Thailand? New Wardrobe? Win £10k with Yahoo! Mail to make your dream a reality. Get Yahoo! Mail www.yahoo.co.uk/10k From danielhcaldwell@y... Thu Dec 02 09:53:38 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: danielhcaldwell@y... X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 66841 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2004 17:53:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2004 17:53:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.42) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2004 17:53:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.5] by n8.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Dec 2004 17:52:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by mailer5.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Dec 2004 17:52:35 -0000 Date: Thu, 02 Dec 2004 17:52:28 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1114 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.42 From: "Daniel H. Caldwell" X-Originating-IP: 69.9.20.19 Subject: Review by Katinka Hesselink of "The Judge Case" book by Ernest E. Pelletier X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=39205895 X-Yahoo-Profile: danielhcaldwell Recently the following book was published: The Judge Case: A Conspiracy Which Ruined the Theosophical Cause by Ernest E. Pelletier Ordering information can be found at: http://www.theosophycanada.com/ets_judge_case.pdf Katinka Hesselink, editor of Lucifer7, has now written and published an informative review of this book in the latest December 2004 issue of Lucifer7. See: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lucifer7/message/17 I have reprinted the review in an easier format to print at: http://blavatskyarchives.com/judgecasereviewbykatinka.htm Katinka also compiled a more complete table of contents for the book under review. I have also created a pdf version of this more complete table that will be easier to read and print out at: http://blavatskyarchives.com/wqjcasetableofcontents.pdf I am hoping that Ernest Pelletier will respond to Katinka's review on this Theos-Talk forum which is open to the public and is also indexed by Google. Later I plan to add a few comments of my own on "The Judge Case" book and also on Katinka's review. Daniel H. Caldwell BLAVATSKY STUDY CENTER http://hpb.cc From mhart@i... Thu Dec 02 12:33:59 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: mhart@i... X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 72916 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2004 20:33:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2004 20:33:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO keymaster.look.ca) (207.136.80.9) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2004 20:33:57 -0000 Received: from [199.243.58.117] (helo=idirect.ca) by keymaster.look.ca with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1CZxe5-0005vS-Cb for theos-talk@yahoogroups.com; Thu, 02 Dec 2004 20:33:45 +0000 Message-ID: <41AF7C9B.3060902@i...> Date: Thu, 02 Dec 2004 15:35:39 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win 9x 4.90; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: theos-talk X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: mhart@i... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psi.look.ca X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-100.0 required=9.0 tests=USER_IN_WHITELIST autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Version: 3.1 (built Tue Feb 24 05:09:27 GMT 2004) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 207.136.80.9 From: Mauri Subject: re teachings/Masters today and in ancient Egypt, South America and elsewhere X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60894584 X-Yahoo-Profile: sunzenn re teachings/Masters today and in ancient Egypt, South America and elsewhere According to Inca/Andean legend, the Nazca lines were made by "namesakes of Virachoca" (page 43, FINGER-PRINTS OF THE GODS by Graham Hancock). Apparently Virachoca (translated as "Foam of the Sea") was said to have appeared after much destruction by a deluge. He was described as a white, bearded man in a robe. Page 46: <> In ancient Egypt a similar teacher was named Osiris, apparently offering similar instructions. And according to the Chaldean scribe, Berosus, another such teacher was Oannes. Page 81: <> In short, I'm wondering if there might be a connection between the Nazca lines and modern day crop circles, and if both might be regarded as the works of Masters who might want to alert and remind people that a greater reality exists, a reality that transcends the conventional/orthodox materialistic trends. Seems to me that the persistent, ongoing appearance of numerous, complex crop circles around the world is flying in the face of orthodox/conventional attitudes. Speculatively, Mauri From perrycoles@yahoo.com Thu Dec 02 18:24:35 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: perrycoles@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 73340 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2004 02:24:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2004 02:24:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.41) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2004 02:24:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.69.1] by n7.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2004 02:23:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by mailer1.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2004 02:23:58 -0000 Date: Fri, 03 Dec 2004 02:23:58 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2697 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.41 From: "Perry Coles" X-Originating-IP: 203.59.158.9 Subject: Re: Review by Katinka Hesselink of "The Judge Case" book by Ernest E. Pelletier X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=93736069 X-Yahoo-Profile: perrycoles Thanks Daniel and Katinka This is a good article.... It's interesting how this concept of a "successor" is an issue of great debate in the various Theosophical Societies. A similar problem is in the various Radhasoami groups who all argue over "successor =96ship". While in the Radhasoami's I can understand why there is an issue over this due to their belief in need for a "perfect Master" to guide the initiates. In Theosophy however there is no such concept as each student must walk his or her own path. Is this need for "successors" based in the need for a rescuer or perhaps a hangover from the old hierarchical mindset and "divine Kings and Queens" being crowned with power from on high or perhaps HPB's highly "magnetised" Divine Ring of power. Maybe both Judge and Besant where still of this ilk. De Purucker's writings also express this authoritarian / hierarchical type of mindset of course it goes without saying CWL was a complete shocker when it came to pronouncements and his belief in superiority of the ruling classes. It's interesting that the society was set up on a democratic system rather than an autocracy or some kind of theosophical monarchy with "successors". It's a shame that the society fell into the trap of guru following and this nonsense idea of successor-ship and divine oracles, rather than implementing the principles of democracy on which the society was established. Perry --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Daniel H. Caldwell" wrote: >=20 > Recently the following book was published: >=20 > The Judge Case: A Conspiracy Which > Ruined the Theosophical Cause > by Ernest E. Pelletier >=20 > Ordering information can be found at: >=20 > http://www.theosophycanada.com/ets_judge_case.pdf >=20 > Katinka Hesselink, editor of Lucifer7, has > now written and published an informative review of > this book in the latest December 2004 > issue of Lucifer7. See: >=20 > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lucifer7/message/17 >=20 > I have reprinted the review in an easier format > to print at: >=20 > http://blavatskyarchives.com/judgecasereviewbykatinka.htm >=20 > Katinka also compiled a more complete table of contents > for the book under review. I have also created a pdf version > of this more complete table that will be easier to read > and print out at: >=20 > http://blavatskyarchives.com/wqjcasetableofcontents.pdf >=20 > I am hoping that Ernest Pelletier will respond to Katinka's > review on this Theos-Talk forum which is open to the public > and is also indexed by Google. >=20 > Later I plan to add a few comments of my own on "The Judge > Case" book and also on Katinka's review. >=20 > Daniel H. Caldwell > BLAVATSKY STUDY CENTER > http://hpb.cc From bta101@hotmail.com Thu Dec 02 19:54:11 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: bta101@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 41785 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2004 03:54:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2004 03:54:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21a.bulk.scd.yahoo.com) (66.94.237.50) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2004 03:54:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.59] by n21.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2004 03:54:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by mailer8.bulk.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2004 03:54:06 -0000 Date: Fri, 03 Dec 2004 03:53:40 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1934 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: groups-compose X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.94.237.50 From: "bta1012003" X-Originating-IP: 63.202.173.223 Subject: Re: THE RADHASOAMI FAITH, AND THEOSOPHY. X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118449510 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta1012003 > > Hi Barbara, > Its interesting that you've had this experience as well. > My experience was that it started off sounding as if it was above my > head or outside of myself as the sound became more intense I seemed to > merge into the sound and become apart of it rather than it being > separate from me. > > Its interesting that this experience and some others happened around a > time of great transition in my life. > The explanation of the "sound" being that of the `ethers' is quite > possible but I don't know for sure. > It certainly was a profound experience for me at any rate. > > What are the impressions you have with your experiences ? > > Perry Hi Perry: Reading your statements above makes me think that your experience is more of a spiritual nature than mine, because mine lacks the quality you described and I never merged into the sound. When I first started to meditate with a Buddhist group, over three decades ago, there were times I heard a piercing, high pitch ring in my ears. I learned, subsequently, (and it seems reasonable to me,) that I was hearing my own nerves. But, there was one time, deep in meditation, that I heard the sweet melodic sound of a flute. Later on, for about a year or more, I heard a loud, thunderous, noise. It happened every time before I left my body. It was not a pleasant sensation, due to its deafening character. I am glad that had ceased many years ago. In recent years I often hear the sound of silence, it is like the sound one hears upon walking into a hollow cave. I am guessing that it has to do with moving through the etheric web that is on the top of the head center to the outside of the body. These are my observations that I collected from my practice. I never intentionally seek or even think much about these sounds. They are just byproducts of different states of consciousness. Best to you, barbara > From dalval14@earthlink.net Thu Dec 02 21:14:49 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: dalval14@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 42001 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2004 05:14:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2004 05:14:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpauth07.mail.atl.earthlink.net) (209.86.89.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2004 05:14:48 -0000 Received: from [209.179.216.15] (helo=DALLAS) by smtpauth07.