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Re: theos-talk TS & politics

Mar 01, 2011 11:06 AM
by M. Sufilight

Dear Martin

My views are:

I prefer to in the vein of the Law of Karma (a hypothesis to some) to say,
that the world is an illusion, but the truth is shown there.

But yes, maybe it is more ignorance than arrogance which is the problem to some of the involved parties.
It could at least be considered.

The truth will not go away. The Law of Karma is always just and it never bends.
Saying, that it never happened will not help. Because it did.
Saying, that ethics are unimportant will not help.
When one avoid taking a stance about ethics in forum rules or a grouos constitution --- or seek blurring its original aims and its historical background - one begin to walk a path in opposition to the truth.

The following have been taken from Blavatsky teachings and covers many other philosophical core teachings.

We aught to Recognize the truth when it is proven to us.

The teachings are offered as a hypothesis.
We must lose sight entirely of: Personalities and Dogmatic beliefs. (Ph. D's and other university titles and cult behaviour included).We must be free from prejudice.Be free from conceit.Free from selfishness.We must find the highest meaning possible. We must be also non-sectarian.We must remember the handicap of language.We must eventually develop visdom.We must remember that H. P. B . makes no claim to infallibility.We must lead the life of Brotherhood.........So, I will say, that when - the present day members year March 1st, 2011 - at The Theosophical Society appearntly aim at blurring the fact that Annie Besantdeviated from the Original Programe of The Theosophical Society without clearly telling about the need for doing so.And if - the present day members year March 1st, 2011 - administrative leaders and members of The Theosophical Society completly aim at ignoring this fact,we find us in a position to claim that they no longer Seek the Truth and that the motto of the Theosophical Society:THERE IS NO RELIGION HIGHER THAN THE TRUTHare being sought made unimportant with regard to the original offence and the aim against involvement in politics.All the above are of course just my views.I might be in error. If so please tell me why._______________Martin, you are always welcome to join Theos-talk-Heart, which seek to be based on the Original Programe of the Theosophical Society.Theos-talk-Heart Sufilight

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Martin 
  Sent: Monday, February 28, 2011 6:24 PM
  Subject: Re: theos-talk TS & politics

  Yes, I am censored, many replies I sent in the past were not placed on 
  Theostalk. I do not see this as a hinderance, I see it more like: 'the world was 
  not ready for such"...hahahaha, how arrogant, lol.
  In Zenbuddhism the motto of the Theosophical Society could be:
  There is no Religion
  There is no Truth
  There isn't even a there
  No is not, nor is "is" and above is as good as below
  It is the Paradox divided by Zero: Love is everywhere, Mind is nowhere

  From: M. Sufilight <>
  Sent: Mon, February 28, 2011 5:53:34 PM
  Subject: Re: theos-talk TS & politics

  Dear Martin and friends

  My views are:

  Have you been censored on this forum?

  Despite this question I found your thought quite interesting.
  And I tend to agree, altough I see no importance of changing the motto today.

  M. Sufilight

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Martin 
  Sent: Sunday, February 27, 2011 8:42 PM
  Subject: Re: theos-talk TS & politics

  At the risk of being censored again, the wo/man who does so could say to himself 

  whether he is my judge, if so, he'd better choose another job, since no one but 
  Nature judges me...
  Politics is the art of lieing, who lies best stays mistake though 
  and you destroy not only yourself but also those you work for you and with 
  Truth doesn't need memory nor thought, Truth is and when needed memory and 
  knowledge comes to those who are in Truth at the blink of a Heartfelt feeling.
  There is no religion above Truth...I have changed this motto many times:
  To state such a motto, is a lie on itself, since Truth cannot be discussed, it 
  simply is...

  From: M. Sufilight <>
  Sent: Sun, February 27, 2011 8:24:53 PM
  Subject: Re: theos-talk TS & politics

  Dear Zaitzev and friends

  My views are:

  I find myself having a somewhat different view...

  H. P. Blavatsky wrote the following on politics:
  "Will you revile and scoff at the "Sermon on the Mount" because your social, 
  political and even religious laws have, so far, not only failed to carry out its 

  precepts in their spirit, but even in their dead letter? Abolish the oath in 
  Courts, Parliament, Army and everywhere, and do as the Quakers do, if you will 
  call yourselves Christians. Abolish the Courts themselves, for if you would 
  follow the Commandments of Christ, you have to give away your coat to him who 
  deprives you of your cloak, and turn your left cheek to the bully who smites you 

  on the right. "Resist not evil, love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do 

  good to them that hate you,"
  "Because, while the leaders of the Theosophical movement, recognising fully 
  their shortcomings, try all they can do to amend their ways and uproot the evil 
  existing in the Society; and while their rules and bye-laws are framed in the 
  spirit of Theosophy, the Legislators and the Churches of nations and countries 
  which call themselves Christian do the reverse."
  "ENQUIRER. Do you take any part in politics?

  THEOSOPHIST. As a Society, we carefully avoid them, for the reasons given below. 

