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Re: Theos-World Some thoughts on current shakeup

Nov 16, 2009 08:07 AM
by Morten Nymann Olesen

Thanks, John.

My view, is, that the content of these books cannot be quite correct when speaking of the years given for the origin of I Ching or its use of signs.

You wrote your reply in another thread, than the one I wrote my words about I Ching in.
so I will let the sbject rest in this thread.

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  Sent: Monday, November 16, 2009 2:06 AM
  Subject: Re: Theos-World Some thoughts on current shakeup


  In regard to your other post about the early chinese yang-yin as original early form of the I-Ching I enjoyed reading itThe I-Ching has sister works the Shu-King and Shi-King, here are links to Google Books for them ( Ihave James legge's version here. 

  Shu-King Google Books general Listing 


  The Shu-King - Author Walter. G. Old Theosophist Later wrote under the name of "Sepharial" many works on Astrology, was in Blavatsky's inner circle of 12.The "Astral Tramp" she mentions. 


  The Shu-King Author James legge 


  James Legge Google books listings 



  ----- Originel Message ----- 
  From: "Morten Nymann Olesen" <> 
  Sent: Sunday, November 15, 2009 2:29:11 PM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific 
  Subject: Re: Theos-World Some thoughts on current shakeup 

  Dear MKR and friends 

  My views are: 

  I will ask some question seeking to forward my modest views from what I have learnt through the years. 
  You might agree or disagree. The questions are asked to promote the cause - the wisdoms teachings of all ages. 

  There is no Religion Higher than Truth. 

  - - - A. - - - 

  * M. Sufilight asks: 

  Let the reader in support of the previous e-mails quotes by Foster Bailey 
  read the following words, and consider why, they were active in 1891, and at the same time consider if they can be said to be active today in the TS and the AAB groups. 

  And if they are not, consider if that is a healthy idea. 
  What are your views? 

  - - - - - - - 

  As Revised in Session of the General Council, 
  all the Section being represented, 
  at Adyar, December 27, 1890. 

  The Theosophist - January 1891 


  1. Any Fellow who shall in any way attempt to involve the Society In political disputes shall be immediately expelled." 

  - - - 

  Article by H. P. Blavatsky 

  [In order to leave no room for equivocation, the members of the T.S. have to be reminded of the origin of the Society in 1875. Sent to the U.S. of America in 1873 for the purpose of organizing a group of workers on a psychic plane, two years later the writer received orders from her Master and Teacher to form the nucleus of a regular Society whose objects were broadly stated as follows: 

  (1) Universal Brotherhood; 

  (2) No distinction to be made by the members between]* races, creeds, or social positions, but every member had to be judged and dealt by on his personal merits; 

  (3) To study the philosophies of the East--those of India chiefly, presenting them gradually to the public in various works that would interpret exoteric religions in the light of esoteric teachings; 

  (4) To oppose materialism and theological dogmatism in every possible way, by demonstrating the existence of occult forces unknown to Science, in Nature, and the presence of psychic and spiritual powers in Man; trying, at the same time, to enlarge the views of the Spiritualists by showing them that there are other, many other agencies at work in the production of phenomena besides the "Spirits" of the dead. Superstition had to be exposed and avoided; and occult forces, beneficent and maleficent- ever surrounding us and manifesting their presence in various ways--demonstrated to the best of our ability. 

  Such was the programme in its broad features. The two chief Founders were not told what they had to do, how they had to bring about and quicken the growth of the Society and results desired; nor had they any definite ideas given them concerning the outward organisation--all this being left entirely with themselves. Thus, as the undersigned had no capacity for such work as the mechanical formation and administration of a Society, the management of the latter was left in the hands of Col. H. S. Olcott, then and there elected by the primitive founders and members--President for life. But if the two Founders were not told what they had to do, they were distinctly instructed about what they should never do, what they had to avoid, and what the Society should never become. Church organisations, Christian and Spiritual sects were shown as the future contrasts to our Society.1 " (BCW, vol. VII; 145-146) 

  - - - B. - - - 

  First I will forward the below quotes. And then I will ask a question or two. 

  From "The Key to Theosophy" 2nd ed., 1890: 
  "ENQUIRER. What is the origin of the name? 

  THEOSOPHIST. It comes to us from the Alexandrian philosophers, called lovers of truth, Philaletheians, from fil (phil) "loving," and ajlhvqeia (aletheia ) "truth." The name Theosophy dates from the third century of our era, and began with Ammonius Saccas and his disciples*, who started the Eclectic Theosophical system. 

  ENQUIRER. What was the object of this system? 