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1Ca5m9-00007G-AU; Fri, 03 Dec 2004 00:14:45 -0500 To: Date: Thu, 2 Dec 2004 21:10:21 -0800 Message-ID: <003b01c4d8f6$fb0b4230$e293b3d1@DALLAS> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 1 (Highest) X-MSMail-Priority: High X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Importance: High X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 In-Reply-To: X-ELNK-Trace: c552449649a8b16d1aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec79fccf26812d6dee9d8085c10f6e7d8c31350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 209.86.89.67 From: "W.Dallas TenBroeck" Reply-To: X-Originating-IP: 209.179.216.15 Subject: RE: [bn-study] Re: Chapter 2, page 15 - Akasha and the Astral Light X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=52898573 X-Yahoo-Profile: dalval2 Dec 1 2004 The following may also be of help ABSOLUTE =96 An Analogy UNIVERSAL ALL =3D=3D A PRESENCE =94Paranishpanna, remember, is the summum bonum, the Absolute, hence the sa= me as Paranirvana. Besides being the final state it is that condition of subjectivity which has no relation to anything but the one absolute truth (Param=E2rthasatya) on its plane. It is that state which leads one to appreciate correctly the full meaning of Non-Being, which, as explained, is absolute Being. Sooner or later, all that now seemingly exists, will be in reality and actually in the state of Paranishpanna. But there is a great difference between conscious and unconscious =93being.=94 The condition of Paranishpanna, without Param=E2rtha, the Self-analysing consciousness (Svasamvedana), is no bliss, but simply extinction (for Seven Eternities). Thus, an iron ball placed under the scorching rays of the sun will get heated through, but will not feel or appreciate the warmth, while a man will. It is only =93with a mind clear and undarkened by personality, and a= n assimilation of the merit of manifold existences devoted to being in its collectivity (the whole living and sentient Universe),=94 that one gets rid= of personal existence, merging into, becoming one with, the Absolute,* and continuing in full possession of Param=E2rtha. "=20 S D I 53-4 -------------------------------------------------------------- The Shirt-tail Saints Figures of speech or analogies seem to be absolutely essential to express the realities of Profundity. The direct meaning of language does not express the actuality of the Higher Consciousness. We might say that the Actuality envelopes the expression but is not directly contained in it. Thus the reader should strive not so much to understand the formal meaning contained in these writings, but to make a certain turn In his own consciousness toward a Matrix that surrounds expression. He should concentrate upon faint stirring in his consciousness which he cannot really express, even to himself. They constitute a certain =91plus= =92 quality added onto the formal meaning.=20=20 The formal meaning serves as a sort of focal point that entrains the subtle =91plus value. It is very hard to reach the latter without the use of a fo= cal point until a rather high level of spiritual development is attained. Henc= e it remains important to employ various means of expression. But if the expression is taken too much in the rigorous or defined sense, the real and deeper Meaning is lost. Therefore, the words of an Illumined Man should never be taken in the literal sense when He is giving a cross-translation from the Beyond. = =20 Now, the =91plus=92 quality at first is almost indistinguishable from nothi= ng or emptiness. It is like a breath that has just escaped, a momentary gleam caught from the corner of the eye that disappears when the full focus of sight is turned upon it. It must be reached for very gently, as one must act in seeking the confidence of a defenseless and fearful creature of the wilds. One should reach out almost as though not reaching at all. A time will come when This that is so very subtle will be transformed into = a Presence more palpable and stronger than the roughest granite. It will manifest a Power so great that It will dissolve not only the immediate fiel= d but even the whole universe.=20=20 But the Great Power is rarely in the beginning a clearly dominant force, an= d It must be assimilated very carefully or It will disappear in the first stages. In the beginning it may seem that one is walking a tight-rope over unmeasured spaces, and the necessary balance is extremely hard to hold. In the end the rope becomes all Space, the Supreme Support of all universes bu= t Itself in need of no support.=20=20 Visible man, in that case, has been transformed and has become the all-containing Matrix. No longer, then, does he struggle to keep his balance on a rope, but he finds Himself everywhere and therefore Invulnerable. (Pathways Through to Space, p. 147) "The immediate effect of a state of consciousness having a one-way dependence on, or relation to the subject, and no object, is that of a vast void. It is an "I" suspended in an utter voidness. At once a process of "enantio-dromia" [Jung, Psychological Types, 541-42.] transforms the voidness into the value of substantial fullness. This is a "thickness" tha= t I am quite sure would much more than meet James's requirement.=20=20 I know of no empiric content that in the faintest degree suggests this quality of fullness, which is the actual palpable Presence of Divinity itself. It is nothing so crude as a vast person in space, but a Presence that permeates all space, interwoven throughout the objects of ordinary consciousness, yet more completely present where those objects are not. = =20 The effect is a radical reversal of all former values, and a resolution of many of just those problems to which empiricism can give no satisfactory answer." (Transformations in Consciousness, p. 112) [from AQUARIAN THEOSOPHIST, Supp., Jan 2004 ] ----------------------------------------------------------- Here below are some of the best contributions received. Why not use the idea of UNIVERSAL SPIRIT for that which in religions has been designated =93God?=94 It is UNIVERSAL BROTHERHOOD as a living fact. = It has always been there and will continue to be there, and we will always be in and with IT. Its beginnings (and ours) are of the same duration, and that cannot be measured in terms of whet we call time, distance or motion. Call it a sublime IDEA. Some of these concepts can appeal to us and we can then use them as avenues of thought to universalize IT, and those will cause us to see it first in ourselves as our dearest friend, and closest tutor, and then, if we reach out to the radiance in everything, we will sense it in a daisy, the Sun, ou= r friends and family, in a grain of sand or a cloud, in the roaring fire or tinkling brook - wherever we may project or stretch our minds -- there some for, of LIFE IS. Then, if we agree that we can see God everywhere, who are we to change or destroy that presence or manifestation and to be tyrants or oppressors ? I= f we think God is all-knowledge , and is omnipresent, then we cannot hide -- ever. Nor can we =91escape=92 from the consequences of our choices. There is an old hymn or verse that says:=20=20 =93Never was I not, never was I not.=94 Never will I cease to be. Never the Spirit was IT not, Beginnings and ends are but dreams.=94 ------------------------------------------------- Questions: How can we exit from Materialism? A. -- How often in framing our concepts do we rely on our education? Almost all the time. At what point do we begin to question some of the basics that were given to us as facts and truths, and which we later find out are only hypotheses? What is an atom, what makes it move? What is electricity, magnetism, light, what causes these, and why are they always described in terms of their effects and not in terms of their actual causes ? True that for our present Western frame of mind (as well as often in the East as well) the term =93God=94 is employed to designate a Power, a stabil= izing unity in design and purpose, which we may hope will turn to our help if, by some method of worship or propitiation we secure its specific attention to us. How can our whole world with all its differences ? =85 How can a whole Galaxy exist, and seemingly run in good order -- that is still mainly unexplored by us ? =85 How can we delve into our own psyche and mind - stil= l largely not in our control ? =85 What have we ? =85 Blind alleys, or horizo= ns of hope and encouragement to widen our range of understanding ? Then comes th= e death of the physical body. Is all lost or is there a continuance ? What is the purpose of so complex a situation? What evidence can we assemble to prove or disprove the Theosophical propositions about the nature of the Universe and our role as humans in it = ? Perhaps it is well that there is no finality and that our curiosity is left with an open field in which to grow, to ever grow ? --------------------------------------------- HOW TO STUDY THEOSOPHY =96=20 Commander Bowen quotes HPB=92s 4 main points. Since most of the quotes that we will discuss come from SD, I hope the following extracts from Robert Bowen's notes of personal teachings given by H.P.B. to private pupils during the years 1888 to 1891 on how to study SD may be of some help. "At last we have managed to get H.P.B. to put us right on the matter of the study of the S.D. Let me get it down while it is all fresh in mind.=20 Reading the S.D. page by page as one reads any other book (she says) will only end us in confusion.=20 The first thing to do, even if it takes years, is to get some grasp of the "Three Fundamental Principles" given in the Proem. Follow that up by study of the Recapitulation -- the numbered items in the Summing Up to Vol. I. (Part 1.). Then take the Preliminary Notes (Vol. II.) and the Conclusion (Vol. II.)......=20 She talked a good deal about the "Fundamental Principles."=20 She says: If one imagines that one is going to get a satisfactory picture o= f the constitution of the Universe from the S.D. one will get only confusion from its study. It is not meant to give any such final verdict on existence= , but to LEAD TOWARDS THE TRUTH. She repeated this latter expression many times.=20 It is worse than useless going to those whom we imagine to be advanced students (she said) and asking them to give us an "interpretation" of the S.D. They cannot do it.=20 If they try, all they give are cut and dried exoteric renderings which do not remotely resemble the Truth. To accept such interpretation means anchoring ourselves to fixed ideas, whereas Truth lies beyond any ideas we can formulate or express. Exoteric interpretations are all very well, and she does not condemn them s= o long as they are taken as pointers for beginners, and are not accepted by them as anything more.=20 Many persons who are in, or who will in the future be in the T.S. are of course potentially incapable of any advance beyond the range of a common exoteric conception. But there are, and will be others, and for them she sets out the following and true way of approach to the S.D.=20 Come to the S.D. (she says) without any hope of getting the final Truth of existence from it, or with any idea other than seeing how far it may lead TOWARDS the Truth. See in study a means of exercising and developing the mind never touched by other studies. Observe the following rules:=20 1. No matter what one may study in the S.D. let the mind hold fast, as the basis of its ideation to the following ideas=20 (a) The FUNDAMENTAL UNITY OF ALL EXISTENCE. This unity is a thing altogethe= r different from the common notion of unity -- as when we say that a nation o= r an army is united; or that this planet is united to that by lines of magnetic force or the like. The teaching is not that. It is that existence is ONE THING, not any collection of things linked together. Fundamentally there is ONE BEING. This Being has two aspects, positive and negative.=20 The positive is Spirit, or CONSCIOUSNESS. The negative is SUBSTANCE, the subject of consciousness.=20 This Being is the Absolute in its primary manifestation. Being absolute there is nothing outside it. It is All-Being. It is indivisible, else it would not be absolute. If a portion could be separated, that remaining coul= d not be absolute, because there would at once arise the question of COMPARISON between it and the separated part.=20 Comparison is incompatible with any idea of absoluteness. Therefore it is clear that this fundamental One Existence, or Absolute Being must be the Reality in every form there is. I said that though this was clear to me I did not think that many in the Lodges would grasp it. "Theosophy," she said, "is for those who can think, or for those who can drive themselves to think, not mental sluggards."=20 H.P.B. has grown very mild of late. "Dumskulls!" used to be her name for th= e average student.=20=20 The Atom, the Man, the God (she says) are each separately, as well as all collectively, Absolute Being in their last analysis, that is their REAL INDIVIDUALITY. It is this idea which must be held always in the background of the mind to form the basis for every conception that arises from study o= f the S.D. The moment one lets it go (and it is most easy to do so when engaged in any of the many intricate aspects of the Esoteric Philosophy) th= e idea of SEPARATION supervenes, and the study loses its value.=20 (b) The second idea to hold fast to is that THERE IS NO DEAD MATTER. Every last atom is alive. It cannot be otherwise since every atom is itself fundamentally Absolute Being. Therefore there is no such thing as "spaces" of Ether, or Akasha, or call it what you like, in which angels and elementals disport themselves like trout in water. That's the common idea. The true idea shows every atom of substance no matter of what plane to be in itself a LIFE.