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Imperfect Democracies & our Movement

Mar 29, 2006 04:54 AM
by carlosaveline cardoso aveline



Dear Friends and Cass,

In the taoist philosophy, it is taught something about one who is in contact with the dynamic Unity, an Unity which includes the active diversity among the "10,000 things" of the Universe.

Such a person, says the teaching, looks at the principles beneath things, not at the things which imperfectly express the principles.

Democracies as things, right now, are very poor expressions of the PRINCIPLE EXISTING IN THEIR HEARTS: the principle of diversity in unity, and of unity in diversity.

But still, they are expressions of such a principle, and we can recognize the wise principle beneath its imperfect expressions.

Dictatorships, on the other hand, can hardly express that principle.

We have the same problem in the theosophical movement.

We have our own dictatorships, we have our own small and limited experiences of "democracy" at the principle level, which can also be called "brotherhood with diversity of thought".


To comdemn democracies because they are "too imperfect to us" is an easy way to renounce our own active co-responsibility for the societies where we live. It is harder, and wiser, to try to improve them.

To renounce the theosophical movement -- or to get cynical about it -- is also a very comfortable way not to recognize our co-responsibility with regard to it, and its future.

Then we blame Mr. Bush and Mrs. Radha, or the leader of Pasadena TS, or the president of our own country, or somebody else; we personalize things, seeing ourselves all the time as mere consummers, buyers, or perhaps -- TV viewers.

But there is no reason to keep to the role of passive consummers and expectators.

There are reasons to awake into active and creative action at all levels of life.


Regards, Carlos.





From: Cass Silva <silva_cass@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Relevancy of Imperfect Democracies
Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2006 22:56:09 -0800 (PST)

No system of government, be it democracy or republicanism appear to stand the test of time. Freedom of speech, for me, is a divine right, and I am fortunate that I live in a country that affords me that opportunity should I wish to voice my opinion. However, the current democracies in the world seem to be run with a dictatorial theme operating through them. For the people by the people should not require wealth for pre-election, as it's basis is in materialism.

Cass

carlosaveline cardoso aveline <carlosaveline@hotmail.com> wrote:
Dear Sufilight, Dear Cass,


I agree with Sufilight.
I prefer talking about the failures of Democracy in the country where I live
-- Brazil -- but I can tell you I do NOT idealize the USA democracy as it
is working rigth now, and I hope it improves soon.
( Now, saying it is the same as Hitler's Germany will not help -- at all.)

In any democracy there are lots of non-democratic issues. The difference is
that in a democracy you can talk about them. In this we find the sacred
value of a democracy, with all of its failures: that it gives you some
liberty of thought, even if in limited ways.

As to your "tough time here in Denmark these days" -- can you explain more
about that? I may have missed something.


Regards, Carlos.







