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Re: Theos-World TS natal chart and its implications

Feb 28, 2006 04:18 PM
by Jerry Hejka-Ekins

Dear Fairmaiden, Friends,

I finally got around to setting up that 1905 chart for the TS incorporation. I've never seen it before. I think you are quite right that the incorporation chart is very important. In a sense, Olcott and Besant, at that time re-established the TS on a legal bases--that is, created a new entity. In effect, they created a new TS--giving it a new birth date. The new chart does not negate the others, but represents a new direction for the TS.

Since the time is unknown, I setup a noon chart for the day in question. Therefore, I can only make some general comments.

The first thing I noticed is that the TS was incorporated about a day before the new moon. That is, the moon is waning and has almost completed that cycle. In traditional astrology, waning moons are not good times to start new things. The moon, however is not void of course, as it will form a semi-sextile to Saturn and a trine to Mars over the next ten or so hours before entering the next sign. So, even though the moon's position is unfavorable, failure of the effort is not indicated.

The next thing I noticed is the planets are arrayed in a 240 degree pattern. Marc Edmund Jones calls this pattern a "locomotive." Mars serves as the "engine" and Neptune is the "caboose", while the Moon falls closest to the center of the pattern. This would suggest a productive organization under a central control (Moon). However, the pattern can also be read as a "bowl" with Uranus and Neptune forming the rim, and Mars as a singleton planet, and the sun very near the center of the pattern, representing the central control. In either reading, Mars is of key importance. My inclination is to favor the bowl pattern over the locomotive, though, the chart has both characteristics. The reason why I favor the bowl pattern is because the rim opposition is close and the sun is in orb of aspect to both planets. The lead and trailing planets in the locomotive are also close, but the moon is not as strongly aspected in that pattern.

As a bowl pattern, I would characterize this new Theosophical Society as self-contained and self oriented. The Uranus cutting planet suggests its path of action as unconventional, but not necessarily in a progressive or constructive sense. Sun in Aries, representing the central control would characterize that leadership as acting from a predetermined agenda which is not responsive to the changing environment.

The all important singleton planet, Mars, represents the TS's outreach into the world outside of itself. Unfortunately, Mars in forming a square aspect to Saturn, creates considerable discordant actions and reactionary responses, such as an "us versus them" attitude--"those who 'know' and those who don't." On the positive side, Mars and Saturn are in their own ruling signs, which helps to mitigate the worst of this very difficult aspect. Still, it is hardly the desirable aspect for an organization which aims to lead the public into any kind of harmonious fellowship of humanity.

I'm looking forward to reading your observations.

Best Wishes,
Jerry

fairemaidenofchatshire wrote:

Dear Jerry,

Thank you for responding to my two-cents worth, *s*

I also appreciate your giving the 1905 India date as the date of actual 'incorporation' of the Society... Now THAT would be the chart to erect if someone wanted to check out just how The Theosophical Society would be received, and fare, in the world's eyes... the 'exoteric' chart par excellance, *s*

Do you have an actual 'day/time/place' for such incorporation in India???

Thanks, FaireMaiden

*******************************************************

--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Jerry Hejka-Ekins <jjhe@...> wrote:

Dear Fairemaiden,

As with all things astrological, timing is imperative... In this particular case, September 13, 1875, 46 Irving Place, New York

City,

would be the appropriate date & place of formation of said

Society,

as that is the date the group was FORMALLY NAMED... {"It was resolved that the name of the society be "THE THEOSOPHICAL

SOCIETY"}.

Astrology, as with any of the other occult arts operates upon

rules of

analogy and correspondence. As when a child becomes an individual--

when

it is separated from its mother, so does an entity come into being

when

it is objectified by consensus of those present who "parented" the

idea.

Yes, there are many events concerned with bringing an entity into

the

objective world, and a horoscope of each event may reflect

something

about it. I recall my wife and I naming our child several months

before

she was born. A horoscope for that moment would only have

reflected the

circumstances for that moment--an expectation of an as yet unborn

child.

In other words, any of these dates can tell an astrologer

something

about the entity in question. However, whatever we bring into this

world

through an act of will, followed by action, begins with an idea.