=20 (c) The third basic idea to be held is that Man is the MICROCOSM. As he is so, then all the Hierarchies of the Heavens exist within him. But in truth there is neither Macrocosm nor Microcosm but ONE EXISTENCE. Great and small are such only as viewed by a limited consciousness.=20 (d) Fourth and last basic idea to be held is that expressed in the Great Hermetic Axiom. It really sums up and synthesises all the others.=20 =93As is the Inner, so is the Outer; as is the Great so is the Small; as it= is above, so it is below; there is but One Life and Law; and he that worketh i= t is ONE. Nothing is Inner, nothing is Outer; nothing is Great, nothing is Small; nothing is High, nothing is Low, in the Divine Economy.=94 =20 No matter what one takes as study in the S.D. one must correlate it with those basic ideas." ---------------------------------------- Why does SPIRIT undergo the evolutionary process.=20=20 Basically it would seem so that: "IT should know Itself." Logic: SPIRIT by itself is UNCONSCIOUS - UNIVERSAL - without contrast. Evolutionary law (KARMA) provides periodically the contrast of MATTER in an evolutionary Manvantara such as we are now involved in. [ Karma: as the endless "pulsing" of unconscious Life, which is perceived by "the opened ey= e of the Dangma" (the perception of the WISE)--SD I 27 Verse 8.] SPIRIT emanates aspects of itself - "Rays, Sparks" - which appear simultaneously with "matter" of a refined and "primordial type". Also simultaneously arises the POWER TO PERCEIVE, or UNIVERSAL MIND-MAHAT. [ Primordial pure matter is also named "Mulaprakriti" and "Mahabuddhi." ] The "Rays" invested with "matter" or MAHA-BUDDHI (Wisdom derived from experience) pass as individual MONADS [Atma-Buddhi-Manas] through all the planes and spheres of manifestation and eventually find themselves as individual Men-Minds on this, the grossest, most material of the planes. The SD describes this process starting SD Vol. I, p. 152. The OCEAN OF THEOSOPHY covers this in brief in Chapters 2, 3, 4, and 14, 15, if a synopsis is desired. If one is asking for a FIRST CAUSE, [SD I 14-5 214 342 426] you will be disappointed because there is none of a "material" kind. In terms of metaphysics, HPB hints in the SD that it is the CAUSELESS CAUSE, [SD I 9-10 14-5 55 89 273 280; II 589 ] and it is indescribable in our material= , physical terms and thoughts. What then remains for us to do to un-puzzle our minds? Only the fact that we are here. The fact that we are questioning is highly significant.=20=20 In THE SECRET DOCTRINE we are given one of the most comprehensive "keys" to the great seven-fold puzzle. This 7-fold mystery stretches between the polar opposites of Spirit and Matter, and employs the Mind which is mid-way between and independent of them, to note and record all their interactions in terms of time, space and motion. In effect we are told: "Man know thyself."=20=20 Since we are also 7-fold, each one of our principles when ultimately refine= d and brought under control opens the corresponding "lock" of great nature. = =20 Man is the "Microcosm" of the "Macrocosm" and contains in himself, in miniature, every power and force that the Universe has. He has to understand these, where they come from and how they are used, but, the powe= r to employ the secret laws and posers of nature are not entrusted to him by the WISE, who hold the final "secrets," until he has become completely HARMLESS to himself and to Nature around him.=20=20 The practice of "brotherhood" is the opening aspect of the discipline that leads to individual "success" and to ultimate Wisdom (or the practice of benevolence as a force that is employed only for the good of others). By the fact that in any one evolutionary period a mass of minds independently and cooperatively achieve the highest illumination into the nature of SPIRIT and the UNIVERSE, to that extent SPIRIT GETS TO KNOW ITSELF. It becomes progressively SELF-CONSCIOUS. Thus the human stage is a= n essential component of the evolutionary process and those=20 Men-minds that become successful are entrusted with the guidance of various aspects of future evolutionary schemes and the assisting of still more "minds" to become universally enlightened. Spirit may be said to get to "know itself" by the success of Minds who are wisely benevolent. As the process is continuous and eternal, evolution and progress towards spirituality (with the memory of every Egoic, individual experience in all departments of Nature stored in Akasa-- the BUDDHI-wisdom -- aspect of NATURE) the SPIRITUAL PERSON, that we are fundamentally, becomes ONE WITH THE UNIVERSAL SPIRIT.=20=20 But this merging does not annihilate or disintegrate the Individual, for that continues as a conscious unit on a self-assumed mission of assistance, compassion and mercy described in the VOICE OF THE SILENCE in the last page= s of the book (pp. 76-79 and the all-important footnotes there). We as humans are half-way through this vas= t process and work. [ HPB in her article ISIS UNVEILED AND THE VISISHTADWAITA says: "I maintain as an occultist, on the authority of the Secret Doctrine Parabrahm, man's spirit which not individual per se, yet preserves its distinct individuality in Paranirvana owing to the accumulation in it of the aggregates, or "skandhas" that have survived afte= r each death, from the highest faculties of the Manas.=20=20 The most spiritual--i.e., the highest and divinest aspirations of every personality follow "Buddhi" and the Seventh Principle into Devachan ("Swarga") after the death of each personality along the line of rebirths, and become part and parcel of the "Monad." [HPB Articles III, p. 265.] -------------------------------------------------- If the "ALL" is so grand and all knowing (omnipotent and omnipresent, etc...), then why does it need to form itself into a dense, fleshly creature like ourselves to evolve? It seems to me that to do so would be "un-evolving" itself (if such a word exists). Now I know that someone her= e is going to say, "Well, by becoming human, the "All" can experience many things on this plane, thus, adding to Its bank of knowledge." BUT, (I say),"Why??? If, It is already all-knowing???" What a grand question. In fact, the greatest philosophers of all history have asked over and over the question as to why God joined soul and body together - which is a variant of your question, isn't it? HPB has written that the mystery of the solar logos is the greatest mystery and the most precious in all of occultism. Bailey, though I am a declared dissident with respect to much of what she wrote - has said that the purpos= e of the solar logos is a redemptive one, that is, that our own God, the highest God we can conceive purpose for, was born - as in the Bible story about Christ - to save mankind with his great love and benedictions. Apparently our solar system and the planets therein have experienced great moral and spiritual failures in the past. It was not only in Atlantis that men turned to wickedness, sorcery and greed, black magic and so on, but in previously solar systems, resulting in great dead and decaying substance in the cosmos with human prisoners within them, comatose or in pain. Then along comes the redeeming heart of the Sun, who as Christ did, made the stupendous sacrifice to give us life and opportunity to work out way back home to paradise again. So if you look at the billions of billions of billions of suns and the equivalent numbers of humanities, both evolved and perfected and unevolved in the vast kosmic space we see each night in the skies, it is only ONE portion, our own solar system that required its God to incarnate through th= e human kingdom. Elsewhere the arrangement is not so much requiring of redemption as ours. Mankind is the redeemer, the great savior who must awaken to his true ancient agenda - and who seemingly has temporarily lost his way. ----------------------------------------------------------- Universal Foundation: THE ABSOLUTE Manifestation re begins under the unfinished Karma of the previous manifestation. "The Secret Doctrine establishes three fundamental propositions: -- (a) An Omnipresent, Eternal, Boundless, and Immutable Principle on which al= l speculation is impossible, since it transcends the power of human conceptio= n and could only be dwarfed by any human expression or similitude. It is beyond the range and reach of thought - in the words of Mandukya, 'unthinkable and unspeakable.'" (from The Secret Doctrine by H.P. Blavatsky, vol I page 14.) That "principle" is usually referred to as the "Absolute" in Theosophical discussion. Note there are other quotations in the SD that shed additional light on the Absolute. Perhaps I will include some of them later in the week - but I do not want to distract you from this quote. It is "famous" for students of the SD. The context of that quote is also quite important but not given here. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D SYMBOLS Circle, Circle and Dot. The CIRCLE can be taken two ways, as I understand it: 1. as representative of the UNMANIFESTED, attributeless and indescribable ALL. 2. The Circle can also represent the Universe as an "idea" that emanates from the ABSOLUTENESS and thus is indicative of the first differentiation. Circle is a limitation in the LIMITLESS (which as I understand it in the SD, is the ABSOLUTE) It is devoid of all attributes (SD I 214 420 II 34 384fn}. But, it is ALL POTENTIAL. It cannot=20 be =93projected=94 unless an earlier Universe had existed. This tends=20 to show that Karma (law) is a necessary and included part of the ALL.=20=20 Circle, actually, is a triple glyph: 1. SPACE UNLIMITED outside of it. An unlimited area with no boundaries or qualities. 2. Circle line itself. Apparently drawn by ETERNAL KARMA (SD I 27 - Verse 8) or that which is ALWAYS present as a philosophical necessity. In Non-manifestation it represents the "past" of all being previously IN MANIFESTATION, and due to eventually return. 3. Space limited inside the circumference that is drawn (Circle represents a SPHERE) . This represents the first flutter of a new Manifestation to be reborn out of the old impulses and forces left as Karmic germs. In the SD it might help to draw the information on the following pages together: SD I 1 4-5 11 65 99 113-4 134fn 239 333 359 II 553 573 589 621 You will see in the first pages of SD vol. I that HPB gives No SYMBOL for the ABSOLUTE -- she uses many words indicating that it is not to be limited. At the bottom of p. 4 are the first series of symbols.=20=20 On p. 11 is the extract from the OCCULT CATECHISM. ---------------------------- "What is it that ever is?" "Space, the eternal Anupadaka."* "What is it tha= t ever was?" "The Germ in the Root." "What is it that is ever coming and going?" "The Great Breath." "Then, there are three Eternals?" "No, the thre= e are one. That which ever is, is one, that which ever was is one, that which is ever being and becoming is also one: and this is Space."=20 "Explain, oh Lanoo (disciple)." =97 "The One is an unbroken Circle (ring) with no circumference, for it is nowhere and everywhere; the One is the boundless plane of the Circle, manifesting a diameter only during the manvantaric periods; the One is the indivisible point found nowhere, perceived everywhere during those periods; it is the Vertical and the Horizontal, the Father and the Mother, the summi= t and base of the Father, the two extremities of the Mother, reaching in reality nowhere, for the One is the Ring as also the rings that are within that Ring. Light in darkness and darkness in light: the 'Breath which is eternal.' It proceeds from without inwardly, when it is everywhere, and fro= m within outwardly, when it is nowhere =97 (i.e., maya, one of the centres ).= It expands and contracts (exhalation and inhalation). When it expands the mother diffuses and scatters; when it contracts, the mother draws back and ingathers. This produces the periods of Evolution and Dissolution, Manwantara and Pralaya. The Germ is invisible and fiery; the Root (the plan= e of the circle) is cool; but during Evolution and Manwantara her garment is cold and radiant. Hot Breath is the Father who devours the progeny of the many-faced Element (heterogeneous); and leaves the single-faced ones (homogeneous). Cool Breath is the Mother, who conceives, forms, brings forth, and receives them back into her bosom, to reform them at the Dawn (o= f the Day of Brahma, or Manvantara). . . . "=20 [S D I, p. II ] --------------------------- Our minds in the here and now, surrounded by matter, find it most difficult to think of that which is NOT material or limited in terms of time, space and motion.