Re: theos-talk John's BS on "Man - Fragments of Forgotten History"
Feb 12, 2012 06:43 PM
ÂÂ Thanks for your reply and comments, they are appreciated. Well, I stand better informed than I began, and thank you for helping correct my ignorance, you supplied further quotes of BlavatskyÂI wasn't aware of and that expanded my understanding as well as the rest of our members here. Â
As I said in my post I had never seen that book posted about here since I have been on this forum (since 1999). It was on that basisÂ and the quote I cited that IÂthought the notice about the book might be of interest so I posted it.ÂI read what I posted on an online version of the S.D. and that is where my posted citation originated from. I did not save it to my favorites and I don't recall the exact topic tag I was searching for then but I didn't make up the citation. I wasn't aware of madame blavatskys additional citation you so handily accessed and provided.
ÂÂ I apoligize for using your post to interject my way of referencing your topic about Man and the two primary principles and the rest in regards to theÂpsychology of being. It is just the way my personal mind works. In the futureÂI will avoid like the plague responding to your posts even when they are a beautiful work of Theosophy in writing ,as IÂdo not like to invite such responces.
You may inquire to any here as to whether I have ever named any one a "fool" , it is not a term I use.ÂBut the 22nd Tarot Card likes it lol.
I maight also say I very much liked your post and it's contents and hope youy contribute to posts many more with similar contents.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Jaqua" <hozro@CTomblWCCAfXnGv8oupds1Hp1r2nUjy80z1LkiiRYln908xxVpO-Pt8-JktHDtEX2TzQ5-oUey0kmwIjyvE.yahoo.invalid>
Sent: Sunday, February 12, 2012 9:00:55 AM
Subject: theos-talk John's BS on "Man - Fragments of Forgotten History"
"Man - Fragments of Forgotten History"
John writes: "Madame Blavatsky recommended that Theosophists read the above book as a companion to Esoteric Buddhism." (SD I, p. 160 orig. ed.) (rest of comment below)
Your comments don't have anything to do with my original post - and I guess I am playing your fool (which only means you don't care much what the truth is), but - I don't see anywhere where HPB _recommended_ reading "Man..." - but was highly critical of it, and wrote corrections to it - which never got included in the 2nd edition. Below is what HPB wrote (BCW 6, pp 412-3) including: "I could _certainly_ never recommend the book as a _standard work_ on Theosophy as it _now stands_...."
"There is a mystery connected with the writing and publication of MAN which I am not at liberty to make public in all its details. But since my name is in it and that the book is inscribed to me - I become indirectly responsible for its contents. Therefore shall I try to explain as much as I am permitted to.
"MAN is the production of two "Chelas" of whom one the "Eastern Chela" was a pucka disciple, the other the "Western Chela" - a candidate who failed. I could certainly never recommend the book as a standard work on Theosophy as it now stands, but ask the Theosophists to have patience and bear with it until it comes out in its second corrected edition. The "Western Chela" left it in a chaotic half-finished condition and went away from London, leaving the "Eastern Chela" in a very perplexed state. Those who had ordered the book to be written to try the psychical developments of Chela and Candidate - would have nothing more to say about it. Finding himself alone and left to his own resources, unwilling to meddle more than he could help with the MS. of his ex-colleague, the "Eastern Chela" did the best he could. It was found impossible to publish it as it stood: he finished those portions he had undertaken, rewrote many of the passages from the pen of the other amanuensis and left it to stand or fall upon its own merits. In justice, we must say that, with the exceptions of those portions that relate to the Rounds, Root-races and Sub-races in which there is a most terrible confusion, there is nothing incorrect in the book. On the contrary, there is much of very important information in it, but on account of the confusion above described, it cannot be recommended as a book of reference. In the Secret Doctrine, all the errors and misconceptions shall be explained away and corrected, I hope.
"H. P. Blavatsky
"November 7, 1885"
(- BCW 6, pp. 412-413)
- jake j.