The other dates of Sept 7th & 8th show the 'IDEA' of a group of people 'taking form' to 'make a Society' but, until such is

NAMED,

it remains in the realm of an IDEA... Unless, of course, I am reading the above quotation incorrectly...

I think you are reading it correctly. HPB cited the sept date as

the

"esoteric" birth of the TS. That indeed would occur in the world

of ideas.

I must admit to being somewheat confused by the 'November 17,

1875'

date as the Society being made PUBLIC... ["Mott Memorial Hall, 64 Madison Ave., New York City"]... What was it, specifically, that made the Theosophical Society on that date a 'public' one??? Were they incorporated, or somehow registered by a County Recorder, in some way, thru the court???

It was the occasion of the Inaugural address--when the

organization and

its aims were publicly announced and outlined.

Were they incorporated, or somehow registered by a County Recorder, in some way, thru the court???

Yes, the TS was incorporated in India in 1905--thirty years after

its

founding. That would be yet another interesting chart.

Best wishes,
Jerry

fairemaidenofchatshire wrote:

To Whom It May Concern:

"SEPT 13TH 1875

3. Pursuant to adjournment, a meeting was held Sept. 13, 1875.

H.S.Olcott acted as Chairman and C. Southern as Secretary. The Committee on "Preamble and By-laws" reported progress. It was resolved that the name of the society be "THE THEOSOPHICAL

SOCIETY".

The Chair appointed a committee to select meeting rooms. "Several new members were nominated and uponmotion those persons were

added

to the list of Founders." The meeting adjourned subject to the

call

of the Chair."

As with all things astrological, timing is imperative... In this particular case, September 13, 1875, 46 Irving Place, New York

City,

would be the appropriate date & place of formation of said

Society,

as that is the date the group was FORMALLY NAMED... {"It was resolved that the name of the society be "THE THEOSOPHICAL

SOCIETY"}.

The other dates of Sept 7th & 8th show the 'IDEA' of a group of people 'taking form' to 'make a Society' but, until such is

NAMED,

it remains in the realm of an IDEA... Unless, of course, I am reading the above quotation incorrectly...

I must admit to being somewheat confused by the 'November 17,

1875'

date as the Society being made PUBLIC... ["Mott Memorial Hall, 64 Madison Ave., New York City"]... What was it, specifically, that made the Theosophical Society on that date a 'public' one??? Were they incorporated, or somehow registered by a County Recorder, in some way, thru the court???

In any case, one could erect a chart to see specifically just how the Society would fare in the 'world's eyes' IF, indeed, they

were

made 'formally' public somehow on November 17th... One would view such a chart as an 'exoteric' expression, so-to-speak... The September 13th date would be, then, the 'esoteric' expression of

the

Society... As such, each chart could be looked upon within a framework of 'inner' and 'outer' energetic dynamics.

As to the September 13th 'time'... It has been stated as 8 p.m... However, I would place the time at closer to 8:15-8:30 as most meetings START at 8 p.m., with the actual 'business' of the

meeting

taking some minutes to get underway and relevant issues brought

to

the floor, discussed, and subsequently codified... or not, as the case may be...

As for the November 17th 'time', I see nothing noted below that would be considered revelatory... If a piece of paper with a NAME

is

being County Recorded, {for any reason, i.e. Articles of Incorporation or a Name Change, for example}, the time would then

be

the date/time you took it to the Recorder's office and handed it over, or the date/time when you dropped it in the postbox or

handed

it to a mail carrier... In other words, the moment it left your hands, {NOT the date/time the Judge signed it, nor the date/time

the

Recorder actually recorded it}...

Because of this, I fear that not knowing just 'how' the Society went 'public', {as spoken of below}, it is then impossible to

give

a 'best guess' time, let alone a time with any assurance a'tall…

If, however, by 'public' one is referring to just giving a

speech,

the date is irrelevant as far as astrology for the Socitey is concerned... It might be interesting to look at from the aspect

of

how Olcott would have been received, etc., but it wouldn't matter

at

all for the Society itself…

FaireMaiden

***************************************************

--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Anton Rozman" <anton_rozman@> wrote:

Maybe this passage from The Inner Group Teachings of H. P. Blavatsky - Meeting: November 12, 1890 - is interesting too:

H.P.B. said that the Inner Group was the Manas of the T.S. The

E.S.

was the Lower Manas; the T.S. the Quarternary.