=20=20 Pp. 14-19 give the "3 fundamentals." Those are found repeated throughout=20 later pages in one way or another. SD vol. 1 up to p. 300 gives a survey o= f manifestation starting with the most spiritual levels and gradually devolving into "matter." MATTER at that beginning point is "primordial matter." And if we were to perceive it, we might think of it as "spirit" in contrast with the "gross matter" we use every day here and now. Those first 300 pages are full of the most valuable explanations (see for instance Mr. Judge's HIDDEN HINTS IN THE SECRET DOCTRINE, which is a useful guide and commentary), we have to grasp and keep the information gained from those 300 pages in mind when reading the rest of the book. In SD I 51 she states positively that the "finite" cannot conceive of the INFINITE, and on p. 56 she says the reverse the INFINITY cannot know the "finite." And yet we dare as mind-being to think about this ABSOLUTENESS as a logical necessity from which emanates all the limitations of a functioning Universe. Is this not because we are in our innermost core, (as are all other beings) One with that ABSOLUTENESS ? This is the one fact that makes of each of us MONADS and Eternal Pilgrims. The DOT within the CIRCLE would indicate the Germ, the Seed the "first differentiation". It also stands for the imperishable MONAD encased in physical matter. If you look at a graphic representation of the Pythagorean TRIANGLE embodying the ten dots in 4 lines, then the ABSOLUTENESS would be an invisible ( Circle ? ) above the topmost dot. Or in another way, as IT is non-manifest, it would be an invisible CIRCLE that we create in our mind's eye, that includes all the ten dots which signify manifestation in all its many details. --------------------------------------------- Best wishes, Dallas From leonmaurer@aol.com Thu Dec 02 23:37:35 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: LeonMaurer@aol.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 64384 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2004 07:37:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2004 07:37:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d22.mx.aol.com) (205.188.144.208) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2004 07:37:34 -0000 Received: from LeonMaurer@aol.com by imo-d22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v37_r3.8.) id j.1c2.21403d11 (3964) for ; Fri, 3 Dec 2004 02:37:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1c2.21403d11.2ee171b2@aol.com> Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 02:37:22 EST To: study@blavatsky.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Mac sub 45 X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 205.188.144.208 From: leonmaurer@aol.com Subject: Re: [bn-study] Chapter 2, page 15 - Akasha and the Astral Light X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4099972 X-Yahoo-Profile: leonmaurer1 As an exercise in testing the correlation's of a post modern approach to scientific reasoning with the metaphysics of theosophy as presented in the Secret Doctrine and discussed here -- as well as opening the door to further comments and questions that might add to our understanding of these ideas and concepts -- I've inserted my comments based on the theory of Astro Biological Coenergetics (ABC) within the commentary below. In a message dated 11/30/04 8:22:04 PM, estela3@blavatsky.net writes: >Chapter 2, page 15 > >7. Akasha and the Astral Light > > Here there is introduced a teaching that goes far beyond anything known >to today's sciences. Although not easy to grasp at first, it will be found >to throw much light on areas of experiences at present little understood >even by psychology, for example, the mystical and psychic. >It has been stated (in paragraph 4 above), that there is no such thing >as empty space in the universe. Esoteric Science teaches that the entire >cosmos is pervaded by Akasha, primordial substance, or rather the noumenon >- the non-sensuous reality - beyond substance. In the Theosophical >Glossary, Akasha (from a Sanskrit word meaning 'brilliant" or "luminous") >is described as "the subtle, supersensuous spiritual essence which pervades >all space." This primordial substance differentiates into all the forms of >matter, those of the invisible as of the visible regions of the universe. >Hence the definition of Akasha as "the Universal Soul" ...from which all >that exists is born by separation or differentiation. It is the cause of >existence; it fills all the infinite Space." +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ [LM] This "spiritual essence" or "primordial substance" is the "abstract motion" that surrounds the primal zero-point "emptiness" -- which is reflected everywhere -- and is the center of all infinite Space, whether manifest or non manifest, subtle or gross... (Although, each field of consciousness or composite "being" in the universe has it own individual zero-point center, along with its own "abstract motion" or "spinergy," constituting its source of "life" energy.) This abstract motion or the "angular momentum" of pure "Spin" (of the zero-point, rapidly turning or cycling around itself at infinite velocities on an infinite number of axes), is the primal Force ("Spinergy") -- that is the root of all manifest energies on all planes or fields of consciousness. Since, this infinite spin can carry information encoded as holographic interference patterns in its velocities as well as its radial pulsation's (or ZP spins on perpedicular axes) --it is the root of the Akasha that carries the entire memory of all prior Manvantara experiences, as well as the construction plans or "genetic code" of the entire Cosmos, as well as all the potential beings in it. One basic premise is that -- since Absolute Space must be infinitely divisible -- so must be the "spinergy" that surrounds every infinite zero-point that, paradoxically (from a physical or linear-space-time point of view) must all be in the same place, or spatial location, prior to manifestation. That is, before the emanation of the Cosmos, the birth of any Quasar, or prior to the Big bang (that Science wrongly assumes was the beginning of this physical universe alone). When the primal or noumenal "spinergy" first awakens to come into phenomenal "existence," it emanates, at near infinite frequency/energy, the dual, positive and negative ray (moving linearly in opposite directions, in a 3 cycle spiral vortex (Mobius-like) path which weaves (since the point is also spinning in a perpendicular direction to the original emanation) the first Cosmic Monad consisting of three cyclic fields (two inner fields within a surrounding field, like bubbles within a bubble) -- which represents the first spiritual root of all subsequent Monads. The parallel dual rays (although spiraling like the DNA molecule) that weaves the outer circumferences of these fields, are probably analogous to what Science (in current M-theory) calls "Superstrings." It is also postulated that, since the dual ray is both positive and negative (in direction of propagation) they could be the roots of what in current science is spoken of as "Light Matter" and "Dark Matter." However, another hypothetical possibility is that the twin spiraling rays carry -- in their individual vibrations (whose peaks and valleys could be analogous to the "strings" of current physics) that meet between them (like the ladders of bases in between the DNA spiral strands) --the entire "construction" code of Cosmogenesis. It only remains for the first intelligent beings to properly place these constructions in their rightful places... (Something, science still hasn't entirely figured out with respect to the human body and its varying proteins that go to different places in the body -- since they can't comprehend how intelligence could operate at the cellular levels, and have no understanding of the intelligent coenergetic** relationship between the coadunate Astral Body and the Physical Body.) **Coenergetic, referring to the inductive resonance between the energy vibrational patterns of one higher order field that induce an analogous pattern in the adjacent lower order field -- much like striking a G-string of a violin induces a similar vibration in the G-string of a nearby bass fiddle, along with all its overtones. To visualize how these fields initially form the primal Monad and subsequently involve fractally -- i.e., one divides into two to form three, in an infinite series --starting from "chaos" to ultimate octaval "order" (after three iterations or "logos" ) -- and continuing inward, ad infinitum, see: http://users.aol.com/uniwldarts/uniworld.artisans.guild/chakrafield.html http://users.aol.com/leonmaurer/invlutionflddiagnotate.gif http://users.aol.com/leonmaurer/Invlutionfldmirror2.gif Incidentally, since all the space-time fields that emanate from the "spinergy" are joined together with their "Superstrings" (or woven rays of energy that make up the circumferences of the fields) in the form of "Gordian knots," so to speak -- it could take quite a twist of mind to follow the Mobius-like twists of fields with fields within fields, etc. ... So, we shouldn't be discouraged if it takes much long and arduous meditative practice to arrive at the clear state of its comprehension or visualization (that Patanjali implies is a necessary requirement prior to enlightenment :-) Could that be why HPB placed so much emphasis on understanding the metaphysics of theosophy and its scientific correlation's? What good is the Heart Doctrine in helping and teaching others on the path and fulfilling the plan of universal evolution, without a complete and effective understanding or how the Macrocosm and the microcosm actually work and interrelate with each other? The basis of all the siddhis (psychic powers), including the powers of will and self healing, rests on this comprehension. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >The lowest region of Akasha, immediately above the gross physical plane, >is termed the Astral Light. It is "the invisible region that surrounds our >globe" and everything in it, and corresponds to the subtle vehicle or >"double" in man, the Linga-sharira. In it is impressed indelibly everything >that takes place in the physical, psychical, and mental realms. It is thus >the storehouse of memory, both in the cosmos and in mankind. >"Akasha - the subtle supersensuous spiritual essence which pervades all >space." These last few weeks there has been much discussion on God, and >the nature of divinity. As theosophists, we believe that there is something >more than a God. And we identify this something as the Absolute, yet we >give it no attributes, except to say what it is not and what it is not >practically covers everything. Yet, we are left struggling to come to terms >with this something, through words and concepts... +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ As ABC theory sees it, this subtle "Astral light," is considered the analogous "light" range of the energy-frequency spectrum of each higher field that is analogous and corresponds to the "Sidereal light" of the gross physical universe. Thus the inner light we experience is not the Sidereal light we detect with our physical eyes, but is actually the "Astral light" we see only through our mind's eye (as a hologram in the Astral Mind field reconstructed by a coherent ray of Astral light projected from the "spinergy" surrounding our zero-point center of visual perception located in the Pineal area) -- whether awake or in our dreams -- since the Sidereal light never gets past the retinas of our physical eyes. When we raise our consciousness to the higher fields of Buddhi and Atma, we can experience (see, feel, etc.) the higher order frequencies of Astral light on those planes. Such experiences are purely subjective and we can only explain them to others indirectly as one sort of feeling of ecstasy or another, or by metaphorical analogies and correspondences -- e.g., "Smells like a rose" or "Tastes like honey," etc., etc. However, we can never explain any of this "scientifically" in objective or empirical terms -- since there is no way, using our instruments on the physical plane, that we can measure these higher frequency orders -- but can only "experience" them subjectively. The same can be said for the concept of the infinite Absolute -- which is ineffable and beyond the comprehension of the finite mind -- thus, divine, in an of itself. All this clears up when we consider that the zero-point at the center of origin of each monadic field is the source of all conscious experience or awareness. Therefore, we are each, in our own individual Monad's zero-point of origin, an individual "spark" at the center of the highest Self -- which is, in essence, the latent consciousness of the Absolute. This consciousness only becomes "experiential," as an individual Self (which we can call "God consciousness") at the zero-center of the primal Monad of the Cosmos and any Galactic or Solar System in it, down to each individual human being. Subsequently, as this primal Monad goes through its 14 initial involution's, the consciousness of the Dhyan Chohans awaken in successive hierarchical order until the primordial physical Universe appears. Of course, in our measure of time, all this occurs simultaneously -- since each successive field has a time constant (or "ultimate division of time") consistent with its energy-frequency order -- which extends from near infinite on the highest plane to the finite spectrum of the lowest physical plane. Note that "plane" is used, theosophically -- since all phenomena, which is fundamentally "electrical" in nature, occurs on the circumferential surface of each of the globular "fields" of consciousness. Science confirms this, as Einstein showed us -- since he proved that this infinite "surface" of space is flat in the short view but also curved in the long view. From a physical point of view, the metaphorical analogy is that; Space can be imagined as an immense blanket woven of primal lines (or rays or Superstrings) of "Primal Force," and that galaxies are wrinkles in the blanket -- with stars wrinkles in the galactic wrinkles, and planets wrinkles in the star wrinkles, ad infinitum. