[Date Prev] [Date Next] [Thread Prev] [Thread Next]

Re: Theos-World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of Truth"?

May 22, 2009 02:05 PM
by Leon Maurer

Previous letters, once read, may have been deleted and forgotten.
So, how can any readers in an open forum understand what you are talking about if you don't quote the e-mail you are responding to?
Just the subject line is not enough.

On May 22, 2009, at 5/22/094:35 AM, Antonio/Tony None wrote:

Dear Morten,

I am glad we can find resolutions amongst the chaos :)

Peace and blessings

--- On Fri, 22/5/09, Morten Nymann Olesen <global-> wrote:

From: Morten Nymann Olesen <>
Subject: Re: Theos-World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of Truth"?
Date: Friday, 22 May, 2009, 8:08 AM

      Thanks you for your answer.

I am happy to learn that you found my answer useful.

And your assumptions about miracles are part of the ones I use.

The e-mail can be read again from time to time if in need.

M. Sufilight

----- Original Message -----

  From: Antonio/Tony None

  To: theos-talk@yahoogro

  Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2009 11:04 PM

Subject: Re: Theos-World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of Truth"?

Hi Morten,

Fair enough. I guess i can relate in that my album will be my calling card and as Sai babas trick did not come off so too might my album not come off. In this respect i can overstand your take on things. In saying this i still think someone enlightened would not consider the actions sai babe considerd and on this it may be better for us to agree to dissagree.

Regarding the information you sent in this email.

Firstly in my opinion what i percieve is ment by the first statment is that one must adapt to as a teacher to the level of learning of his pupil. Personally i feel there are more appropriate ways sai baba could have done this than stage magic.

Yes it is a sensetive matter in that you must be extreamly careful how you administer your teachings as people will be more than happy to pick holes in the way you teach. On this occasion i think sai baba's actions are a perfect case in point.

Regarding the second statment which i found quite interesting:

Disorder is a human condition and until we are perfected human we will always need theraputic approaches in dealing with this. I think what is meant by this statement is not to confuse this with wisdom teaching and the esoteric in that the two should be seperated and the esoteric wisdoms should not be applied in dealing with ones chaos and dissorder of mind. Rather that the esoteric teachings should be delved into with the clearest of minds. if this simple rule is not followed i would agree that the teachings could be miscontrude and what goes into the machine will come out totally distorted.

The last statment did not make sense in my opinion perhaps there are words missing?

From what i can assume the statement is trying to bring to light the fact that miracles happen to enlightened masters and people percieveing this may or may not take hold of these happenings through the need to associate with something beyond the norm. But as i say this is very unclear to me. Perhaps a better break down would merit better insight on my part.

Thank you for the link i will aim to have a look, time permitting.

Peace and blessings


--- On Thu, 21/5/09, Morten Nymann Olesen <global-theosophy@ stofanet. dk> wrote:

From: Morten Nymann Olesen <global-theosophy@ stofanet. dk>

Subject: Re: Theos-World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of Truth"?

  To: theos-talk@yahoogro

  Date: Thursday, 21 May, 2009, 9:18 PM


I also do care.

Antionio wrote:

"Why he would wish to do this i dont know?"

I know that Sai Baba has said that his parapsychological activities are due to him using them as a "calling-card" - to get attention from people, so that they might be more open minded in listening to what he has to say to them.

Sai Baba's teachings are coinciding a whole lot with Adwaita Vedanta and Patanjali teachings.


The following from Idries Shah's corpus might be helpful to consider:

"What is so perplexing to conditioned attitudes about Wisdom teachers is that, unlike teachers of other kinds, they refuse to stick to one kind of appearance. As an example, if you go to see a Wisdom Teacher, he/she may not look, talk or act like a mystical master at all. This is because he/she says either: 'You can teach only by the method indicated for each pupil, and you may have to teach by what seems to him/her unlikely'; or else because he/she says: 'There is a time and a place and certain company. According to these, we will teach. When it is time to be serious, we will be serious. When it is time to work through what looks like ordinary things, we have to do so.'

So importan is this lesson that it can be said to go before all others: in the sense that failure to know this can prevent you from learning more - and can leave you attached to externals of hypocrites. This includes, of course, unconscious hypocrites.