  To seek to achieve political reforms before we have effected a reform in human 
  nature, is like putting new wine into old bottles. Make men feel and recognise 
  in their innermost hearts what is their real, true duty to all men, and every 
  old abuse of power, every iniquitous law in the national policy, based on human, 

  social or political selfishness, will disappear of itself. Foolish is the 
  gardener who seeks to weed his flower-bed of poisonous plants by cutting them 
  off from the surface of the soil, instead of tearing them out by the roots. No 
  lasting political reform can be ever achieved with the same selfish men at the 
  head of affairs as of old. 


  ENQUIRER. The Theosophical Society is not, then, a political organization?

  THEOSOPHIST. Certainly not. It is international in the highest sense in that its 

  members comprise men and women of all races, creeds, and forms of thought, who 
  work together for one object, the improvement of humanity; but as a society it 
  takes absolutely no part in any national or party politics.

  ENQUIRER. Why is this?

  THEOSOPHIST. Just for the reasons I have mentioned. Moreover, political action 
  must necessarily vary with the circumstances of the time and with the 
  idiosyncracies of individuals. While from the very nature of their position as 
  Theosophists the members of the T. S. are agreed on the principles of Theosophy, 

  or they would not belong to the society at all, it does not thereby follow that 
  they agree on every other subject. As a society they can only act together in 
  matters which are common to all - that is, in Theosophy itself; as individuals, 
  each is left perfectly free to follow out his or her particular line of 
  political thought and action, so long as this does not conflict with 
  Theosophical principles or hurt the Theosophical Society. "
  "The Society, as a body, eschews politics and all subjects outside its declared 
  sphere of work. The Rules stringently forbid members to compromise its strict 
  neutrality in these matters."
  (The Key to Theosophy, 2nd ed. 1890, p. 55-56, 231-232, 308)

  - - -
  M. Sufilight says:
  So her words in the article you mention (WHAT ARE THE THEOSOPHISTS?, 1882), 
  aught as I see it to be viewed in a different light than only a rejection of 
  Socialism and Communism, but also as a rejection of all political activities, as 

  being inferior to altruistic activity - the main aim of the Theosophical Society 

  from its very beginning in 1875.

  You cannot legislate altruism. Is is just as simple as that.

  So while Blavatsky in her article wrote against Socialism and Communism, she did 

  not interfere, but just said what anyone aiming at altruism would have to do, 
  namely that they were particularily inferior.

  That was also why Blavatsky wrote:
  "I have never written in all my life on politics, of which I know nothing. I 
  take no interest in political intrigues, regarding them as the greatest nuisance 

  and a bore, the most false of all systems in the code of ethics. I feel the 
  sincerest pity for those diplomats who, being honourable men, are nevertheless 
  obliged to deceive all their lives, and to embody a living, walking LIE."
  (Blavatsky Collected Writings volume 10 Page 293)

  I repeat, politics are to be viewed as "the most false of all systems in the 
  code of ethics".
  So I think it is clear that it is in that perspective one as a member of the 
  Original Programe of the Theosophical Society given in 1875-1891, and clearly 
  deviated from after 1907, aught to understand the aims it sought to promote. So 
  the Theosophical Society which aims at altruism, and name theosophy the exact 
  science on psychology --- seek reform in human nature and NOT reform through 
  political agendas or a Messiah craze - something which was promoted by Annie 
  Besant in her failure to recognize this altruistic need and the real aim and 
  even the Original rules of the Theosophical Society.
  But all the above are of course just my views.

  - What are your views?
  - Did Annie Besant not fail to follow the Original rules of the Theosophical 
  Society, (See Article XIII, in The Constitution and Rules of Theosophical 
  Society in the Theosophist, jan 1891)? 

  - If not, why not?

  M. Sufilight

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Konstantin Zaitzev 
  Sent: Saturday, February 26, 2011 10:23 PM
  Subject: theos-talk TS & politics

  --- In, "M. Sufilight" <global-theosophy@...> wrote:

  > still supports meddling with politics and a political involvement of the TS. 
  >This is what the TS Adyar website says today.

  Anyway, when maintaining that the Theosophical Society doesn't interfere with 
  politics, H.P. Blavatsky made one inportant exception:

  "Unconcerned about politics; hostile to the insane dreams of Socialism and of 
  Communism, which it abhors - as both are but disguised conspiracies of brutal 
  force and sluggishness against honest labour; the Society cares but little about 

  the outward human management of the material world." - WHAT ARE THE 

  The reason why TS doesn't interfere into the politics is that it permits 
  Theosophical Society to work in countries with different political regimes - 
  they would see no danger from its side. But communist regimes (with one 
  exception of Cuba with its religious freedom) persecute Theosophical Society, 
  for their ideological basis is materialism of the most baser sort.
  So in case of them (and also of nazist regimes which prevent realization of the 
  first object of TS) theosophists and TS at lagre should feel free of this 
  obligation, so it's permitted to undermine them by all possible means.
  HPB, with her clairvoyance, could foresee danger of the communist regimes, 
  though there were none yet in her time, and made this important exception.

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