--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Anton Rozman"

<anton_rozman@>

wrote:

Maybe this extracts from J. Ransom's Short History of the T. S.

will

complete Dallas' information.

Warmest regards,
Anton

AT the time of the formation of The Theosophical Society, H. P.

B.

was living at 46, Irving Place, New York. Here she was eagerly sought out by those interested in the occult and attracted by

her

remarkable personality, in the courageous challenge she flung

at

scientific materialism, and in the stand she made for

the "science

of ancient and proved Magic." (H.P.B. used the word Magic as a substitute for both Occultism and Theosophy, neither of which

meant

anything to the public at that time.) On 7 Sept., 1875, Mr.

George

H. Felt, an engineer and architect, gave a highly instructive lecture on "The Lost Canon of Proportion of the Egyptians," to

about

seventeen people gathered in H.P.B.'s rooms. …

An animated discussion followed, during which the idea occurred

to

Col. Olcott "that it would be a good thing to form a Society to pursue and promote such occult research." He passed a note to

H.P.,

who agreed. (Mrs. Besant remarks in Lucifer, April 1895, p. 105: "She [H.P.B.] has told me herself how her Master bade her

found

it, and how at His bidding she wrote the suggestion of starting

it

on a slip of paper and gave it to W. Q. Judge to pass to Col. Olcott, and then the Society had its first beginning …") He

then

spoke of the philosophic character of ancient Theosophies and

their

sufficiency to reconcile all existing antagonism, and of Mr.

Felt's

achievement in extracting the Key to the architecture of Nature

from

the scanty fragments of ancient lore. He proposed to form a

society

for the investigation of science and religion; the society to

be

entirely eclectic, the friend of true religion and the enemy of scientific materialism. It would be a nucleus around which

might

gather those willing to work together to organise a society of occultists, begin to collect a library, and to diffuse

information

concerning those secret laws of nature which were so familiar

to

the

Chaldeans and Egyptians, but were unknown to the modern world

of

science. Mr. Felt was to teach the right kind of person how to

evoke

and control the elementals. It was unanimously agreed that a

society

be formed for the study and elucidation of Occultism, the

Kabala,

etc. It should be free from the least sectarian character and

be

unquestionably anti-materialistic. Mr. W. Q. Judge proposed

Col.

Olcott as chairman, and the Colonel proposed Mr. Judge as

Secretary.

On 8 Sept., at the adjourned meeting, Col. Olcott was elected

as

Chairman and Mr. Judge as Secretary. From among those present

the

following sixteen handed in their names as willing to form and belong to such a Society: Mde. H. P. Blavatsky, Col. H. S.

Olcott,

Charles Sotheran, Dr. Charles E. Simmons, H. D. Monachesi, C.

C.

Massey (Loud.), W. L. Alden, G. H. Felt, D. E. de Lara, Dr. W. Britten, Henry J. Newton, John Storer Cobb, J. Hyslop, W. Q.

Judge,

Mrs. E. H. Britten H. M. Stevens. …

Newton, Stevens and Sotheran, with the Chairman, were appointed

to

draft a Constitution and Bye-laws, and to report on them on 13

Sept.

At this meeting Felt further described his discoveries. Then business was taken up, with Col. Olcott in the Chair and

Sotheran

as

Secretary. The Committee on Preamble and Bye-laws made its

report.

It was resolved that the name of the proposed Society be THE THEOSOPHICAL SOCIETY. It was agreed that this title "both

expressed

the esoteric truth they wished to reach and covered the ground

of

Felt's methods of occult research." The Rev. Mr. Wiggin and Mr. Sotheran were appointed to select suitable meeting rooms,

several

new members were nominated and their names added as founders. …

The first meeting under the name "The Theosophical Society" was called by Henry S. Olcott, President pro tem., for 16 Oct. in

the

spacious drawing-rooms of Mrs. Emma Hardinge Britten, the

widely

known Spiritualist. It was announced that the Bye-laws were

ready,

and that Mr. Felt, if in town, would continue his Egyptological lectures, also that the officers would be elected. Col. Olcott

was

in the Chair and J. S. Cobb acted as Secretary. After

discussion

and

various alterations, the Bye-laws were adopted.