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > One evening, as I struggled to get a handle on this idea of an Absolute, >I wandered out into the garden. It was late fall, just like it is now and >the sky was crystal clear and slightly blue, the moon providing a soft >light. I sat down and looked up at the sky taking in the stars. Then with >my mind I pictured the universe as it would be beyond our atmosphere, and >with my mind I traveled farther out taking in the nebulas and the galaxies >that spread out across the universe. Like Hubble I tried with my mind to >reach the very ends of the universe and go beyond. In that still night, >I felt the energy that surrounds us and fills us with it vibrancy, I heard >the low hum that one hears in the silence, and slowly I sensed another >reaching back. And I knew it could not be contained in words and concepts, >even in an idea. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Yes, even science cannot explain the "experience" of consciousness -- which must remain forever that which we can only feel and know inside ourselves, by ourselves. Your expressions and impressions described so poetically above, I'm afraid, is the closest any of us can ever come to picturing such transcendental experiences to others. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >Why does Theosophy not bother to define the Absolute? Should we bother >to define what is not? Is Consciousness the same as the Absolute, or are we >once again trying to put terms to a term-less something? >Is the Akasha the first manifestation of the Absolute? >Is there a difference between the linga-sharira and the aura? >Why does science not recognize this Akasha, and yet recognize that space >is not empty? +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Perhaps, the above outline of how scientific thinking can be merged with theosophy makes all this a little clearer. Even today, science with its Superstring/M-brane theories, postulating "11 dimensions" of Space (7 hyperspace, 3 physical, plus time), is coming closer and closer to the theosophical metaphysics -- which can be described philosophically, as did HPB (using theosophical jargon that possibly only a studied theosophist with a scientific background along with a fair knowledge of Sanskrit could understand thoroughly) -- and, ultimately, merged it with science... (As further clarified by the ABC theoretical interpretation which bridges theosophical metaphysics with the leading edges of postmodern science.) See: http://tellworld.com/Astro.Biological.Coenergetics -- along with my previous letters on ABC in this and other online forums. The real problem with reductive Science as practiced today, is that they cannot get a handle on consciousness and its relationship to matter, or even the connections between mind and brain. They call it the "hard problem" of consciousness and the "binding problem" of mind to brain. Until they solve these two conundrums, there can never be a scientific understanding of the true nature of both subjective and objective reality. On the substantial or energetic side, "M-theory" is getting very close to the theosophical metaphysics that speaks of multidimensional enfolded fields -- which science labels ZPE or "zero-point energies"... But, on the consciousness side, they are lost until they can fit perceptive awareness and will or intent into their equations. In any event, neither theosophy, ABC, nor Superstring/M-brane theory -- no matter how close they get to a "Unified Field Theory of Everything" -- can ever explain the nature of the Absolute (the rootless root of all)... That is forever beyond the comprehension of all manifest consciousness -- i.e., beyond even the ubiquitous "zero-point" itself (the root of both our awareness and our will), or its "spinergy" (the root of all substantial matter-energies) ... Yet, both of which forever remains in close intimacy with that forever unknown Absolute (pre-being or "Beness") Principle upon which everything in the Cosmos or in our phenomenal universe rests, and has their being in. Lenny >Estela From samblo@cs.com Fri Dec 03 03:16:47 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: Samblo@cs.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 20005 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2004 11:16:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.166) by m18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2004 11:16:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d06.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.38) by mta5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2004 11:16:47 -0000 Received: from Samblo@cs.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v37_r3.8.) id r.1e4.2f921603 (4446) for ; Fri, 3 Dec 2004 06:16:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1e4.2f921603.2ee1a51b@cs.com> Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 06:16:43 EST To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: CompuServe 2000 32-bit sub 107 X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 205.188.157.38 From: samblo@cs.com Subject: Re: Theos-World re teachings/Masters today and in ancient Egypt, South Americ... X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=27151446 Mauri, Thanks for your comments. In the UFO case years ago Viracocha was referred to as "Ticci Viracocha" having the same tradition you relate from Graham Handcock's book. The Nasca Culture was recent comparatively, A.D., Maria Reich spent most of her life in situ documenting the Nasca lines and figures which are of a distinctly different type than the more recent Crop Circles. Prof. Arthuro Posnansky catalogued the Tiahuanaco remains, spending over 20 years in situ in the effort. Much of the remains of the Tiahuanaco culture were buried in a flood plain from the deluge you cited. Posnansky dated Tiahuanaco at 15,538 Years B.C. that being the "Middle Period" of the Tiahuanaco Culture. Posnanskys great work in Quatro volumes is "Tiahuanaco -- Cradle of American Man" published by the Government of Bolivia. In those volumes there is a glyph of a "European Wizard" with a High conical hat, sporting what appears to be a "Scottish Kilt," it is an enigma. The Spanish destroyed many of the priceless 18 foot high Monolithic Statues which were covered top to bottom in glyphs which I was told many years ago described the various Disciplines and scientific knowledge such as Astronomy. One of the best resources I know of on Nasca and it's lines is published by: KUNSTRAUM MUNCHEN in collaboration with Maria Reich 1974, titled "Peruvian Ground Drawings." One mythology found in the modern UFO culture in America is that some believe that it is at the Nasca Plain that the "Condor Fleet" is stored beneath the ground under the symbolic figures awaiting an appointed time for their reappearance. In one of his "abductions" the experiencer I was involved with was taken before dawn to Nasca and set down in his jockey shorts on the regenerative leg of the "Spider" figure at Nasca and given instruction to follow relating to it. At the North end of Nasca there is a river named "Rio Ingenio" which means River of the Supermind or Genius. Ticci Viracocha walked "on the foam of the Ocean," Krishna churned and produced the Foam of the Ocean also, Jesus was alleged to have walked upon the waters. Tulku's are called Sky Walkers. Hmmm. BTW, I haven't read any of Graham Handcock's books, yet. John From stevestubbs@yahoo.com Fri Dec 03 05:22:38 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: stevestubbs@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 51895 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2004 13:22:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.172) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2004 13:22:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO yahoogroups.com) (80.202.237.234) by mta4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2004 13:22:35 -0000 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 14:23:21 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 80.202.237.234 From: stevestubbs@yahoo.com Subject: thanks! X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7712190 X-Yahoo-Profile: stevestubbs Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Your details. +++ Attachment: No Virus found +++ Panda AntiVirus - www.pandasoftware.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From clarity12.1@juno.com Fri Dec 03 10:50:03 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: clarity12.1@juno.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 40092 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2004 18:50:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2004 18:50:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO outbound-mail.nyc.untd.com) (64.136.20.164) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2004 18:50:03 -0000 Received: from outbound21-sr.nyc.untd.com (webmail22.nyc.untd.com [10.141.27.162]) by smtpout03.nyc.untd.com with SMTP id AABA5BPLFA66H8XJ for (sender ); Fri, 3 Dec 2004 10:49:41 -0800 (PST) X-UNTD-OriginStamp: 4ohJS0CGC59/Kp5GWNMAw5dioYqCpGgvJL60iRyOuf1hxv9oIzm+aA== Received: (from clarity12.1@juno.com) by webmail22.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id KDXS9PHE; Fri, 03 Dec 2004 10:48:40 PST Received: from [68.44.16.38] by webmail22.nyc.untd.com with HTTP: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 18:47:46 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 18:47:46 GMT To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com X-Mailer: WebMail Version 2.0 Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <20041203.104840.17152.41751@webmail22.nyc.untd.com> X-ContentStamp: 19:9:1296263906 X-MAIL-INFO:498b8a4a4fc78b17936e73b75fc3f393436b270f47e78e9e7a1be7fe5703270f7b6eeb5707d7022f2a7b3e3efe2be3232b036703025a4e9a5a43a7afc3731773f38b0b6a8b1ea38b1e270b5f07dbdb33aa632aaa5ebe5ef7b71ad7b7da3a0b67470e4702bf3e2fbf1fa7bf1f3b3e X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 64.136.20.164 From: "Regina St Clare" X-Originating-IP: [68.44.16.38] Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Review by Katinka Hesselink of "The Judge Case" bo ok by Ernest E. Pelletier X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=178968717 X-Yahoo-Profile: stclareregina Autocracy and the TS I was told when I joined and immediately became a president of a Lodge, that the TS was an autocracy. It has proved to be just that. Uphappily, Regina -- "Perry Coles" wrote: Thanks Daniel and Katinka This is a good article.... It's interesting how this concept of a "successor" is an issue of great debate in the various Theosophical Societies. A similar problem is in the various Radhasoami groups who all argue over "successor –ship". While in the Radhasoami's I can understand why there is an issue over this due to their belief in need for a "perfect Master" to guide the initiates. In Theosophy however there is no such concept as each student must walk his or her own path. Is this need for "successors" based in the need for a rescuer or perhaps a hangover from the old hierarchical mindset and "divine Kings and Queens" being crowned with power from on high or perhaps HPB's highly "magnetised" Divine Ring of power. Maybe both Judge and Besant where still of this ilk. De Purucker's writings also express this authoritarian / hierarchical type of mindset of course it goes without saying CWL was a complete shocker when it came to pronouncements and his belief in superiority of the ruling classes. It's interesting that the society