>From: Cass Silva
>Reply-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: Theos-World The Relevancy of USA's Democracy
>Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2006 15:43:32 -0800 (PST)
>
>Know that it is a natural cause of events and that it will pass.
>
>Cass
>
>"M. Sufilight" wrote: Yeah...
>Allright.
>
>My views are:
>
>I do agree a whole lot with you Carlos.
>One thing though.
>You wrote:
>"So the USA and its democracy has more in it than meets the eye."
>
>Perhaps. But, there are also a lot of non-democratic issues, which
>actually not meets the eyes officially.
>Corruption and bribery mention a few. Just look at how many members of the
>Congress,
>who has steeped down in the latest years. You could try to compare that to
>most of the EU countries, and I think you will understand my view. This is
>what is officially known. Then we have the un-official part to consider. -
>It also seems, that The US Congress are being lobbied as no other parliment
>on the globe.
>
>---
>Just to mention it:
>I am really going through a tough time here in Denmark these days.
>So any help would be appreciated. I guess only those with real knowledge
>and
>wisdom
>will be able to help me from the distance.
>
>
>
>from
>M. Sufilight with peace and love...
>
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "carlosaveline cardoso aveline"
>To:
>Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 3:27 PM
>Subject: Theos-World The Relevancy of USA's Democracy
>
>
> >
> >
> > Dear Sufilight,
> >
> > Thanks a lot.
> >
> > There would be much to say.
> >
> > I agree with HPB's vision on Jesuitism. ( I do not see the relationship
> > between Jesuitism and the other issues discussed. )
> >
> > On democracies:
> >
> > Ocultism teaches that the shell of a man is illusion and made of
> > ignorance,
> > yet in some occasions his essence, his higher soul, will appear in a
> > stronger way. There is "antahkarana", the bridge. A man's life should
> > never
> > be despised just because his outer shell is largely made of ignorance.
> > He has the seed of wisdom inside.
> >
> > So with a country, or a people, or a nation.
> >
> > HPB wrote that the USA was the model for the creation of the
>theosophical
> > movement. The movement is the seed, or seedling, for future
> > civilizations.
> > Inspired in the USA, HPB calls the theosophical movement "a republic [i.
> > ed.
> > a democracy] of conscience".
> >
> > So the USA and its democracy has more in it than meets the eye.
> >
> > The outer shell of democracy is as rotten as you say or more. We agree
>on
> > that. At the same time it should not be despised and it cannot be seen
>as
> > the same as Hitler's Germany.
> >
> > If you knew what were the military dictatorships in Brazil, Chile and
> > Argentina, or if you have lived personally as a Jew or as a Theosophist
> > in
> > Hitler's Germany, you would see and feel in your "blood", so to say,
>the
> > oceanic difference between a country where you can say what you want
>about
> > the president, or a country where you will die if you say what you
>think.
> >
> > USA, Canada and Europe natives often can't see the positive sides of
>their
> > democracies, especially as seeds for the future.
> >
> > Countries and democracies are not "entirely bad" or "entirely good".
> >
> > As Adyar is not entirely bad, and Pasadena or the ULT are not entirely
> > good
> > -- and the other way around, too.
> >
> > Each of them, as each country, as each person, can be stimulated to
> > discover its/his/her higher purpose and potentialities.
> >
> > It is OK to be a stern, radical critic. HPB and the Masters were. Yet
>the
> > aim of criticizing is but to destroy the ignorance and to stimulate the
> > inner awakening of life and consciousness in the person, country,
> > national,
> > group, "republic".
> >
> > It would be too easy for us to say that "Adyar TS is not authentic --
>the
> > hell with it" . "It is irrelevant".
> >
> > Or to say: "USA's democracy is not authentic -- the hell with it".
> >
> > To think, to discern, gives much more trouble than that.
> >
> > Yet this is our common task: to discern and to inspire the awakening of
> > authenticity in that which appears not to be authentic; and to show the
> > mechanisms of collective illusion so that people, nations and
>theosophical
> > groups get less and less deluded.
> >
> > I hope this clarifies my views.
> >
> >
> > Carlos.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>From: "M. Sufilight"
> >>Reply-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> >>To:
> >>Subject: Re: Theos-World Long Life to Sufis and Jews!
> >>Date: Sun, 26 Mar 2006 19:49:05 +0200
> >>
> >>Hallo all,
> >>
> >>My views are:
> >>
> >>1) Ok. We agree. I think you misunderstood my words.
> >>
> >>2)
> >>Yes.
> >>Here we have Blavatsky's article THEOSOPHY OR JESUITISM?, written june
> >>1888.
> >>
> >>"Therefore, the present opportunity is taken to state, once for all, the
> >>views which Theosophists and Occultists entertain with regard to the
> >>Society
> >>of Jesus. At the same time, all those who are pursuing in life's great
> >>wilderness of vain evanescent pleasures and empty conventionalities an
> >>ideal
> >>worth living for, are offered the choice between the two now once more
> >>rising powers--the Alpha and the Omega at the two opposite ends of the
> >>realm
> >>of giddy, idle existence--THEOSOPHY and JESUITISM.
> >>For, in the field of religious and intellectual pursuits, these two are
> >>the
> >>only luminaries--a good and an evil star, truly--glimmering once more
>from
> >>behind the mists of the Past, and ascending on the horizon of mental
> >>activities. They are the only two powers capable in the present day of