If the Masters are right in their claim that time affects behaviour, and that personal appearance should change (and even temperament) then obviously all the people who cultivate a reveend appearance, and all those who acquire it, mistaking this for spirituality, are wrong."


"The genesis of the attitude adopted by the people of externals is that their invard drive is for finding tidiness, order. This is not a spiritual activity, it is perhaps, rather, a therapeutic one. Order is essential for disordered people. Looking for it as a major factor in 'esoteric' directions is the mistake.

In trying to make what - for them - is order out of what they imagine to be the disorder of Wisdom teachings, they have to over- simplify. They ignore parts of the teaching and succed only in creating an imitation of the Wisdom teachings of all ages.

Because so many people desire order so strongly, you will find more imitations than reality. One cannot blame anyone for this. But pointing out facts can help."


"Wisdom Masters who have reached stages where strange things happen in their vicinity, generally called miracles and wonders, due to actions OTHER than attempt to mpress, have to try to compensate for this. Otherwise people are attracted to them or to the Wisdom Teachers in general because of craving for wonders."



Al-Khidr's behaviour in this link is also strange, but it might be able to explain the strange behaviour Sai Baba has from time to time.

http://en.wikipedia .org/wiki/ Al-Khidr


M. Sufilight

----- Original Message -----

From: Antonio/Tony None

To: theos-talk@yahoogro

Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2009 9:34 PM

Subject: Re: Theos-World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of Truth"?

Hi Morten,

First let me say i never take sides. My opinions and thoughts are soley my own.

The last intention i have is to cause disharmony amongst this group so please do not take any of my thoughts or opinions personally , rather if you choose , reflect and form your own opinions.

To address the point you made.

It could be percieved that i have self contradicted, however my opinion regarding sai baba was formed without the knowledge you brought to my attention regarding BC's beliefs.

If this is what BC beleives than that is his choice. You and I may beleive in the same philosophy or religion but our perceptions may vary. My point is that perhaps BC's views and beleifs are all correct and perhaps some are and some arent, none of us are perfect and our beleifs in turn are prone to contradictions. if this is what BC truly beleives it begs the questions of why Sai Baba would resort to materialisations and others kinds of parapsychological activities. Not to say this is right or wrong , what is wrong is when you have missplaced intentions. My only conclusion from what i saw on youtube was Sai baba's intention was to fool his followers and his trick went wrong and he was exposed. Why he would wish to do this i dont know? Perhaps the pressure of appearing to have extraordinary capabilities may be one reason or perhaps his intent was to wow his followers in turn increasing his reputation as the cosmic avatar. These are only assumption and


the end of the day only Sai Baba knows his true intentions. My point was that a spiritually enlightened being would not even entertain the thought of conducting such an act. In my opinion a spiritually enlightened being would simply use words. Words are both weapons and healing tools and thus the true form of all magic. by these means and these means alone would a true avatar address humanity.

if you need me to elaborate further by all means let me know which points you would like me to address.

Peace and blessings


--- On Thu, 21/5/09, Morten Nymann Olesen <global-theosophy@ stofanet. dk> wrote:

From: Morten Nymann Olesen <global-theosophy@ stofanet. dk>

Subject: Re: Theos-World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of Truth"?

To: theos-talk@yahoogro

Date: Thursday, 21 May, 2009, 5:40 PM

Dear Antonio and friends

My views are:

Maybe it is just me, but are your statement not self-contradicting.

I ask:

How can you say that Benjamin Creme is allright when he says that Sai Baba is a Cosmic Avatar and higher than his own claimed Maitreya Avatar, - and then go on to say that Sai Baba is false and fake? You simply lost me there?

- - -

It would be helpful if you would document your views instead of almost saying that "belief" is more valid than actual knowledge.

Why is it wrong when Sai Baba makes what he calls materialisations and others kinds of parapsychological activities?

I mean to some persons reading or driving a car is pure magic, to others it is quite natural and is done out compassion. So what is the actual difference?

M. Sufilight

----- Original Message -----

From: Antonio/Tony None

To: theos-talk@yahoogro

Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2009 5:51 PM

Subject: Re: Theos-World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of Truth"?