was set up on a democratic system rather than an autocracy or some kind of theosophical monarchy with "successors". It's a shame that the society fell into the trap of guru following and this nonsense idea of successor-ship and divine oracles, rather than implementing the principles of democracy on which the society was established. Perry --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Daniel H. Caldwell" wrote: > > Recently the following book was published: > > The Judge Case: A Conspiracy Which > Ruined the Theosophical Cause > by Ernest E. Pelletier > > Ordering information can be found at: > > http://www.theosophycanada.com/ets_judge_case.pdf > > Katinka Hesselink, editor of Lucifer7, has > now written and published an informative review of > this book in the latest December 2004 > issue of Lucifer7. See: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lucifer7/message/17 > > I have reprinted the review in an easier format > to print at: > > http://blavatskyarchives.com/judgecasereviewbykatinka.htm > > Katinka also compiled a more complete table of contents > for the book under review. I have also created a pdf version > of this more complete table that will be easier to read > and print out at: > > http://blavatskyarchives.com/wqjcasetableofcontents.pdf > > I am hoping that Ernest Pelletier will respond to Katinka's > review on this Theos-Talk forum which is open to the public > and is also indexed by Google. > > Later I plan to add a few comments of my own on "The Judge > Case" book and also on Katinka's review. > > Daniel H. Caldwell > BLAVATSKY STUDY CENTER > http://hpb.cc Yahoo! Groups Links ________________________________________________________________ Juno Gift Certificates Give the gift of Internet access this holiday season. http://www.juno.com/give From bartl@sprynet.com Fri Dec 03 12:52:35 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: bartl@sprynet.com X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 35083 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2004 20:52:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2004 20:52:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpauth03.mail.atl.earthlink.net) (209.86.89.63) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2004 20:52:33 -0000 Received: from [141.153.238.175] (helo=sprynet.com) by smtpauth03.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1CaKPo-00088g-Bt for theos-talk@yahoogroups.com; Fri, 03 Dec 2004 15:52:32 -0500 Message-ID: <41B0D216.4020703@sprynet.com> Date: Fri, 03 Dec 2004 15:52:38 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com References: <20041203.104840.17152.41751@webmail22.nyc.untd.com> In-Reply-To: <20041203.104840.17152.41751@webmail22.nyc.untd.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ELNK-Trace: 5be619ec394aa49c25eb773df4b61cba5113af02d9f1ea36e1a8a798bd769515bca2f000fc72cd8d350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 209.86.89.63 From: Bart Lidofsky X-Originating-IP: 141.153.238.175 Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Review by Katinka Hesselink of "The Judge Case" bo ok by Ernest E. Pelletier X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=690370 X-Yahoo-Profile: bml07646 Regina St Clare wrote: > I was told when I joined and immediately became a president of a > Lodge, that the TS was an autocracy. > > It has proved to be just that. As one who is vaguely (emphasis on the word, "vaguely") familiar with your situation, I'd be interested if you can elaborate. Bart From dharao4@yahoo.co.uk Fri Dec 03 13:32:13 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: dharao4@yahoo.co.uk X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 53100 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2004 21:32:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2004 21:32:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web86902.mail.ukl.yahoo.com) (217.12.13.54) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2004 21:32:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 39900 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Dec 2004 21:32:04 -0000 Message-ID: <20041203213204.39898.qmail@web86902.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.229.36.141] by web86902.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 03 Dec 2004 21:32:04 GMT Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 21:32:04 +0000 (GMT) To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 217.12.13.54 From: robert searle Subject: The Question of Power. X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=174372458 X-Yahoo-Profile: dharao4 Dear All, The problem of power and who takes it is not something limited to the errings of certain careerist Theosophists but can also be found in gurudom....and indeed, in many other walks of life. I was a member of the TS in the 1980s and hope to rejoin for research reasons as the library at the London Centre is always useful. However, I met someone who may be still alive, and her name was Miss Storey if I recall rightly. She had what was termed a gammey leg but what struck me most was her evident interest in climbing up the Theosophical promotion ladder. In other words, she had a thirst for "power". This I found to be somewhat odd as TS is meant to be interested in the spiritual. Infact, one reason why I left it was because I found the members cold, and unfriendly. However, if I went to a Radhasoami Satsang meeting the whole room would be saturated with the pure vibrant energies of love which would lift my conciousness upwards. At the TS I felt I had entered a funeral parlour, or a mausoleum which is a shame. Otherwise, I have great respect for the writings of the Theosophists notably ofcourse Blavatsky, and Leadbeater. I assume Leslie Price still plays at active part in the TS. What fascinated me about him was his sharp mind, and alert attention. ___________________________________________________________ Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From ringding777@t-online.de Sat Dec 04 01:59:52 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: ringding777@t-online.de X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 26335 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2004 09:59:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.172) by m24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2004 09:59:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout04.sul.t-online.com) (194.25.134.18) by mta4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2004 09:59:52 -0000 Received: from fwd08.aul.t-online.de by mailout04.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 1CaWhj-00089u-03; Sat, 04 Dec 2004 10:59:51 +0100 Received: from captainfb78633 (ZezbP4ZHYe9CAh7oVGPh0+q+toKtPvQbv8vr-As40wd1htY4-GFesK@[217.86.143.183]) by fwd08.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 1CaWhf-2CC9qa0; Sat, 4 Dec 2004 10:59:47 +0100 Message-ID: <006301c4d9e8$530edea0$152ca8c0@captainfb78633> To: References: <20041203.104840.17152.41751@webmail22.nyc.untd.com> Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2004 11:02:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-ID: ZezbP4ZHYe9CAh7oVGPh0+q+toKtPvQbv8vr-As40wd1htY4-GFesK X-TOI-MSGID: b3da9653-ee68-4c92-9b3b-718e24ed8641 X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 194.25.134.18 X-eGroups-From: ringding777@t-online.de (Frank Reitemeyer) From: ringding777@t-online.de Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Review by Katinka Hesselink of "The Judge Case" book by Ernest E. Pelletier X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=190924709 X-Yahoo-Profile: frank_reitemeyer Regina, to understand better what you mean: Of which so-called TS do you speak? And do you refer to an autocracy of humans or an autocracy of super humans? Thanks Frank ----- Original Message ----- From: "Regina St Clare" To: Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 7:47 PM Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Review by Katinka Hesselink of "The Judge Case" book by Ernest E. Pelletier Autocracy and the TS I was told when I joined and immediately became a president of a Lodge, that the TS was an autocracy. It has proved to be just that. Uphappily, Regina From dalval14@earthlink.net Sat Dec 04 04:15:09 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: dalval14@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 17678 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2004 12:15:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2004 12:15:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpauth08.mail.atl.earthlink.net) (209.86.89.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2004 12:15:08 -0000 Received: from [209.179.222.79] (helo=DALLAS) by smtpauth08.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1CaYoM-0008WT-7e; Sat, 04 Dec 2004 07:15:00 -0500 To: Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2004 04:14:25 -0800 Message-ID: <001001c4d9fa$d957d540$4fdeb3d1@DALLAS> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 1 (Highest) X-MSMail-Priority: High X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Importance: High X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 In-Reply-To: X-ELNK-Trace: c552449649a8b16d1aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec791f58e8fb383a5ff17938795e60880d44350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 209.86.89.68 From: "W.Dallas TenBroeck" Reply-To: X-Originating-IP: 209.179.222.79 Subject: RE: [bn-study] Love X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=52898573 X-Yahoo-Profile: dalval2 Cassilva Questions=20=20=20 Dec 3 2004 Dear Friends: 1 Questions C First of all lets define IMAGINATION.=20 C Lower Imagination: the mind will construct an image (subjective) as if it were a tangible thing. Imagination connected with fancy or desire. The desire and the image and the mind are all mixed together, and the result, instead of being a training of the image making power, is to bring on a decay of that power and results only in a continual flying to the image of the thing desired.=20=20 C Higher Imagination: Imagination under control (or your word, manipulation) of the will has to be able to make a picture of anything at any time, and if this power has not been trained the possession of other sorts of knowledge will not enable one to perform certain classes of occult phenomenon. = =20 C The imagination makes a picture of each word (or thing) of each letter of every line in every letter and having made that picture it is held there by the will and the imagination acting together for such a length of time as is needed to permit the carbons or other substances to be strained down through this matrix and appear in another location. Sending messages by words which the receiver is to hear is done by making an image of the person who is the recipient is to be made and held in place - you have to become a camera= . ----------------------------------------------- DTB=09=20=20 =93Imagination. In Occultism this is not to be confused with fancy, as it i= s one of the plastic powers of the higher Soul, and is the memory of the preceding incarnations, which, however disfigured by the lower Manas, yet rests always on a ground of truth.=94 T. Glos 152 >From J.V. - "There are two ways to ascend and descend, the direct and indirect." Tea Table, Oct. Path. (I) What are these ways? Answer - The thistle down is blown hither and thither with every breath of wind: The arrow speeds straight to the mark from the powerful bow= . The indirect way is that of the thistle down; the Astral going out when the body is asleep, does so in a diffused condition - a passive state - with no adequate force to control it or master unseen forces. It floats at the merc= y of every current in the Astral, gleaning here and there as a butterfly but taking the good and bad indiscriminately. It may reach high spheres, but is more likely to remain in those nearest to the physical. This way is travelled by all when asleep, and there dreams are made. It is the passive state where desire is the ruler, and sometimes travelled in the waking conscious state, but is uncontrollable and unreliable. The direct way is that of the arrow from the bow. The Astral speeds directl= y to the sphere which holds the knowledge it is to receive. It does so in obedience to an irresistible force - the Will: Will in accordance with divine law. It is concrete going and returning in obedience to this force, bringing little with it from intermediate spheres other than that for which it is seeking. This occurs in dreamless slumber and the knowledge acquired is not communicated in a dream. This way is travelled in the conscious stat= e for it is the way of the student of the Occult. Unless the man's thought an= d motive are pure, he is incapable of using the true will, and his Astral goe= s where other wills or forces drive it. It pauses when other forces interfere - learns from the place it happens to be in, and brings back a horrible jumble sometimes. (2) Where do these ways lead? Ans One way leads to Theosophia - Illumination - when traveled awake or asleep. The other to consideration of self - ordinary living with its erroneous conceptions - as an Occult way, to love of phenomena and spiritism. They lead to spheres within the astral, for the astral body passes not beyond astral limits. Only when the soul is freed from the astral and material bodies does it pass to higher spheres. These ways also lead to planets, stars, and other worlds, for all these may be within the astral of this globe. >From M.J.G. - Whence come the visions seen just before dropping to sleep?