After this meeting H. P. B. left for Ithaca to stay with her

friends

Prof. and Mrs. Corson. …

During H. P. B.'s absence at Ithaca, Col. Olcott was delivering lectures in New York, launching out against Spiritualism and upholding the new Theosophical doctrine. H. P. B. returned to

New

York in time for the next meeting of The Theosophical Society,

which

was held at the same place on 30 Oct. At this meeting the Mott Memorial Hall, 64, Madison Avenue, was selected as The

Society's

meeting place. It was near to the recently purchased New York Headquarters in 47th Street, into which H. P. B. and the

Colonel

presently moved, and remained there until they left for India.

The

Bye-laws were finally adopted, and the Preamble was to be

further

revised by H. S. Olcott, C. Sotheran and J. S. Cobb. In this finished Preamble it is said:
"The Title of the Theosophical Society explains the objects and desires of its founders: they `seek to obtain knowledge of the nature and attributes of the Supreme Power, and of the higher spirits by the aid of physical processes.' In other words, they hope, that by going deeper than modern science has hitherto

done,

into the esoteric philosophies of ancient times, they may be

enabled

to obtain, for themselves and other investigators, proof of the existence of an `Unseen Universe,' the nature of its

inhabitants

if

such there be, and the laws which govern them and their

relations

with mankind. Whatever may be the private opinions of its

members,

the society has no dogmas to enforce, no creed to disseminate.

It

is

formed neither as a Spiritualistic schism, nor to serve as the

foe

or friend of any sectarian or philosophic body. Its only axiom

is

the omnipotence of truth, its only creed a profession of

unqualified

devotion to its discovery and propaganda. In considering the qualifications of applicants for membership, it knows neither

race,

sex, colour, country nor creed …"
The Preamble ended with these words:
"The Theosophical Society, disclaiming all pretension to the possession of unusual advantages, all selfish motives, all disposition to foster deception of any sort, all intention to wilfully and causelessly injure any established organization, invites fraternal co-operation of such as can realize the

importance

of its field of labour; and are in sympathy with the objects

for

which it has been organized."
The "Objects" of The Society were very simply stated as

being "to

collect and diffuse a knowledge of the laws which govern the universe."
To these ideals of freedom of thought and opinion The Society

clung

tenaciously, as will be seen. Col. Olcott was ever mindful of

this

promise to the world, guarded it jealously and made it his

guiding

principle in his organisation of The Society, and each

President

has

in turn guarded it with equal care from all tendencies to

limitation

or dogmatism. Also, the principle of Brotherhood, implicitly expressed at the end of the first paragraph, soon became the strongest and most vitalising power and remains the dominating Object of The Society's work.
The election for Office resulted as follows:
President, HENRY S. OLCOTT; Vice-Presidents, Dr. S. PANCOAST

and

G.

H. FELT; Corresponding Secretary, MME. H. P. BLAVATSKY;

Recording

Secretary, JOHN STORER COBB; Treasurer, HENRY J. NEWTON,

Librarian,

CHARLES SOTHERAN; Councillors, REV. J. H. WIGGIN, (Judge) R. B. WESTBROOK, L.L.D., Mrs. EMMA HARDINGE BRITTEN, C. E. SIMMONS,

M.

D.,

and HERBERT D. MONACHESI; Counsel to the Society, WILLIAM Q.

JUDGE.

On 17 November The Society met at Mott Memorial Hall, and the President delivered his Inaugural Address. This completed the organisation of The Society and Col. Olcott chose this date as

its

birthday.
The Preamble, Rules, (under date of 30 Oct. 1875) and Inaugural Address were published. In this Address the Colonel said prophetically: "in the coming time it is inevitable that the

birth

of this society of ours must be considered a factor in the

problem

which the historian will be required to solve." Since the days

when

the Neo-Platonists and theurgists of Alexandria were scattered

by

Christianity this was the first revival of a study of

Theosophy.

He

then promised that through his discoveries Mr. Felt would, by

simple

chemical appliances, exhibit "the races of beings which,

invisible

to our eyes, people the elements," and the name of The

Theosophical

Society would hold its place in history as the first to exhibit these "Elementary Spirits" - and thus astound the churches, the unimaginative academies of science, the materialists and

the "shade"

ridden spiritualists. Written in the SCRAPBOOK is one of

H.P.B.'s

shrewd comments to the effect that these were rash statements -

it

was "counting the price of the bear's skin before the beast is slain." The Colonel admitted afterwards that though there was

much

in his Address that came true, "yet it reads a bit foolish

after
seventeen years of hard experience."