As a response to this i saw a youtuube video of Sai Baba doing stage magic terribally badly. If you like i would be happy to post this but it may distort your opinion of him. In my opinion any spiritually enlightened master would simply not engage in something of this nature. Regarding BC and Sai Baba following the exact same paths i would have to dissagree. The same way you can have two people working for the same organisation , they are still both individuals and their beleifs, intentions and choices and actions will always differ to ceartian degrees. I have seen enough of BC to know he is noble in nature and wants a positive conclusion to the chaos in this world. Wether this is an extreamly good act or not i do not know but until i see otherwise i will not assume.

Peace and Blessings


--- On Thu, 21/5/09, Morten Nymann Olesen <global-theosophy@ stofanet. dk> wrote:

From: Morten Nymann Olesen <global-theosophy@ stofanet. dk>

Subject: Re: Theos-World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of Truth"?

To: theos-talk@yahoogro

Date: Thursday, 21 May, 2009, 8:29 AM

Dear Cass and friends

My views are:

And you are of course able to document the view that Sai Baba are a fraud?

I suggest you read the words by Al Khidr taken from the not to-be- read-dead- letter Quran before answering.

Al Khidr (The Green Guide. The Master of the Masters.)

http://en.wikipedia .org/wiki/ Al-Khidr

M. Sufilight

----- Original Message -----

From: Cass Silva

To: theos-talk@yahoogro

Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2009 3:35 AM

Subject: Re: Theos-World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of Truth"?

Sai Baba and Crene are both frauds - Crene may be delusional but Sai Baba knows how to exploit for gain


____________ _________ _________ __

From: Morten Nymann Olesen <global-theosophy@ stofanet. dk>

To: theos-talk@yahoogro

Sent: Thursday, 21 May, 2009 8:08:22 AM

Subject: Re: Theos-World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of Truth"?

Dear friends

My views are:

On Share Internationals website we have the following:

"Maitreya and other well-known figures

This page sheds some light into the relationship between Maitreya and some well-known figures such as Sai Baba, the Buddha, Krishna and Krishnamurti. This information is excerpted from the books by Benjamin Creme."

"Maitreya & Sai Baba

Sri Sathy Sai BabaSai Baba is a teacher or guru in south India with an enormous following. Hundreds of thousands, perhaps one or two million people from all over the world would claim to be his devotees. These Followers see him as God, the creator of the universe. He is a cosmic avatar. Sai Baba and Maitreya both embody the same energy--what we call the Christ principle, the energy of Love --- Sai Baba at the cosmic level, Maitreya at the planetary level."

http://www.share- international. org/maitreya/ Ma_others. htm

So if one follows Cremes views, one might just the same or even better follow Sai Babas?

If so, why do we have to believe that there is more than one Avatar, when Sai Baba never mentions Cremes Maitreya Avatar?

So why indeed use the Great Invocation written by Alice A. Bailey so to accomplish her views given in the book named "The Externalization of the Hierarchy"?

M. Sufilight

----- Original Message -----

From: Antonio/Tony None

To: theos-talk@yahoogro

Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2009 11:27 AM

Subject: Re: Theos-World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of Truth"?

Dear Leon,

Thanks for your response.(Theos- World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of Truth"?)

It would be very interesting from my perspective to know of these 4 musicians. Are there any links i could look into please?

I overstand your skepticsm and think it is valient. One should never accept any movement for total peace or total anarchy with blind faith but instead should evaluate the intricacies of that movement and make an intuitive decision as to wether or not its intentions are good or evil. In my case i am a total believer in love and peace and i am always considerate and compassionate when i see injustic in our world. My aim is simply to bring to light a philosophy or ideal which i feel will make the world a better place and yes we shall see how the labum impacts. I will post a link on this thread nearer the time of its release for all to listen to and digest and reflect and offer opinions on.

Regarding BC, I am also of the beleif that he may be working for the very people who want to impose a globalist agenda of control on the world. Perhaps if he has to accept the possibilty of a truely benevolent Maitreya through pressures from humanity his individual beliefs or plans would not come to fruition but those of Maitreya will. Lets hope this is the case or that BC is himself benevolent and wishes for love and peace in a chaotic world.

I am in agreement with you comment about christ consciousness and self realisation. I beleive that each of us have the ability to become gods. When i say gods i mean it in the purest eseence of love and peace. Mastered individuals that see and feel the interconectedness of all of humanity. My album is about raising this awareness in each of us. Wether or not Christ himself returns is a matter of speculation. That fact is totally out of my hands and in part irrelevent to my particular chosen path. All i can do is follow my beleifs and continue to better myself in order to serve humanity in the most productive and peacful way possible.

