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Daniel, Dave and Besant's Adepthood

Feb 25, 2006 06:04 AM
by carlosaveline cardoso aveline


Thank you very much for your stimulating posting.

I see there seems to be an inner identity between your views and the views of other persons with the same initial letter in their names: David (Green) and Daniel (Caldwell). By some sort of coincidence, you came in the debate immediately after Daniel's "disappearance". Friends in need, friends indeed? I respect that. There is something sacred about friendship.

Perhaps you can convince Daniel Caldwell, or David Green, to explain whether David Green was, or not, invented as a false person by Daniel Caldwell.

As you know, truthfulness is really important, isn't it? I will rely on you in that. Paul Johnson's texts on Daniel's possible "secret agent work" to cause harm to theosophical groups remain unanswered and unchallenged so far, which is not good for Daniel. He should clarify facts out of respect for all of us, here at Theos-Talk.

Let's see now the connection between Annie Besant's "Adepthood" and Arundale's, and
Wedgwood's, and Leadbeater's.

Well, Mary Lutyens (a historian, not a pseudonym) is the source of that information and her books were not contradicted by leaders or thinkers/historians at Adyar.

It was Mary Lutiens who narrated the episode. Not me.

Annie Besant, in August 1925, humbly announced she had attained the FIFTH GREAT
INITIATION and included several others in the annoncement, including Arundale, Leadbeater and Wedgwood.

Crazy years those were, in which a few "initiates" went mad soon after attaining Adepthood.

Your commentaries?

Dear Dave, I hope you help us find the truth about the history of the theosophical moment,
so that we can move on and far beyond all this network of lies and illusions. I am sure you can help us in that. You see, it's never late. If you are a friend of Mr. John Algeo's, why not telling him he is still in time to change for the better?

Law of Karma is on the side of Truth Eternal! And there is nothing outside Karma Law.

Peace to all beings,

Best & fraternal regards, Carlos.

From: "soulsurvivor7771" <>
Subject: Theos-World Re: The Origin of Annie Besant's Adepthood
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 2006 15:54:33 -0000

Senor Carlos is at it again. This time he is trying to discredit CWL
by insinuating that CWL had something to do with Annie
Besant's 'Adepthood' announcement - that CWL was really the 'Origin'.

In fact, Leadbeater had nothing to do with it at all. The Adepthood
story was concocted by George Arundell while Leadbeater was in
Australia. George may have thought it up himself or got it from this
Wedgwood person. In any case, Leadbeater did not believe the story.
When Krishnamurthi questioned him about it, Leadbeater said (in so
many words) that Krishnamurthi was the only Arhat he was aware of
(that Krishnamurthi was indeed an Arhat has been confirmed by others).

To suggest that CWL was somehow responsible for this sorry episode is
spreading lies about someone who has done a lot to advance the cause
of Theosophy albeit by unconventional means. Mr. Carlos needs to read
his sources more carefully and stop making connections (between
Leadbeater and Arundell's Adepthood) that don't exist.



(I had better get out of here quick, Mr Psionics is coming after me :-

--- In, "carlosaveline cardoso aveline"
<carlosaveline@...> wrote:
> below, a letter to a fellow truth-seeker whow wrote to me
> about the significant number of controversies in the Theosophical
> Carlos.
> ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
> Dear  Friend,
> Brotherly friendship and understanding need freedom and diversity.
> It is important that you read Letter 120, Mahatma Letters,
> Edition, on the London Lodge Crisis. (I do not remember the Letter
number in
> non-cronological editions).
> It was written by a Mahatma after consulting with his own Master
> theosophical controversies.  The essence of the Letter  is that,
> to the Masters,  the contrast of views and opinions,
> once they are sincere, must be freely exercized and even preserved
> hypocritical make-belief and outer harmony.
> It coincides with a famous poem written by English poet Alexander
> which says (and I quote the idea, no the words themselves):
> "Every disharmony is a harmony that you cannot understand yet".
> So true harmony will never emerge from repressing diversity and
> contrast in nature.
> Thought monoculture is as disastrous as agricultural monoculture.
> Thought diversity in the mind world is as important as biodiversity
> natural environment.
> The great treason, conscious or unconscious, promoted by CWL and A.
> against the
> HPB Mission (a Mission, by the way,  which is NOT limited to the
> century) was to create rituals as a way of establishing an
uniformity of
> thought under their own popish control.
> Now, there is a difference between contrast, frankness, dversity,
> hatred, enmity and the like.
> It is by puting on the table and freely examining the failures of
> movement as a whole (and
> occultly Adyar is NOT separated from the rest of the movement),
that we will
> gradually eliminate all bitter feelings among us.
> I do not have access to Internet from my Library, but I can tell
> you the number of the Letter 120 in the other editions of the
> Letters. Tell me if you want that.
> And, by the way, if you study the M.  Letters you will see that
> writings have nothing to see
> with the Mahatmas' teachings.
> AND  --- do you happen to know that CWL was never admitted to the
> School founded by H.P.B.?
> He received a couple of letters from the Mahatmas, yes, but soon he
was out
> of focus. He never was admitted to the HPB's inner school.
Instead, he was
> busy having mediumnistic "chats" with imaginary Masters  in
the 'inner
> circle' of Mr. A. P. Sinnett, in London.  A. Besant also took part,
> right after HPB's death.  (See Mr. A.P. Sinnett Memoirs.)  And soon
> nonsense began.
> Then CWL became the source of Mrs. A.Besant "contact" with her own
> Masters.
> It was in this way that Besant finnally anounced, in 1925  that she
> attained Adepthood, as
> I have documented here while illustrating the life of Mr. James
> the founder of the Liberal Catholic Church and another
Adyar "Adept" in
> 1925.   The inquestionable source is Mary Lutyens, J.
> biographer.
> It's History.  These are documented facts. As a source, A.P.
Sinnett was
> never questioned.
> He was international vice-president under Annie Besant, and close
> with CWL and her until he died.
> I have all the data and can bring them all here to you.  I believe
it is
> indeed important that we
> understand the origin of all the "clairvoyant" fancies in order to
> understand them and then to GET RID OF THEM.
> I hope you have the patience to stand the "ugly truths" we must
> examine and learn from, in order to go ahead to the next step.
> Best regards,  Carlos Cardoso Aveline
> _________________________________________________________________
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