--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "W.Dallas TenBroeck" <dalval14@> wrote:

T S STARTED .DOC
=================

CHRONOLOGY 1875 -78

NOTES ON THE ORIGINAL MINUTES OF THE

THEOSOPHICAL
SOCIETY.

SOURCES:
PATH, Vol. 10, p. 55, May 1894.
THEOSOPHICAL FORUM, Vol. 1, p. 95-6--

(Olcott on)

OLD DIARY LEAVES, Vol. 1,p.114-18,121-

2,126-133;137,

OLD DIARY LEAVES, Vol. 7, p.

326.

[ Start with Mr. Judge's THE T S AND ITS BASIS, J

Art
II 156 ]
From AUSTRAL THEOSOPHIST, June 1894 ]
"As one of those who helped to form the T S, I may
claim

to speak

with personal knowledge of the facts, ...

SEPT 7th 1875

"1. At a meeting held in the rooms of H.P.Blavatsky, 46
Irving

Place, New

York City, Sept. 7, 1875, it was agreed to form a Society for

the

purpose of

Occult Study. Upon motion of William Q. Judge, Henry S.

Olcott

was elected

Chairman of this meeting, and upon motion of H.S.Olcott,

William

Q. Judge

was elected Secretary of the same. Adjourned to September 8,

1875...this is

ascertained as the facts by those who were present.

(CWB, Vol.

1, 122)

NOTE:

Col. Olcott, in OLD DIARY LEAVES, Vol. 1, p.

118,

remarks on

this event from memory as follows: (he) "wrote on a scrap of

paper: "Would

it not be a good thing to form a Society for this kind of

study ?"-

-and gave

it to Judge. H.P.B. read the note and nodded assent." [He also makes mention of this on p.114 of his book. OLD DIARY

LEAVES

(Olcott) Vol. I
(CWB, Vol. 1, p. 473, 122-123)

Since Col. Olcott wrote OLD DIARY LEAVES,

largely
from memory,
some discrepancies have been observed by historians, these
will

be

found

chronicled in CWB Vol. I, pp. 72-3, 94, 121, 123-4.
H.P.B. later narrated this event to Mrs. A. Besant, who

then

reported

it in the opposite sequence: she [HPB] having originated the

idea, and

then, having a note suggesting the formation of a society

passed

through

Judge to Olcott.
(see LUCIFER, Vol. 12, p. 105, April 1893).
There is no question but Mr. Judge was one of the three

founders

of the

Theosophical Society who remained with it.

SEPT 8th 1875

2. Pursuant to adjournment, a meeting was held at the same

place

Sept. 8,

1875. It is with this meeting that the minute book begins.

Upon

motion of

William Q. Judge it was voted that H.S.Olcott take the Chair,

and

upon

motion it was voted that William Q. Judge act as Secretary.

Upon

request of

the Chair, sixteen persons handed their names to the

Secretary,

as agreeing

to found and belong to such a society. A committee of four,

including the

Chairman, was appointed "to draft a constitution and by-laws

and

to report

the same at the next meeting." Adjourned to Monday, Sept. 13,

1875, at the

same place. (PATH Vol. 9, p. 1 - facsimile; CWB, Vol. 1, p. 123-5)

SEPT 13TH 1875

3. Pursuant to adjournment, a meeting was held

Sept.

13, 1875.

H.S.Olcott acted as Chairman and C. Southern as Secretary.

The

Committee on

"Preamble and By-laws" reported progress. It was resolved

that

the name of

the society be "THE THEOSOPHICAL SOCIETY". The Chair

appointed

a

committee

to select meeting rooms. "Several new members were nominated

and

upon

motion those persons were added to the list of Founders." The

meeting

adjourned subject to the call of the Chair.

OCTOBER 16 1875

4. Pursuant to a Notice dated at New York, Oct. 13,

1875, signed

Henry S. Olcott, President pro tem., a meeting was held at 206

W

38th

St., Oct. 16, l875, "to organize and elect officers."