I have read up on the ancient mystery schools that came out of egypt and that are now administered in most secret societies and how these degrees circumnavigate the tree of life, ultimatly leading to enligtenment. Wether this is effective or not i do not know but i guess the only way to find out is to immerse yourself in that world and work your way to the top as the proof is in the pudding. Personally i choose to tread my own made path as i know my end goal is self realisation and enlightenment in its purest form of love and truth.

i have seen the video of the indian self proclaimed mesiah and his silly hand trick that didnt quite come off! how very silly. These fabricators and dupers will always eventually be exposed it is just a shame that a handfull of followers commit themselves to these types of individuals through blind faith without question. In the end crime never pays ;)

Peace and blessings


--- On Wed, 20/5/09, Leon Maurer <leonmaurer@ aol. com> wrote:

From: Leon Maurer <leonmaurer@ aol. com>

Subject: Re: Theos-World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of Truth"?

To: theos-talk@yahoogro

Date: Wednesday, 20 May, 2009, 5:04 AM

Hi Antonio,

Since everyone here could be reading our letters, and don't always

save read messages, it would be a good idea to quote whatever

posting you are responding to.

As I have said all I needed to about your ideas and plans in my last

correspondence, we'll just have to wait and see if your visions are

real and the future you predict will be realized in this century, if

not in our lifetimes.

I may be a bit jaded and skeptical -- since you are the fourth self

proclaimed music maven messiah I have encountered since the mid

1940s. I'm still waiting for any of the prophesies they made to come

true. One of them, a very successful musician (whom I met in the

60's and toked with in NY Central Park during the 70s) even got

eliminated by the dark side powers that be -- when he came too close

to initiating his revolution to bring peace and love to the world.

So, there's no way to know whether he was the real messiah (although

his music still lives on with his message -- that continues to

influence many people to think and act theosophically) .

In the meantime, we'll all look forward to your forthcoming album --

with the hope that it can really help change the world and bring it

closer to peace, love, and universal brotherhood.

To answer your question... I don't think there that any true

theosophist -- (many of whom are NOT active members of the splintered

Theosophical Society) -- could ever consider Creme a theosophist or

that the man who calls himself Maitreya, is the Messiah he claims to

be -- since the theosophical Masters themselves do not believe in a

personal God or his supposed avatars in the flesh. As the great

teacher Jesus said, "you shall know them by their fruits." So, the

fact that Creme believes in Maitreya makes it obvious that he may be

one of the tools of the "New World Order" conspiracy.

And, it also should be obvious that the Christ's (NOT Jesus) apparent

"return" has already occurred within every true theosophist who has

achieved self realization, merged his higher self with the Universal

Self, and has become a nucleus of universal brotherhood -- the prima

object of the theosophical movement.

Therefore, no one can claim he is the ONLY Christ-Messiah, in order

to rule and be worshipped and followed... Like the Pharaohs of

ancient Egypt... None of whom could perform any true miracles --

other than fooling ignorant people with the same, apparently magical,

knowledge used by both Jesus and Moses (and even HPB, who also knew

all the rules of "glamour" and "Mesmerism" -- like the "Fakirs" in


No doubt the current Maitreya claimant uses those same "stage magic"

techniques to fool the superstitious Hindu mobs who attend his

meetings in India.

Good luck with your album.

Best wishes,


On May 18, 2009, at 5/18/095:11 PM, Antonio/Tony None wrote:

Hi Leon,

Thanks for your indepth feedback.

I have taken on board your points of view and what seems to be a

vast wealth of knowledge, well articulated in your reply.

I can't help the beliefs that i have, they are a result of my life

experiences. I beleive it is my calling to break down what the new

world order is and what their true agenda is. I would have to agree

that the new world order is a powerful ideal one that could

potential destroy or heal the world in which we live.

The fact remains that regardless of your beliefs, the powers that

be will indeed see their plans come to fruition. The TS in my

opinion has many faces. It is the culmination of opinions and

ideals of each member that create the future for the TS.

I have recently watched a few of Krishnamurti' s lectures and i saw

him talking at the UN and being introduced as the World Teacher.

Although i respect his views i still think he was far off the mark

in terms of what i would percieve the real world teacher to be.