= =20 A They are uncontrollable - sometimes unpleasant, and have increased since childhood, and since beginning the study of Occultism. Answer - When we enter that condition called sleep, we open wide the doors and windows of the body or this house we live in, and the soul goes forth a= s a bird freed from its cage. In partial unconsciousness or falling into sleep, the body has, to a great extent, ceased to act, but the brain is still sensitive or receptive to the pictures or impressions of the Astral. Of the lower principles the Astral is the last to cease action either in sleep or death. The brain is its instrument. In the partial somnolent condition, the pictures of the Astral are conveyed to the brain; through that the outer man realizes and beholds the visions. If he were fully aslee= p these visions would be dreams. Precisely, as dreams, they may be either pleasant or the reverse. Like dreams they are uncontrollable by the ordinar= y every day mortal. The Occultist being master of himself beholds only that which he desires, either in vision, or dream, or neither. As one makes himself more sensitive to impressions from the Astral when and after he begins the study of Occultism, visions and dreams will increase in frequenc= y for a time. >From J.C.V. - What is true Will? Is it a faculty of the soul? How is it one with the Divine Will and how may we make our will at one with the Divine? Is it something which now we know not, or may we perceive its germ in our own Will, or is it an instinctive movement of the soul? Answer - (I) The will as known to man is that force which he exerts for the accomplishment of his aims - he uses it blindly and ignorantly - an= d self is always the one for which he uses it. It is used as a brute force. A= s ordinarily used it has little tendency to lift the personality farther than the attainment of material results. It has for its source, the lower elements of the soul. The true will is a concentrated force working steadil= y yet gently, dominating both soul and person, having its source in the spiri= t and highest elements of the soul. It is never used for the gratification of self, is inspired by the highest of motives, is never interposed to violate a law, but works in harmony with the unseen as well as the seen. It is manifested through the human will for things visible. (2) It is more that a faculty of the soul, for it is the soul at work. The spirit is unmanifest except through the soul. The soul manifesting the spirit is the true will. The human will is the lowest form of this manifestation. (3) As the true will is the manifestation of the spirit through the soul, i= t must be at one with the divine, inasmuch as the spirit is the divine in man= . It is the God in man, a portion of the all-pervading. Asserting itself through the soul, the true will is brought forth and in truth we say, "It i= s the will of God." We may make our finite wills at one with the divine by elevating our aim, using it for good or in the search for God, in striving to find how to use it in harmony with the laws of God. By proper use in the right direction the human will becomes purified, elevated, and being exerte= d only in conformity with our highest ideal, eventually becomes at one with the highest in man. In our ordinary material state we know only the human will. Through the human will we reach the divine will. We become aware of the true will through the ordinary will just as we become aware of the soul through the body. It is not instinctive of the soul. The soul is father of the human will - the spirit is father of the true will. >From E.L.T. - "A great deal depends on purity of thought and motive," Oct. Path, p. 220. Please explain what should be the actuating motive in developing psychic capacities. Answer - The desire to find God, the desire to know one's self, our possibilities and capabilities, that we may be of true use to the world, these are the motives. The thought should be unselfish, undisturbed by material affairs - free from wonder-seeking curiosity, concentrated, and in entire accord with the motive, the search for God. ANS TO Q -- W Q J ------------------------------------------- C KARMA: Karma is not a doctrine of an eye for an eye. It is a doctrine of learning. If you think, act, or desire harm or happiness towards others, it is returned to you. If you harm someone, then to understand the harm yo= u caused you need to experience it for yourself. In that way you, are knowledgeable, and if you are smart, and don=92t want to feel that pain again, you will learn from the experience. C Yes if we are energy, is it such a leap of faith, to think that our mental thoughts are made up of energy, and if you can accept that, then you should be able to accept that like attracts like, and if you have a thought that corresponds with the thinking of others in the universe, wont that energy attract itself to like. If you don't have a corresponding attitude then the thought will not be attracted to you. C Please define Beness: Being or Beness is simply "existing" in my understanding, and according to some philosophers is the same as living meaninglessly. DTB=09 KARMA IS UNIVERSAL LAW =96 it is Brotherhood in action everywhere. All bein= gs are subject to Karma. It provides life and environment to all. It is universally sensitive and adjusts all wrongs.=20=20 =93KARMA (Sk.). Physically, action: metaphysically, the LAW OF RETRIBUTION, the Law of cause and effect or Ethical Causation. Nemesis, only in one sense, that of bad Karma. It is the eleventh Nidana in the concatenation of causes and effects in orthodox Buddhism ; yet it is the power that controls all things, the resultant of moral action, the meta physical Samsk=E2ra, or the moral effect of an act committed for the attainment of something which gratifies a personal desire.=20 There is the Karma of merit and the Karma of demerit. Karma neither punishe= s nor rewards, it is simply the one Universal LAW which guides unerringly, and, so to say, blindly, all other laws productive of certain effects along the grooves of their respective causations. When Buddhism teaches that =93Karma is that moral kernel (of any being) which alone survives death and continues in transmigration =91 or reincarnation, it simply means that ther= e remains nought after each Personality but the causes produced by it ; cause= s which are undying, i.e., which cannot be eliminated from the Universe until replaced by their legitimate effects, and wiped out by them, so to speak, and such causes=97unless compensated during the life of the person who produced them with adequate effects, will follow the reincarnated Ego, and reach it in its subsequent reincarnation until a harmony between effects an= d causes is fully reestablished.=20 No =93personality=94=97a mere bundle of material atoms and of instinctual a= nd mental characteristics=97can of course continue, as such, in the world of p= ure Spirit.=20 Only that which is immortal in its very nature and divine in its essence, namely, the Ego, can exist for ever. And as it is that Ego which chooses th= e personality it will inform, after each Devachan, and which receives through these personalities the effects of the Karmic causes produced, it is therefore the Ego, that self which is the =93moral kernel=94 referred to an= d embodied karma, =93which alone survives death.=94 T GLOSSARY. pp 173-4 DTB BE-NESS is the absolute indescribable background to all life. It is a term that indicates the continuity of all consciousness throughout the period of rest called a Pralaya. =93BE-NESS. A term coined by Theosophists to render more accurately the essential meaning of the untranslatable word SAT. The latter word does not mean =93Being=94 for it presupposes a sentient feeling or some consciousnes= s of existence. But, as the term Sat is applied solely to the absolute Principle= , the universal, unknown, and ever unknowable Presence, which philosophical Pantheism postulates in Kosmos, calling it the basic root of Kosmos. and Kosmos itself=97 =93Being=94 was no fit word to express it. Indeed, the lat= ter is not even, as translated by some Orientalists, =93the incomprehensible Entit= y=94; for it is no more an Entity than a non-Entity, but both. It is, as said, absolute Be-ness, not Being, the one secondless, undivided, and indivisible All=97the root of all Nature visible and invisible, objective and subjectiv= e, to be sensed by the highest spiritual intuition, but=92 never to be fully comprehended.=94 Glos p 53 >From M.E.C. - What steps must I take to open the heart so as to exercise the Will for governing the Astral body? Answer - There is but one way to open the heart. That is by living the life= . It is a simple matter to govern the will, but this is not the true will. Th= e governing of the Astral body is the smallest of the tasks of the true will. The will should be used to obtain wisdom, and when so used it will control the Astral body without effort. We should exert psychic powers only to benefit others, never to free ourselves from the disagreeable. Let you aim be to find God; your motive, to know yourself for the sake of Theo-Sophia and humanity: you desire, to help humanity, and the True Will will be developed, the heart opened and you will not only control the Astral body but all in the Astral.=20 You must seek beyond the Astral for powers, but it is not wise to desire th= e acquisition of powers. Let your aim be beyond that, and the powers will gro= w of themselves. If the strong-willed or sick depress you, seek to aid each i= n some way, forget that you are depressed, forget your self, and they will no= t affect you.=20 The life of the Occult student is full of sorrow, anguish and depressing influences. These go to make him a student in the Occult.=20 A portion of his training is to become aware of these only in so far as the= y affect others. As to their affecting his own personality, he does not know they exist. If you desire to help humanity, then you possess the true motive. If you use your will in this cause, wisdom, peace and all the power= s will be given. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D 2 NON-ATTACHMENT or ISOLATION Q: C I also want to know how we are meant to be non-attached. I am referring to those that we love, how are we supposed to dis-attach ourselve= s from them, as did Gautama. To me this non-attachment leads to isolation. DTB=09 Motive is everything. Love is the one affection that binds all life together. It is all the virtues taken together in application. Vice or selfishness is destructive and causes all "bad karma." =93Non-attachment=94 means fairness and equity in the treatment of others. = We should love all our fellows, neighbors and family equally. >From Walter B. - (I) Is it well to cultivate the intellect at the expense of the heart? Do we not pay too much attention to intellectual progress, and in so doing allow the Heart-Mind to wander where it may? Answer - It is not wise to cultivate either at the expense of the other. Each alone will end at the same place - The Threshold. Both are excellent means for the manifestation of that which is higher that either, when cultivated to their highest in unison. Both are useless after a certain point, except as tools for truth. Metaphysics, logic and emotion all end at a dead wall. >From Adelphi - A most perplexed individual is writing to you. I have been for three years endeavoring to study Theosophy. I have heard lectures, have read an immense amount of literature devoted to that cult, from the sages of old down to the Sinnetts, Olcotts, and Blavatskys of the present day. I have conned the Yoga Philosophy and I read The Path. Light o= n the Path aids me not, nor does Bhagavad Gita, and why? Because I am yet without the first steps towards practice. (Surely Theosophy - like other sciences - must have something practical about it?) Guide me with your friendly hints. Imagine me alone in a room. How to commence? Show me the first step upon the practical ladder! All I have heard and read seemeth to me so elaborately unintelligible that I lay it aside and beg you to instruc= t me in my Theosophical A B C, Astral Light! Is it a figurative light, i.e. Revelation? or is it a light, as electricity - the Heavens - coal - gives light? If abstract (into insensibility) is necessary, can you instruct me upon Hypnotism (self mesmerism)? "A shining object" is advised to stare at! A mirror is a shining object, for instance. But of what avail to stare at a mirror and see reflected ugliness! Answer - You say that for three years you have been endeavoring to study Theosophy. Such being the case, you will meet with but little success. Divine Wisdom can not be a subject for study, but it may be an object of search. With the love for this same wisdom uppermost in our hearts, we ask you if it would not be wiser to lay aside the study of so called Theosophy and study yourself. Knowing yourself you know all men, the worlds seen and occult, and find Theo-Sophia.