> >>extricating one thirsty for intellectual life from the clammy slush of
>the
> >>stagnant pool known as Modern Society, so crystallized in its cant, so
> >>dreary and monotonous in its squirrel-like motion around the wheel of
> >>fashion. Theosophy and Jesuitism are the two opposite poles, one far
> >>above,
> >>the other far below even that stagnant marsh. Both offer power--one to
>the
> >>spiritual, the other to the psychic and intellectual Ego in man. The
> >>former
> >>is "the wisdom that is from above . . . pure, peaceable, gentle . . .
>full
> >>of mercy and good fruits, without partiality and without hypocrisy,"
>while
> >>the latter is "the wisdom that descendeth not from above, but is
>earthly,
> >>sensual, DEVILISH."3 One is the power of Light, the other that of
> >>Darkness.
> >>. . ."
> >>
> >>
> >>This is true also today. There is a difference though. From the The
> >>Society
> >>of Jesus has been created groups with other names than their own, so the
> >>more easily can hide their activities to anyone thye want to hide them
> >>from. - I know the late Pope Paul John II threw a few good words. But,
>now
> >>his very near friend from the "Inquisition" is ruling as a Pope.
> >>It seems quite obvious, that the "Jesuits" have branches outside the
> >>Catholic groups, and that they are heavily involved with politics and
> >>militant activity, even if they say differently.
> >>(The word "Jesuit" is also defined as "devious" or "devious religious
> >>Christisn" and perhaps even an occult Christian one. Some of the Jesuits
> >>has
> >>been dabbling with the occult, we all know that today, because some of
> >>their
> >>scriptures are today officially available.)
> >>
> >>Did this help?
> >>
> >>
> >>3) Democracy you say...aehmmm...
> >>Well, what kind of democracy?
> >>Some democracies are not really democracies as far as I know.
> >>Take for instance the USA. It is a - media and propaganda democracy -
> >>involving heavily emotional personalisations of politicians. Money rules
> >>such a kind of democracy. It is not a healthy democracy as far as I am
> >>concerned. Buthan is for instance doing much better.
> >>They run politics just like a commercial - using lies. If they get
>caught
> >>they won't admit it - or answer to justice. The "jesuits" are very
> >>powerful
> >>in this country today. And they have some very cunning laywers - I tell
> >>you.
> >>And they swear with the Bible a whole lot.
> >>
> >>I would rather say, that one aught to divide countries into two kinds.
> >>One kind is the materialistic kind. The other is ther spiritual kind.
> >>The materialistic country are not on the path of wisdom towards
>liberation
> >>or pure Atma-Vidya.
> >>The spiritual country are. India is one such country. USA is not. Wisdom
> >>is
> >>not promoted by the leaders in USA.
> >>This, I think is a more important difference.
> >>But to run a country as a democracy is often a better system to choose.
>I
> >>think we can agree upon that.
> >>
> >>
> >>- - -
> >>To help the readers:
> >>Not all groups calling themselves sufis are compassionate. But, Carlos
> >>obviously talk about the compassionate kind.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>from
> >>M. Sufilight with peace and love...
> >>
> >>----- Original Message -----
> >>From: "carlosaveline cardoso aveline"
> >>To:
> >>Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 6:48 PM
> >>Subject: Theos-World Long Life to Sufis and Jews!
> >>
> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Sufilight,
> >> >
> >> > 1) I haven't said that Gas Chamber's lessons to humanity are more,
>or
> >> > less,
> >> > important.
> >> > I mentioned that the time of gas chambers has hopefully gone, and now
> >>our
> >> > challenges include Peace in Palestine/Israel (and in other places as
> >> > well).
> >> >
> >> > 2) I just couldn't see what is your point with regard to the Jesuits.
> >>Can
> >> > you explain?
> >> >
> >> > 3) I am for democracy, for non-violent action, and have no
>admiration
> >> > whatsoever for Nazis, neo-Nazis or for Suicide-killers.
> >> >
> >> > I admire Sufi teachings and Jewish mystics alike.
> >> >
> >> > Best regards, Carlos.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >>From: "M. Sufilight"
> >> >>Reply-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> >> >>To:
> >> >>Subject: Re: Theos-World Ecology of Mind
> >> >>Date: Sun, 26 Mar 2006 18:41:47 +0200
> >> >>
> >> >>Yeah...Interesting.
> >> >>
> >> >>My views are:
> >> >>
> >> >>Carlos, Are you also saying that the "jesuits" are involved in this
>on
> >> >>a
> >> >>political level and other levels
> >> >>in society?
> >> >>
> >> >>Try for instance this one or Blavatsky's definition(s):
> >> >>
> >> >>Controversies
> >> >>The Jesuits have frequently been described by Catholic and Protestant
> >> >>enemies as engaged in various conspiracies. They have also been
>accused
> >>of
> >> >>using casuistry to obtain justifications for the unjustifiable. In
> >>several
> >> >>languages, "Jesuit" or "Jesuitical" therefore acquired a secondary
> >>meaning
> >> >>of "devious."
> >> >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesuit
> >> >>
> >> >>- - - - - - -
> >> >>As for "gaschambers". Is it really that important?
> >> >> It was the Nazi's who started the whole bloddy war with their idea
>of
> >> >>"Lebensraum" anyway.
> >> >>They did not succeed in burning down Freud's and Jung's teachings. I
> >>will
> >> >>call that a victory.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>from
> >> >>M. Sufilight with peace and love...
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>----- Original Message -----
> >> >>From: "carlosaveline cardoso aveline"
> >> >>To:
> >> >>Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 6:07 PM
> >> >>Subject: Theos-World Ecology of Mind