Benjamin creme a self proclaimed theosphist believes in Maitreya

and i am not quite sure what to make of that fact. Is this not a

common beleief amongst members of the TS?

There are many conflicting views and i can see why the TS is being

torn and sides are being formed. My real aim is to break down the

viel of secrecy and show people what is really going on. I honestly

beleive that the false messiah will actually fool the very elite.

those who beleive he will be used as another pupet to bring about

their agenda. However i think this is where Maitreya will come into

his element and expose the very people that think he is working for

them. They say if you cant beat them join them. That is the only

way to beat them, from within.

If my album makes some waves and i am sure with the confession of

who i am in my songs it will. Then i hope that the powers that be

will wake up and realise that i am here to help them with their

plans. Once inside the devils house i will use love to contaminate

the evils and thus turn power inside out.

The fact that Maitreya is not destined to arrive for sometime

according to your calculations does not deter me in my efforts as

time is not relevent to my end goal. The fact is this earth will

long perish before the time of Maitryea's arrival based on buddhist


My time to act is now. My life will be put on the line. What i am

talking about in my music could lead me to public ridicule

something i am willing to sacrafice for change.

The bottom line is i know that Maitryea is a false prophet and i

also know that without this false prophet Christ can not reapear.

So in order to bring about Christs coming i am willing to be the

antichrist or false messiah. I want to make that sacrafice. I feel

that is my calling.

So i will follow my beleifs to the end and see where my album takes


That overshadowing experience is one i want back. That was the only

time in my life that i felt complete, connected and truely at

peace. That is what i am aiming for and i feel when my life's work

is complete i can either totally let go of that part of my life or

totally embrace it based on the reaction of my material.

I have had amaizing visions of the future and one based on love and

peace and ultimatly that is what i am fighting for in the best and

most powerful way i know.

So it is obvious we have two very different points of view and i

respect yours and know that it is more of an educated enriched

perspective of the matters which we speak of but i must follow what

i beleive in with all my heart and hope to make positive change as

a result.

We shall see on the 22nd of July how east london reacts to my

campaign. Hopefully it will cause a stir and kick start a

revolution. But we will see.

Peace and blessings


--- On Mon, 18/5/09, Leon Maurer <leonmaurer@ aol. com> wrote:

From: Leon Maurer <leonmaurer@ aol. com>

Subject: Re: Theos-World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of


To: theos-talk@yahoogro

Date: Monday, 18 May, 2009, 8:49 PM


I don't want to burst your bubble, but that's the same kind of talk

that the early founders of the Catholic Church used -- that ended up

causing long periods of warfare and pogroms that caused deaths,

injuries, broken families and destruction of homes of countless

millions of people.

No matter what the motives are of the "false prophet" (Matthew

7:15-20) calling himself "Maitreya" (actually destined to come at the

end of Kali Yuga in about 400,000 years from now) -- who comes to

supposedly take charge of the global "New World Order" government --

it will be his sycophant inner circle of followers who will actually


And, as is well known to all students of history -- such absolute

power, in the hands of unenlightened and greedy people, always

corrupts absolutely. So, any government based on organized religion

centered around a divine Messianic figurehead, and dependent on

restrictive dictatorial laws to control the thoughts and actions of

the people, is destined to fail.

My hope (not fear) is that such a police state dictatorial government

never sneaks up on us -- like was attempted recently by another sweet

talking Jesus Christ loving, born again evangelical Christian -- who

slyly stole an election, became the US President and lied us into a

seemingly endless religious war -- with the help of his cabal of evil

minded political cronies. So, count on me to be one of the many

enemies of this false Messiah posing as Maitreya, and the New World

Order shadow government that backs him -- whoever he is or they are.

I'm afraid that any true theosophist who has already, or is studying

and practicing to reach full self realization, knows that none of the

works of man can ever solve the problems that man's works (guided by

edicts and rules created and sanctioned by their leaders, and

condoned by their personal greeds) has created. And no dictatorial

government set up to solve those problems can flourish without such

power, in the hands of the few, ending up just as corrupt as all

revolutionary movements eventually become, when they take over

dictatorial control of governing peoples lives.

Of course, no real theosophist is for a fully self governed, "no

rules" world... That is, untll ALL people are self realized and

enlightened. But, until then, the only good government would be a

true democratic government "of the people, by the people, and for the

people"... With a leadership that can be kicked out when the people

decide they are not serving the purpose they were elected for.