Eighteen

persons

were present. The report of the Committee on "Preamble and By-

laws" was

laid on the table and ordered printed. The meeting was

adjourned

to

October 30th l875, at the same place. H.S.Olcott was

Chairman,

and J. S.

Cobb, Secretary,

OCTOBER 30 1875

5. October 30, 1875, the Society met pursuant to

adjournment.

Mott Memorial Hall, 64 Madison Ave., New York City was

selected

as

the

Society's meeting place. By-laws were adopted, but with the

proviso that

the "Preamble" should be revised by a committee and then

published

as the

"Preamble of the Society." Officers were elected as

follows:

President,

Henry S. Olcott; Vice-Presidents, Dr. S. Pancoast and

G .H .Felt;

Corresponding Secretary, Mme. H.P.Blavatsky; Recording

Secretary, John

Storer Cobb; Treasurer, Henry J. Newton; Librarian, Charles

Southeran;

Councilors, Rev. J .H. Wiggin, R. B. Westbrook, LL.D., Mrs.

Emma Hardinge

Britten; C E. Simmons, M.D. and Herbert D. Montachesi;

Counsel

to the

Society, William Q. Judge. Adjourned to November 17,

1875. ....

PATH, VOL. 10, P. 55-60;
CWB, Vol. I, p. 122 - 125; 150; 193; 245-6;

375-

8; 379-84;

NOTE

Mme. Blavatsky was by this time (1875) engaged

in

the writing

of ISIS UNVEILED. Mr. Judge's brother, John, was of help in

preparing the

manuscript for the printers. Mr. Judge's participation is not

specified in

existent records I have read. DTB.
HPB invited Mr. Judge to help her in 1884 at

Enghien, (WQJ

ART. ULT I 468) : "...while I at her request carefully read

over,

sitting

in the same room, Isis Unveiled, making indices at the foot of

the

page, as

she intended to use it in preparing the Secret Doctrine."

In THE COLLECTED WORKS OF H.P.BLAVATSKY,

VOL. I p.

406 we

are told by the editor that the diaries of HPB for the years

1875-

77

"mysteriously disappeared" in Adyar.
The diary for 1878 find Mr. Judge mentioned several times as a

visitor to

HPB in the latter part of the year: [ August 5th and 6th (p.

409); Oct 18

(p.413); Oct. 30 (p.416); Nov. 12 (p.420); Dec. 3-4

(p.425);

Dec. 5

(p.426); Dec. 7 (p.427); Dec. 11 (p.429); Dec. 13-15.
COLL. WKS. B, Vol I, p. 430.]

On December 17th. 1878 Mme. Blavatsky and Col. Olcott

boarded a

steamer to sail via. England, for India; Mr. Judge remained

in

New York.

On Dec. 19th. 1879 (p.433, C W B) Mr. Judge visited them on

board

the steamer prior to its actual departure, while it was still

anchored

inside the bar of the harbor waiting for the tide.

DECEMBER 17 1878 to FEBRUARY 16 1879

9. In the year 1878 H.P.Blavatsky and H.S.Olcott

were

appointed

under a formal Resolution of the Theosophical Society dated----

--

-

a

"Committee of the Theosophical Society" to visit foreign

countries

and

report." The Theosophist for Oct. 1879, Vol. 1, #1, p. 1, 1st

item, says:

"For the convenience of future reference, it may as well be

stated

here that

the Committee, sent to India by the Theosophical Society,

sailed
from New
York Dec. 17th l878, and landed in Bombay, Feb. 16, 1879,
having

passed two

weeks in London on the way." (The THEOSOPHIST, Jan.

1880, Vol. 1, p.95).

=================================================================

T S STARTED

From: Jerry Hejka-Ekins
Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 3:53 PM
To
Subject: Re: TS natal chart and its implications

Dear all,

I recall HPB writing that the September chart is the real

birth

chart.