  THEOSOPHIST. First of all to inculcate certain great moral truths upon its disciples, and all those who were "lovers of the truth." Hence the motto adopted by the Theosophical Society: "There is no religion higher than truth." â The chief aim of the Founder of the Eclectic Theosophical School was one of the three objects of its modern successor, the Theosophical Society, namely, to reconcile all religions, sects and nations under a common system of ethics, based on eternal verities." 

  - - - 
  H. P. Blavatsky said: 
  " "Theosophy teaches self-culture . . . and not control," we are told. Theosophy teaches mutual-culture before self-culture to begin with. Union is strength. It is by gathering many theosophists of the same way of thinking into one or more groups, and making them closely united by the same magnetic bond of fraternal unity and sympathy that the objects of mutual development and progress in Theosophical thought may be best achieved. "Self-culture" is for isolated Hatha Yogis, independent of any Society and having to avoid association with human beings; and this is a triply distilled SELFISHNESS. For real moral advancement--there "where two or three are gathered" in the name of the SPIRIT OF TRUTH--there that Spirit or Theosophy will be in the midst of them. " (BCW, vol. VII; p. 160) 

  - - - 
  H. P. Blavatsky said: 
  "With the advent of Theosophy, the Messiah-craze surely has had its day, and sees its doom." (Lucifer, july 1890) 

  - - - 
  H. P. Blavatsky said: 
  "true Theosophists will never accept ...a Christ made 
  ( H.P. Blavatsky's COLLECTED WRITINGS, Volume VIII) 

  - - - 
  * M. Sufilight now asks: 
  How will the present day TS and AAB groups avoid failing to follow either one or more of the above quotes by H. P. Blavatsky? 
  How will they now and in the future avoid promoting a Messiah dogma as such and a Messiah dogma in the flesh? 

  What are your views? 
  What is theosophy proper to you? 

  - - - C. - - - 

  * M. Sufilight now asks: 
  Should it also not be clearly stated, that the President of The Theosophical Society or any other body of The Theosophical Society cannot affiliate any group or organisation with The Theosophical Society if it promotes dogmas as such or dogmas in the sense of a past Messiah in the flesh, promoted Messiah in the flesh, or future Messiah in the flesh? 
  What are your views? 

  M. Sufilight 

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: MKR 
  To: theos-talk ; theos-l 
  Sent: Sunday, November 15, 2009 8:23 PM 
  Subject: Theos-World Some thoughts on current shakeup 

  Witnessing the remarkable events starting with the nomination for the 
  International President, a cleverly organized attempt to defeat the sitting 
  President distributing unsubstantiated health issue, after the President was 
  re-elected with world-wide membership support, the allegations of election 
  procedural errors in the Indian Section and finally the most daring ultra 
  secret attempt to disenfranchise all members world-wide and seize control of 
  the President and finally the display of wide cleavage in the General 
  Council meeting are crisis developments TS never seen since Coloumb affair 
  which shook TS to its roots. Current disaster was averted due to Internet 
  being available to keep members around the world fully informed without 
  interference from the leaders. 

  HPB had her share of problems from TS and she had mentioned that the 
  troubles have always been from within. Even during Besantâs time, she had 
  her share of troubles and again she had stated that they are from within and 
  arising from the esoteric section members. 

  In the light of the above, I was fortunate to find a very interesting piece 
  of information in Joseph Rossâ recent book - The New Krotona from Hollywood 
  to Ojai - Vol III. (The book can be ordered from 

  Foster Bailey (husband of Alice Bailey) writing in The Beacon (1922) made 
  some very interesting comments. I am quoting it below, since it might be of 
  great interest to some here. 

  Foster Bailey begins with a quotation from The Key to Theosophy: 

  "Enq. But if you have such wise and good men to guide the Society, how is it 
  that so many mistakes have been made?" 

  "Theo. The Masters do NOT guide the Society, nor even the Founders; and no 
  one has ever asserted that they did: they only watch over and protect it. 
  This is amply proved by the fact that no mistakes have been able to cripple 
  it, and no scandals from within, nor the most damaging attacks from without, 
  have been able to overthrow it. The Masters look at the future, not at the 
  present, and every mistake is so much more accumulated wisdom for the days 
  to come. That other "Master" who sent the man with the five talents did not 
  tell him how to double them, nor 
  did he prevent the foolish servant from burying his one talent in the 
  earth." H.PB. 

  We all recognize the unity of life which lies behind that expression of 
  Brotherhood to which every theosophist has subscribed. We cannot begin to 
  live Brotherhood until we have recognized and felt "Group consciousness." 
  Co-operation is the beginning of Brotherhood, it is learning to work in 
  group formation, it is the Keynote of the NewRace. 

  It is possible to be a theosophist without being a member of a Theosophical 
  Society, but under the Law of Brotherhood which works toward unity and group 
  consciousness, once having joined this Brotherhood organization we have the 
  opportunity to work with our brother members for the common cause; a cause, 
  by the way, which is not the building of a great Society, or the 
  establishing of a theosophical system of thought, as such, but the 
  presenting of the Ageless Wisdom to our fellow men in whatever aspect and 
  degree is most needed for the helping of the Race. To aid the group to help 
  the world, that Is the true objective of the individual member. 