Surely,, such a government will never be ideal... But it is certainly

better than any dictatorship or monarchy over the long run.

And, agreed, the global monetary system would have to be radically

changed if such a true democracy could work effectively. But, we

must never forget that each group of people with similar customs

would have to remain free to practice them without interference -- so

long as they harm no one. So, a homogenous global governed world by

any dictatorial religious leader is not a realistic solution to the

world problems.

As it stands, the "New World Order" government you speak of, is the

same old plan for world dictatorship and takeover of the global

economy by the "Secret Society" of world bankers and brokers -- who

are just waiting for another phony Messiah to, knowingly or

unknowingly, act as their stooge in the role of world dictator --

under their guidance and control.

In no way can the ancient brotherhood of non interfering Masters and

Adepts be confused with this New World Order cabal of greedy elitists

and would be dictatorial monarchists.

While I don't believe in your personal God or his supposed coming

savior, I don't doubt your good intentions.. . Although, there is an

old truism saying that "the road to hell is paved with good

intentions." ;-)

But, be assured that no true theosophist has to worry about

"releasing the devil that is (supposedly) within them." ;-) The only

one's who have such devils in them are those who would sacrifice

individual liberty to a dictatorial government. So, maybe you should

study the fundamental teachings of theosophy before you start

preaching to those who truly understand and follow its Heart Doctrine.

So, stick with your love-teaching music, and stop trying to convert

into your religious beliefs, theosophists or any other spiritually

minded independent thinkers who, while they, too, may respect your

ideals, won't fall for smarmy, holier than thou talk -- when its

underlying motives lead to any sort of mind-controlling,

dictatorially religious governmental organization.

Incidentally, after going back in my unread letter files and reading

about your "overshadowing" as you call it -- I think you may have

experienced unconscious mediumistic Astral epiphanies that could have

been falsely interpreted as spiritual experiences. .. If so, I

recommend that you study some of the articles written by Blavatsky

about the Astral realm and the errors and dangers of such mediumship,

as contrasted with true adeptship. According to the occult laws,

there is no way for a living individual to contact an entity on the

spiritual plane -- although there are entities on the astral plane

(Buddhists call "hungry ghosts") that could mislead and be quite

evilly dangerous to a non adept. You can find such articles at:

http://www.blavatsk blavatsky- articles. htmt

Try this one for starters:

http://www.blavatsk arts/CaseOfObses sion.htm

Apparently your jumping from one mystical teaching to another and

your psychiatric breakdown experience are signs that should not be

ignored before your next Astral experience, unsolicited visions, or

uncontrolled kundalini awakening causes irrevocable damage... (That,

incidentally, could be especially dangerous if you have ever or are

now using psychoactive drugs.)

Best wishes,

Leon Maurer

On May 13, 2009, at 5/13/097:28 AM, Antonio/Tony None wrote:

Hi Leon,

I overstand your stance and your world views for a future based on

no rules. I feel this is commendable and eventually will become a

reality. Before this occurs the chaos in the world needs to be

addressed. I feel that the worlds choas needs to be drawn to one

central point and at that moment when the world awakens to the true

realisation will that point be destroyed and thus allow humanity to

move forward void of negative emotion. Fear surrounding the new

world orders plan is natural but the fact remains the freternal

brotherhood do exist and they do have an agenda to centralise all

power to one operating body. This is a very worrying and yet

exciting propesition. As head of this order, Maitreya will change

both internally and externally the processes by which we as humans

operate. From re-education, to the eradication of weapons. To

sharing with one another as a spiritual rush and taking the

monetary system totally out of the equation. The fact that

Maitrey may come to us via music is not something that should be

dismissed. God's biggest gift to Lucifer was music. My album will

be different and will totally challange spiritual concepts in our

reality but that will also be down to peoples interpretation.

People like yourself unwilling to accept such a movement as being

anything other than genuine and devinly inspired. You are the

people i need to reach most, the lost ones in the dark, searching

for the light, hoping for one day to realese the devil from within

you. Armegeddon is as much an inward battle as a world

transformation. It is ultimatly about vanquishing the evils from

within and emerging evolved into a connected higher state of

consciousness. If you fail to take this change on board your evils

will overwhelm and overcome you and evetually destroy you. So i

hope and pray that when you receive my words and my music that you

look on it with an open heart and you see the true intentions. The

intent to change a dying world through that one binding universal

truth. Love.