>1b. Re: Theosophy and Psychology
Posted by: " Augoeides-222@Ae2KyqaivRyrsfN1xFzAvRuzW4zvsXHzAZAvHVvL8ehard05IXBhhoFCNVeh4hNRb5dp8ai9X4pG24GW56FesNj0.yahoo.invalid " Augoeides-222@Ae2KyqaivRyrsfN1xFzAvRuzW4zvsXHzAZAvHVvL8ehard05IXBhhoFCNVeh4hNRb5dp8ai9X4pG24GW56FesNj0.yahoo.invalid
Date: Fri Feb 10, 2012 10:27 am ((PST))
>Thanks for the neat comments. I want to take advantage of the topic you discuss Man and his Psychology by posting a link to a book Madame Blavatsky recommends to her readers in S.D., V1.
>Man --- Fragments of a forgotten history, by two chela s of the Theosophical Society -- Google Books
>>> http://books.google.com/books?id=PQ4AAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA96-IA1&dq=man+.+a.+p.+sinnett&hl=en&sa=X&ei=ZjUzT4TcHYXJiQKT2bzHCg&ved=0CF4Q6AEwCTgy#v=onepage&q=man%20.%20a.%20p.%20sinnett&f=false <<<
>and the Amazon.com page for the above book
>>> http://www.amazon.com/s?ie=UTF8&index=books&field-keywords=Man%3A%20fragments%20forgotten%20history%2C%20two%20chelas%20Theosophical%20society <<<
>Madame Blavatsky recommended that Theosophists read the above book as a companion to Esoteric Buddhism.
>I haven't any recall of seeing i t ever posted here on this Forum since 1999, but it is very worthy rea ding, the dedication opening reminds me of certain other paramount works of H.P.B. hope some of the members will find it instructive.
>From: "Mark Jaqua" < hozro@CTomblWCCAfXnGv8oupds1Hp1r2nUjy80z1LkiiRYln908xxVpO-Pt8-JktHDtEX2TzQ5-oUey0kmwIjyvE.yahoo.invalid >
Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 7:37:26 AM
Subject: theos-talk Theosophy and Psychology
>HPB on the Subconscious (and comments):
>"The fact is that the human brain is simply the canal between two planes - the psycho-spiritual and the material - through which every abstract and metaphysical idea filters from the Manasic dowe to the lower human consciousness..... Thus while the records of even important events are often obliterated from our memory, not the most trifling action of our lives can disappear from the 'Soul's' memory, because it is no MEMORY for it, but an ever present reality on the plane which lies outside our conceptions of space and time. 'Man is the measure of all things,' said Aristotle; and surely he did not mean by man, the form of flesh, bones and muscles!
>"Of all the deep thinkers Edgard Quinet, the author of _La CrÃation,_ expressed this idea the best. Speaking of man, full of feelings and thoughts of which he has either no consciousness at all, or which he feels only as dim and hazy impressions, he shows that man realizes quite a small portion only of his moral being. 'The thoughts we think, but are unable to define and formulate, once repelled, seek refuge in the very root of our being.' . . . When chased by the persistent efforts of our will 'they retreat before it, still further, still deeper into - who knows what - fibres, but wherein they remain to reign and impress us unbidden and unknown to ourselves . . .'
>"Yes; they become as imperceptible and as unreachable as the vibrations of sound and colour when these surpass the normal range. Unseen and eluding grasp, they yet work, and thus lay the foundations of our future actions and thoughts, and obtain mastery over us, though we may never think of them and are often ignorant of their very being and presence. Nowhere does Quinet, the great student of Nature, seem more right in his observations than when speaking of the mysteries with which we are all surrounded: 'The mysteries of neither earth nor heaven but those present in the marrow of our bones, in our brain cells, our nerves and fibres. No need,' he adds, 'in order to search for the unknown, to lose ourselves in the realm of the stars, when here, near us and _in us,_ rests the unreachable . . . As our world is mostly formed of imperceptible beings which are the real constructors of its continents, so likewise is man.'" - BCW XI, pp. 451-52
>I would say psychological events also stay for a lifetime in this unconscious register of events, and the more important they are, and undealt with, the more they constantly effect our conscious life. In "Theosophical Glossary," _Antahkarana_ is discribed as the connection between the higher and lower selves, and by Sankaracharya as "understanding" and other schools as "the internal instrument, the Soul, formed by the thinking principle and egoism..." I would think the Antahkarana could be described as the psychological nature itself, or directly dependent on the state of the psychological nature. If one's personal psychological nature is in chaos - it affects or destroys the Antahkarana, or connection with one's deeper nature. 'So mundane psychology, self-knowledge and psychological effort is part of the Theosophist's path, I think.
>- jake j.
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