  To refuse longer to work in group formation because we dislike certain 
  prominent ones, or our immediate co-workers, or because we are disgusted 
  with things as we find them with in the group, is failure. It means 
  inability to discriminate between the essential and the less essential and 
  must bring the hard karma of delay in the plan and of failure to use 
  opportunity earned. 

  The great mass of humanity works out its karma under the Law generally quite 
  unaided by individual help. The Masters work primarily with groups and a 
  discipleâs usefulness and progress is measured not alone by his prominence, 
  brilliance or virtue but by his increasing ability to raise the rate of 
  vibration of ever larger groups. 

  The Disciple, however, because he has recognized the Law of Sacrifice and is 
  pledged to Service, is given special aid and protection. This aid very 
  largely takes the form of opportunity to balance his karma as he goes along, 
  and to work off old karma as fast as is consistent with the work in hand. 
  One of the main lessons of the Initiate is to learn to balance his own 
  karma, for it is because the Master automatically and immediately balances 
  his karma that he can work in the three worlds and yet remain free. Because 
  the Disciple and the Initiate have elected consciously to submit to a 
  forcing process in their own evolution in order that they may the better 
  serve, they necessarily make more mistakes than those not subjected to so 
  great a strain and the resulting karma would render them quite useless for 
  long periods of time if the Master did not help them to adjust it at 
  frequent intervals. 

  As there is individual karma so also there is group karma and a wise 
  comprehension of the present situation in the T.S. requires some 
  understanding of this factor. 

  The Theosophical Society is a group which has consciously chosen to accept 
  this forcing process in order to be an instrument for the Masters in world 
  service. It is therefore in somewhat the same relation to the group of 
  Masters as the Disciple is to his own Guru and it may therefore expect the 
  same increased number of mistakes, the same resulting karmic crises and the 
  same kind of adjusting help. This help it receives for, "no mistakes have 
  been able to cripple it and no scandals have been able to overthrow it." 

  One thing which the Society does in a most peculiar and interesting and 
  often in a most uncomfortable way, is to take an apparently indiscriminate 
  lot of ordinary humanity and begin at once to make occultists of them. Very 
  naturally this motley crowd, of which you and I are parts, makes quite a 
  mess of it and gets all stirred up every once and a while and this very 
  business of being-all stirred up saves its life. The usefulness of the 
  theosophical group would, as in the case of the Disciple, be very quickly 
  destroyed, if its karma were not apportioned in time, adjusted in intensity 
  and arranged for the further teaching of those who participate therein. This 
  is the protection given our Society. This the Masters do for us, using the 
  mistakes of the leaders and members to create situations whereby the 
  individuals may be stirred to that independent thought and action which 
  produces the needed balancing and adjustment and liberates force and energy 
  for larger constructive usefulness. 

  This is what is going on at the present time within the Theosophical 
  Society. The period of adjustment is the period during which the unit is 
  forced to consider the condition and the welfare of his group. The period 
  which follows of peace and growth and work is the period wherein the unit 
  having made the necessary adjustment can work with renewed vigor and 
  effectiveness through his group for the helping of his fellow men. 

  If this is so we are getting ready for bigger and grander and more important 
  times and effectiveness. It is often said that after each shaking the 
  Society goes on with renewed life to better things. It has been so in the 
  past; it will be so this time. This we can say for our comfort. The power of 
  the period of peace and growth must be proportional to the intensity of the 
  adjustment struggle; the effectiveness of the work of the days to come will 
  match the effectiveness of the adjustment achieved. We could almost be eager 
  to be shaken yet a little more if we could only get our eyes off of the 
  ugliness of the immediate foreground on to the beauty of the possibilities 
  on the horizon. 

  Surely then, we will not get disgusted or tired or self-righteous, or allow 
  ourselves to be shaken out of the Society either singly or in little group 
  fragments, thus weakening the body of the whole and creating individual bad 
  karma for ourselves. Better to remain where we are striving sincerely, 
  dispassionately and disinterestedly to understand the lessons which the 
  turmoil of the hour must inevitably hold for us and for our group. 

  The fundamental purpose back of all the varying situations and incidents in 
  the different Sections is the forcing of the members to think for themselves 
  and to realize and take up the responsibilities which are their own. Let us 
  therefore study the principles and the laws of right theosophical group 
  activity and organization, realizing ourselves as conscious participants in 
  the business of the whole, in order that we may wisely take advantage of the 
  present period and pass on to that happier endeavor which is waiting for us 
  on the threshold of tomorrow. 


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