Peace and blessings


--- On Wed, 13/5/09, Leon Maurer <leonmaurer@ aol. com> wrote:

From: Leon Maurer <leonmaurer@ aol. com>

Subject: Re: Theos-World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of


To: theos-talk@yahoogro

Date: Wednesday, 13 May, 2009, 12:36 AM

Since the Masters knew what problems resulted from the

revealing of

their names by their first messenger (HPB) -- do you think they (or

their successors) would make the same mistake again when the new

messenger begins the new mission?

And, by all the rules set down by the Masters (and promulgated

through HPB) -- wouldn't the actual work on that mission have to

begin in I975 by someone already mature in the practical ways of the

modern world, fully educated and experienced in ALL the fine and

applied arts of current science, engineering and all levels of high

technology communication -- while also being fully indoctrinated with

the theosophical teachings -- to at least the beginning of adeptship

-- as was HPB when she began her mission in 1875?

And, wouldn't all the occult powers -- that also attracted hordes of

superficial sycophants and resulted in many fraudulent copycats

during and after HPB's time -- be intentionally withheld from their

new agent (such as the power of foresight and other siddhis was

withheld from HPB)?

Obviously, of course, none of the present Masters would ever reveal

themselves, personally, or allow their messenger to expose their

names this time around. There would also no longer be a need to

attract members to the teachings through an organization, or to a

notorious personality. .. Since all that now matters would be to

prove the theosophical teachings beyond a shadow of a doubt, free

each human to be their own judge and master, as well as discredit all

forms of organized religion based on supernatural causation, personal

Gods, vicarious atonement and living messiahs.


Think about all that, and try to imagine anyone in the Theosophical

Society, or appointed by its leaders, being in a position to fill

that role... Especially, anyone who is not fully indoctrinated into

the entire secret doctrine -- as thoroughly taught by HPB in ALL her


Didn't William Q. Judge say that there were only three books

necessary to fully comprehend theosophy -- which were, the Secret

Doctrine, the Bhagavad Gita, and the Yoga Aphorisms of Patanjali?

(Is it any wonder, then, why he transliterated all three -- along

with their detailed commentaries and answers to questions?)

Isn't it, then, also obvious why the real identity of the messenger

could not be revealed until the actual scientific "proof" of the

Secret Doctrine metaphysics actually shows up in the scientific

journals and the mass media, and becomes worldwide public knowledge?

And, even then, the true messenger will not be known, since the

accredited, peer reviewable physicists who win the prize for such a

proof will never acknowledge who or what inspired them -- (as

Einstein never would think of giving credit to HPB for his

theories.;-) See:

http://leonmaurer. info/einstein. html

Only, then, will all true theosophists recognize the new teachings

(with no need to make the retired messenger their leader) and rally

together as true "companions" to form the nucleus of the "universal

brotherhood" ... That, by their example, teaches the rest of the


the true meaning and practice of the Heart Doctrine of theosophy as

the basis of *true* democratic government.. . With no need of a

messiah and his hierarchical leadership, New World Order police state

governments, personal gods, priests, or religious organizations.

Thus, anyone who claims to be the new messenger, world teacher,

messiah, returned Christ, Maitreya, etc., before (or after) that

time, would necessarily be an impostor (or false prophet). And, the

biggest joke of all is the delusional idea that the "new message"

will be in the form of a musical album, sung by the messiah

himself ;-)

So, let's stop this endless speculative nonsense, and knuckle down to

learning and teaching pure theosophy -- so we'll all be ready when

that "new message" shows up... And, afterward, have no need for

organizations or leaders to tell us how to act (as one) in whatever

way is necessary to turn this world back into the paradise it was

meant to be.

Best wishes,

Leon Maurer

On May 11, 2009, at 5/11/099:55 PM, Cass Silva wrote:

Does this mean that the person was born in 1975 - which would now

make him 35 years old or that in 1975 his mission began?


____________ _________ _________ __

From: danielhcaldwell <danielhcaldwell@>

To: theos-talk@yahoogro

Sent: Tuesday, 12 May, 2009 3:25:00 AM

Subject: Theos-World Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of


Was Alice Bailey "the New Torch-Bearer of Truth"?