=20 One cannot absorb Theosophy as a sponge does water, to be expelled at the slightest touch. Our conception of Theosophy is apt to be based upon the idea that it is an especial line of teaching - a larger, wider, and great doctrine than others perhaps, but still a doctrine, and therefore limited.= =20 We must bear in mind that the true Theosophist belongs to no cult or sect, yet belongs to each and all; that he can find the true object of his search equally as well in the Hebrew bible as in the Yoga philosophy, in the New Testament equally as well as in the Bhagavad-Gita. You say you have "conned the Yoga philosophy." This is not enough; merely t= o "con" it is not to know it. It is in fact a most practical system (if you refer to that of Patanjali), and one that will meet all requirements you have in the way of difficulty; for it is one of the most difficult. It is not possible for you to judge its merits without practice: and it gives ful= l directions.=20 If for three years you study and practice it - aye for one year -, you will find that you need no other. In these matters there is no child's play nor the usual English and American method of mere book-learning, - we must absorb and work into the practice and the theory laid down, for they are no= t written merely for the intellect, but for the whole spiritual nature.=20 There must be within the man something which he already knows, that leaps u= p and out when he scans the books of wisdom; a thing already existing, which only takes an added life or confirmation from books. True Theosophy has all that is practical, but many forget this; there is no greater system of practice than that required by it. Desire wisdom; love all men; do your duty; forget yourself; let each though= t and act of your life have for its aim the finding of divine wisdom; strive to apply that wisdom for he good of other men. If you search in every direction, Light must come to you. Let the place in which you now are be th= e lonely room you speak of, and seek to find in everything the meaning.=20 Strive to know what they are, and by what governed or caused. This the firs= t step. Live your life with this ever before you. Purify your thought as well as your body. Reason all you can, feel all with your heart you may, and whe= n intellect and heart fail you, seek for something higher. This is the A.B.C.= ; it is enough for the present. It is not Theosophy that is a science, but its application. It is not a "cult," for it covers and includes all. The Astral Light is an actuality. It is not revelation, but a means through which that which causes revelation acts. Electricity, the heavens, all lowe= r fires, are but the shadows of the Astral Light, just as the Astral Light is but the darkness of the Ineffable Light. Abstraction into insensibility is not intended. If it had been so intended it would be unnecessary for us to be in these bodies. If you can forget yourself sufficiently - forget that you exist as a human body, you will not need to stare at a mirror; but so long as you realize, when staring into a glass, whether you be pretty or ugly, you can not reach Celestial sensibility or terrestrial insensibility. Hypnotism is the controlling of other personalities. Under this you would b= e but a puppet for the thought of another. Your outer self had better become = a puppet for you own thought. We seek to make the body alive, not to kill it. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D 3 Q.: I want to know why Animals suffer when there is obviously no Karma attached to their existence. DTB There are many reasons, as they are equally involved (as immortal monads) i= n evolution. Our own body is an "animal." It is informed by a "god-like consciousness" in potential. We share our monads with the animals and thus our Karma affects them. The great gap between us is the nature of the MIND= . They are still to acquire it.=20 DTB PROTECTION AND KINDNESS TO ANIMALS "...the purest as the noblest of all existing systems of ethics, Buddhism - -inculcates kindness and protection to every living creature, from animal and bird down to the creeping thing and even the reptile. Alone, our Western religion stands in its isolation, as a monument to the most giganti= c human selfishness ever evolved by human brain, without one word in favor of= , or for the protection of the poor animal." HPB Art II 328 KARMA OF ANIMALS "Animals have Karma, or consequence of act, but they have not man's responsibility. While they seem to suffer and enjoy, it is all without any self-consciousness, and hence is less in itself and less lasting in effect. Their karma is bound up with man; and he is the responsible one and will have to bear the responsibility, although they feel the burden directly." WQJ Art II 566=20=20 "...the effect of Karma upon the animals...(15) the whole of creation waits upon man and groans that he keeps back the enlightenment of all. What happens when...you crush out the life of a common croton bug ? Well, it is destroyed and you forget it. But you brought it to an untimely end, short though its life would have been. Imagine this being done at hundreds and thousands of places...Each of these little creatures had life, and energy; each some degree of intelligence, The sum total of effects of all these deaths of small things must be appreciable. If not, then our doctrines are wrong and there is no wrong in putting our the life of a human being ... [animals] killed for sport..." WQJ Art I 14-5 =09 "The brutes unconsciously are aware of the general human opposition, which in each human being they see focalized." WQJ Letters 87 KAMA - CENTER OF THE ANIMAL MAN "...(d) Kama rupa -- The seat of animal desires and passions. -- This i= s the center of the animal man, where lies the line of demarcation which separates the mortal man from the immortal entity." Key 91 SELF-CONSCIOUSNESS AND THE ABYSS=20 BETWEEN THE PSYCHIC AND THE NOETIC "...Self-consciousness belongs alone to man and proceeds from the SELF, the higher Manas. Only, whereas the psychic element (or Kama-manas) is common to both the animal and the human being--the far higher degree of its development in the latter resting merely on the greater perfection and sensitiveness of his cerebral cells--no physiologist...will ever be able to solve the mystery of the human mind, in its highest spiritual manifestation= , or in its dual aspect of the psychic and the noetic (or the manasic)...he would have to admit a lower (animal), and a higher (or divine) mind in man, or what is known in Occultism as the "personal" and the "impersonal" (10) Egos. For, between the psychic and the noetic, between the personality and the individuality, there exists the same abyss as between a "Jack the Ripper," and a holy Buddha." HPB Art II 9-10 "Between man and animal--whose Monads (or Jivas) are fundamentally identical--there is the impassable abyss of Mentality and Self-consciousness. What is human mind in it higher aspect, whence comes it, if it is not a portion of the essence--and, in some rare cases of incarnation, the very essence--of a higher Being: one from a higher and divine plane? Can man--a god in the animal form--be the product of Materia= l Nature by evolution alone. even as is the animal, which differs from man in external shape, but by no means in the materials of its physical fabric, an= d is informed by the same, though undeveloped, Monad--seeing that the intellectual potentialities of the two differ as the Sun does from the Glow-worm ? And what is it that creates such a difference, unless man is a= n animal plus a living god within his physical shell ?" S D II 81 NEPHESH -- THE ANIMAL SOUL "...(the) animal soul (Nephesh of the Hebrew Kabalist)...the ray which emanates from the Higher Manas or permanent EGO, and is that "principle" which forms the human mind--in animals instinct." Trans. 59 "...man has one "principle" more than the tiniest insect, but because man i= s a perfected animal, the vehicle of a fully developed monad, self-conscious and deliberately following its own line of progress, whereas in the insect, and even the higher animal, the higher triad of principles is absolutely dormant." Trans. 14-15 "A dog that has to exercise its own sagacity to find food, will sooner develop psychical powers in that direction, than one that does nothing but eat and sleep, and the individual or differentiated monad of the former wil= l sooner reach the condition necessary to enter the human kingdom. The rudiments of hope, patience, faith, fidelity, confidence, etc., are found i= n the animal kingdom." -- HPB Theosophist 5- p. 223=20 DIFFERENCE BETWEEN ANIMALS AND MEN "The difference between animals and men is this: the former are ensouled b= y the "principles" potentially, the latter actually." Key 104=09 MAN'S FORM IS AN ANIMAL "Man...in his outward form, simply an animal, hardly more perfect than his pithecoid-like ancestor of the 3rd Round. He is a living body, not a livin= g being, since the realization of existence, the "Ego-Sum," necessitates self-consciousness, and an animal can only have direct consciousness, or instinct. The soul, whose body vehicle is the Astral, ethereo-substantial envelope, could die, and man be still living on earth--i.e., the soul could free itself from and quit the tabernacle for various reasons--such as insanity, spiritual and physical depravity, etc. Therefore that which living men (Initiates) can do, the Dhyanis, who have no physical body to hamper them, can do still better." SD I 134-5 MAN A PERFECTED ANIMAL -- VEHICLE OF A MONAD "...man is a perfected animal, the vehicle of a fully developed monad, self-conscious and deliberately following its own line of progress, whereas in the insect, and even the higher animal, the higher triad of principles i= s absolutely dormant." Trans. 14-15 LIGHTING UP OF THE MANAS (MIND) "Having passed through all the kingdoms of nature in the previous three Rounds, his physical frame--one adapted to the thermal conditions of those early periods--was ready to receive the divine Pilgrim at the first dawn of human life, i.e., 18,000,000 years ago. It is only at the (255) mid-point of the 3rd Root-Race that man was endowed with Manas. Once united the two and then the three made one; for though the lower animals, from the amoeba to man, received their monads, in which all the higher qualities are potential, all have to remain dormant till each reaches its human form, before which stage manas (mind) has no development in them. In the animals every principle is paralyzed, and in a fetus-like state, save the 2nd (vital) and the 3rd (the astral), and the rudiments of the 4th (Kama, which is desire, instinct) whose intensity and development varies and changes wit= h the species." S D II 254-5 "Atma-Buddhi [ Monad ] is dual and Manas is triple; inasmuch as the former has two aspects, and the latter three, i.e., as a principle per se, which gravitates, in its higher aspect, to Atma-Buddhi, and follows, in its lower nature, Kama, the seat of terrestrial divisions awakening to intelligence; and the third and last decidedly animal: i.e., Manas succumbs to the temptations of Kama." Men are made complete only during their third, towar= d the fourth cycle (race). They are made "gods" for good or evil, and responsible only when the two arcs meet (after 3 1/2 Rounds towards the fifth Race). They are made so by the Nirmanakaya (spiritual or astral remains) of the Rudra-Kumaras, "cursed to be reborn on earth again; meanin= g doomed in their natural turn to reincarnation in the higher ascending arc o= f the terrestrial cycle." SD II 254-5fn PHYSICAL MAN "The physical man is as little responsible as a dog or a mouse. For the bodily form all is over with the death of the body. But for the real SELF, that which emanated its own shadow, or the lower thinking personality, that enacted and pulled the wires during the life of the physical automaton, wil= l have to suffer conjointly with its factotum and alter ego in the next incarnation." Trans. 67 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D Best wishes, Dallas =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D