The November inaugural address chart would be the chart for

when

the TS

became a public organization.
Best

Jerry

==============================================

adelasie wrote:

Dear Vladimir,

The chart drawn for 8 pm, September 8, 1875, is certainly more encouraging than the one for the same time, November 17 of the

same

year. One might wonder how an entity of the latter date would

survive

at all. Does anyone have any more specific data for the

founding

of

the TS? It seems likely that there would be an official chart

for

the

founding, considering what the organization is.
Adelasie

==================================================

On 18 Feb 2006 at 13:19, Vladimir wrote:

Saturday, February 18, 2006, 5:46:41 AM, adelasie wrote:

Does Cranston give a time for the September date?

No. Actually the date might be considered even Sep.7, because

then

...Madame Blavatsky's sprightly evening chatter and her

reported

magical feats continued to draw groups of intelligent

people

to

her

rooms. Among those thus attracted was Mr. George H. Felt, who

had

made

some careful studies in phases of Egyptology. He was asked to

lecture

on these subjects and on the 7th of September, 1875, a score

of

people

had gathered in H.P.B.'s parlors to hear his address

on "The

Lost

Canon of Proportion of the Egyptians."
Dr. Seth Pancoast, a most
erudite Kabbalist was present, and after the lecture he

led

the

discussion to the subject of the occult powers of the

ancient

magicians. Mr. Felt said he had proven those powers and had

with

them

evoked elemental creatures and "hundreds of shadowy

forms."

As

the

tense debate proceeded, acting on an impulse,
Col. Olcott wrote on a
scrap of paper, which he passed over to Madame Blavatsky

through

the

hands of Mr. W. Q. Judge, the following: "Would it not be a

good

thing

to form a Society for this kind of study?" She read it and

indicated

assent.

http://www.blavatskycardiff.care4free.net/The%20Theosophical%

20Society

%20gets%20off%20the%20Ground.htm

But the Meeting Minutes containing the proposal is dated
Sep.8,1975 –

a hand-written page is reproduced in the book.

Vladimir

=====================================

see Blavatsky: COLLECTED WORKS Vol. 1

==================================

-----Original Message-----
From: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com [mailto:theos-

talk@yahoogroups.com] On

Behalf Of adelasie
Sent: Friday, February 17, 2006 6:47 PM
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: Theos-World TS natal chart and its implications

Hi Vladimir,

Does Cranston give a time for the September date?

Adelasie

On 17 Feb 2006 at 21:35, Vladimir wrote:

Friday, February 17, 2006, 5:16:17 PM, kpauljohnson wrote:

Here are a couple of post from a dozen years ago,

discussing

the

November 17th chart for the TS:

Sorry, didn't look at the chart, just want to make a

side

remark:

according to Cranston's book on HPB's life, the TS

was

actually

organized Sep.8,1875, whereas on Nov.17th Olcott gave his

inaugural

speech.

Would you please remake the chart for this date and

produce new

implications? :)

Best regards,
Vladimir

=================================================

LEGAL STATUS OF THE THEOSOPHICAL SOCIETY
Key. p. 309-10

THE LEGAL STATUS OF THE THEOSOPHICAL SOCIETY.
The following Official Report, on which was granted a Decree

of

In

to the

St. Louis Theosophical Society, is art important document, as

putting on

record the view taken of the Theosophical Society—after a

careful

examination of witnesses on oath—by an American Court of Law.

First—The petitioner is not a religious body, I report this

negative finding

for the reason that the word "Theosophical" contained in

petitioners' name

conveys a possible religious implication.
The statutory phrase "society formed for religious purposes"

applies, I

suppose, only to an organization formed in part for worship,

worship being

an individual act involving adoration and perhaps emotional

power,

both

being of necessity individual acts, or else to an organization

formed for a

propagation of a religious faith.
Merely to teach a religion as one may teach algebra, is not, I

think, a

religions work, as the word "religious" is used in the Statute

and

the

Constitution. A man may occupy a collegiate chair of Professor

of

Religions

and as such teach the tenets of many religions. These

different

religions

being variant and antagonistic, the Professor could not by any

possibility

worship under all. Nay, he might even be irreligious. Hence,

merely teaching

religions is not a religions work in the statutory sense.
It will be noted that in art. 2 of this society's

constitution,

the word

religion is used in the plural. To teach religions is

educational,

not

religious. "To promote the study of religions" is in part to

promote the

study of the history of man. I add the subordinate finding

that

the society

has no religious creed and practices no worship.
Second—The petitioner proposes to promote the study of

literature

and

sciences. These objects are expressly within the terms of the

Statute.