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
> >> >> >
> >> >> > PRESERVING THE ECOLOGY OF MIND
> >> >> >
> >> >> > oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Dear Friends,
> >> >> >
> >> >> > "World Goodwill Newsletter" (1) discusses the problem of
> >> >>"information
> >> >> > overload" in our minds - due to the amound of information now
> >>arriving
> >> >>to
> >> >> > us
> >> >> > through TV, print, internet, mobile phones, etc.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > The Newsletter says it is not easy to "keep one's head above this
> >> >> > tidal
> >> >> > wave". And it quotes the group 'Adbusters':
> >> >> >
> >> >> > "Our minds have become a virtual dumping ground of pollutants -
> >> >> > manipulative ads, distorted news, untold violence (...) and there
> >> >> > is
> >>a
> >> >> > need
> >> >> > to reclaim our mental environment."
> >> >> >
> >> >> > More:
> >> >> >
> >> >> > "Add to this picture even subtler channels of information
>reception,
> >> >> > the
> >> >> > nascent telepathic sensitivities that mean you may unwittingly
>pick
> >>up
> >> >>on
> >> >> > patterns of emotion and thought from those around you."
> >> >> >
> >> >> > True, this mass of information will be processed during sleep. But
> >> >> > there
> >> >> > are
> >> >> > those who don't sleep enough, or can't sleep well.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Important thoughts, indeed. Yet I would question the idea that we
> >>are
> >> >> > exposed to too much information.
> >> >> > In fact, what surrounds us is mostly pseudo-information, and
> >>sometimes
> >> >> > dis-information.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Perhaps we cannot call "information" all those mental noises that
> >> >> > surround
> >> >> > us. Any clear view of things will establish that "information"
>is
> >> >> > that
> >> >> > bit
> >> >> > of knowledge which helps you to take better decisions in life and
>to
> >> >> > achieve
> >> >> > your goals.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Even as we talk about Theosophy, the exercise of attention and
> >> >>discernment
> >> >> > should tell us whether the thoughts arriving to us - or the
> >>thoughts
> >> >> > formulated by us - actually serve the purposes of expanding our
> >> >> > consciousness, facing significant facts, preserving the
>foundations
> >>of
> >> >>our
> >> >> > inner peace, establishing sane mutual help relationships with
>people
> >>--
> >> >>or
> >> >> > produce more noice than meaning.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > In order to be able to understand information and dis-information
> >> >> > processes, it is important to recognize and accept the
>significance
> >>of
> >> >> > silence.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Mental silence shows us the meaning of life without the need of
> >>words.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > It helps us see both the facts and the illusion in what we read or
> >> >> > hear,
> >> >> > but
> >> >> > also in what we ourselves say or think. Because sometimes
> >>unconscious
> >> >> > mental games can be played at us by some instintive layers of our
> >>own
> >> >> > mind.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Paying attention to the mental tides is a form of self-knowledge.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > As we gradually get rid of waves of illusion, we get to be able to
> >> >> > learn
> >> >> > more and better about esoteric philosophy or Theosophy.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Such a learning liberates us -- but it needs inner peace and a
> >> >> > degree
> >> >> > of
> >> >> > mental silence. It needs a healthy ecology of mind.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > That's why the practice of mental silence, MOUNA, is taught in
> >>eastern
> >> >> > philosophies.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Best regards, Carlos.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > NOTE:
> >> >> > (1) Number 01, 2006. Website: www.worldgoodwill.org. World
>Goodwill
> >>is
> >> >> > inspired by Alice Bailey's philosophy and gives a positive
> >> >> > contribution
> >> >> > to
> >> >> > human process now. It cooperates with the United Nations system,
> >> >>strongly
> >> >> > stimulating universal brotherhood. The Newsletter is edited by
> >> >> > the
> >> >> > Lucis
> >> >> > Trust, New York.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > _________________________________________________________________
> >> >> > Liga��es gratuitas de PC-para-PC para qualquer lugar do Brasil
>e do
> >> >>mundo
> >> >> > com o MSN Messenger. Saiba mais em
> >> >> > http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/default2.aspx?locale=pt-br
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>Yahoo! Groups Links
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > _________________________________________________________________
> >> > Ganhe tempo encontrando o arquivo ou e-mail que voc� precisa com
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> >> >
> >> >
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> >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
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> >> >
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> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>Yahoo! Groups Links
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> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Seja um dos primeiros a testar o novo Windows Live Mail Beta. Acesse
> >
>http://www.ideas.live.com/programpage.aspx?versionId=5d21c51a-b161-4314-9b0e-4911fb2b2e6d
> >
> >
> >
> >
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