Alice Bailey claimed that "her teachings came from the same Occult

Brotherhood that taught HP Blavatsky . . . . Bailey's guide

professed to be the same Djual Khool that was one of HPB's

teachers. Bailey also declared that her guru was the same Master

Koot Hoomi that Blavatsky knew."

Many Bailey students have quoted the following passage from

H.P.B.'s pen in supporting the claim that Alice Bailey was the

expected new messenger of the Masters in the 20th century:

"In Century the Twentieth some disciple more informed, and far

better fitted, may be sent by the Masters of Wisdom to give final

and irrefutable proofs that there exists a Science called Gupta-

Vidya; and that . . . the source of all religions and

philosophies . . . has been for many ages forgotten and lost to

men, but is at last found." S.D., 1888, Vol I, p. xxxviii (original


But Students should compare this 1888 statement with the following

two passages from HPB's pen. The first extract was written in

December 1888 and the second one dates from the middle of 1889.

The first passage reads:

"Let every member [of the Esoteric Section] know . . . that the

time for such priceless acquisition is limited. The writer of the

present is old; her life is well-nigh worn out, and she may be

summoned 'home' any day and almost any hour. And if her place is

even filled up, perchance by another worthier and more learned than

herself, still there remain but twelve years to the last hour of

the term - namely, till December the 31st, 1899. Those who will not

have profited by the opportunity (given to the world in every last

quarter of a century), those who will not have reached a certain

point of psychic and spiritual development, or that point from

which begins the cycle of adeptship, by that day - those will

advance no further than the knowledge already acquired. No Master

of Wisdom from the East will appear or send any one to Europe or

America after that period, and the sluggards will have to renounce

every chance

of advancement in their present incarnation - until the year 1975.

Such is the LAW, for we are in Kali Yuga - the Black Age - and the

restrictions in this cycle, the first 5,000 years of which will

expire in 1897, are great and almost insuperable. " HPB's Collected

Writings, Vol XII, pp. 491-492. Italics added.

The second passage is as follows:

". . .during the last quarter of every hundred years an attempt is

made by those 'Masters' . . . to help on the spiritual progress of

Humanity in a marked and definite way. Towards the close of each

century you will invariably find that an outpouring or upheaval of

spirituality - or call it mysticism if you prefer - has taken

place. Some one or more persons have appeared in the world as their

agents, and a greater or less amount of occult knowledge and

teaching has been given out . . . . .If the present attempt, in the

form of our Society, succeeds better than its predecessors have

done, then it will be in existence as an organized, living and

healthy body when the time comes for the effort of the XXth

century. The general condition of men's minds and hearts will have

been improved and purified by the spread of its teachings . . . .

but besides a large

and accessible literature ready to men's hands, the next impulse

will find a numerous and united body of people ready to welcome the

new torch-bearer of Truth. He will find the minds of men prepared

for his message, a language ready for him in which to clothe the

new truths he brings, an organization awaiting his arrival . . . ."

The Key to Theosophy, pp. 306-7. Italics added.

The three passages taken together indicate that HPB was referring

to an emissary of the Masters coming in 1975 or later. These

statements by HPB would seem to rule out the messenger being Alice

Bailey or many other claimants. For a list of such claimants, see:

http://blavatskyarc latermessengers. htm#six


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------ --------- --------- ------

Yahoo! Groups Links

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------ --------- --------- ------

Yahoo! Groups Links

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------ --------- --------- ------

Yahoo! Groups Links

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Need a Holiday? Win a $10,000 Holiday of your choice. Enter now.http://us. com/_ylc= X3oDMTJxN2x2ZmNp BF9zAzIwMjM2MTY2 MTMEdG1fZG1lY2gD VGV4dCBMaW5rBHRt X2xuawNVMTEwMzk3 NwR0bV9uZXQDWWFo b28hBHRtX3BvcwN0 YWdsaW5lBHRtX3Bw dHkDYXVueg- -/ SIG=14600t3ni/ **http%3A/ / com/mail/ tagline/creative holidays/ *http%3A/ / homepageset/ %3Fp1=other% 26p2=au%26p3= mailtagline

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Yahoo! Groups Links

[Back to Top]

Theosophy World: Dedicated to the Theosophical Philosophy and its Practical Application