Third—Cognate with the last object is that of

investigating "unexplained

laws of nature and psychical powers latent in man." These two

phrases, taken

in their apparent meaning, are unobjectionable. But there is

reason to

believe that they form a meaning other than the apparent one.
The court will take notice of the commonly accepted meaning of

the

word

"Theosophy." Though I am ignorant of Theosophy, I think it is

supposed to

include among other things manifestations and phenomena,

physical

and

psychical, that are violative of the laws now known by

physicists

and

metaphysicians, and perhaps not explained or claimed to be

explained or

understood even by Theosophists themselves.
In this group may be included Spiritualism, mesmerism,

clairvoyance,

mind-healing, mind-reading, and the like. I took testimony on

this

question,

and found that while a belief in any one of these sorts of

manifestations

and phenomena is not required, while each member of the

society

is

at

liberty to hold his own opinion, yet such questions form

topics

of

inquiry

and discussion, and the members as a mass are probably

believers

individually in phenomena that are abnormal and in powers that

are

superhuman as far as science now knows.
It is undoubtedly the right of any citizen to hold whatever

opinions he

pleases on these subjects, and to endeavour at his pleasure to

investigate

the unexplained and to display the latent.
But the question here is: Shall the Court grant a franchise in

aid

of such

endeavour?
Voodooism is a word applied to the practices of guileful men

among

the

ignorant and superstitious who inflict impostures upon

guileless

men among

the ignorant and superstitious. No Court would grant a

franchise

in

furtherance of such practices.
The Court then will stop to inquire into the practices and

perhaps

the

reputableness of the enterprise which seeks judicial aid. I am

not

meaning

to make a comparison between voodooism and this group of

phenomena

which for

convenience (though I know not whether accurately) I will call

occultism. I

only take voodooism as a strong case to show the Court ought

to

inquire.

If we now inquire into occultism we shall find that it has

been

occasionally

used, as is reported, for the purposes of imposture. But this

goes

for

nothing against its essential character. Always and everywhere

bad

men will

make a bad use of anything for selfish ends.
The object of this society, whether attainable or not, is

undeniably

laudable, assuming that there are physical and psychical

phenomena

unexplained, and that Theosophy seeks to explain them.

Assuming

that there

are human powers yet latent, it seeks to discover them. It may

be

that

absurdities and impostures are in fact incident to the nascent

stage of its

development.
As to an understanding like that of occultism, which asserts

powers commonly

thought superhuman, and phenomena commonly thought

supernatural,

it seemed

to me that the Court, though not assuming to determine

judicially

the

question of their verity, would, before granting to occultism

a

franchise,

inquire whether at least it had gained the position of being

reputable or

whether its adherents were merely men of narrow intelligence,

mean

intellect, and omnivorous credulity.
I accordingly took testimony on that point, and find that a

number

of

gentlemen in different countries of Europe, and also in this

country,

eminent in science, are believers in occultism. Sir Edward

Bulwer

Lytton, a

writer of large and varied learning, and of solid intellect,

is

asserted to

have been an occultist, an assertion countenanced by at least

two

of his

books.
The late President Wayland, of Brown University, writing of

abnormal mental

operations as shown in clairvoyance, says: "The subject seems

to

me well

worthy of the most searching and candid examination. It is by

no

means

deserving of ridicule, but demands the attention of the most

philosophical

inquiry."
Sir William Hamilton, probably the most acute and, undeniably,

the

most

learned of English metaphysicians that ever lived, said at

least

thirty

years ago: "However astonishing, it is now proved beyond all

rational doubt

that in certain abnormal states of the nervous organism

perceptions are

possible through other than the ordinary channels of the

senses."

By such testimony Theosophy is at least placed on the footing

of

respectability. Whether by further labour it can make partial

truths

complete truths, whether it can eliminate extravagances and

purge

itself of

impurities, if there are any, are probably questions upon

which

the Court

will not feel called upon to pass.
I perceive no other feature of the petitioners' constitution

that

is

obnoxious to legal objection, and accordingly I have the

honour

to

report

that I show no cause why the prayer of the petitioners should

not

be

granted.
AUGUST W. ALEXANDER,
Amicus Curæ.

===============================================================

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