Theos-Talk Archives (March 2002 Message tt00535)

Jerry: "I find the reincarnational claims of Thesophical 
fundamentalism, or perhaps I should say exoteric Theosophy, to be 
scary. It is exactly the same theory that
was adopted in India and which has led to the backwardness of that 
country,according to most anthropologists. If the US adopted that 
theory, the US would soon find itself a backward country as well. 
Fortunately most people see through it, and shy away from Theosophy 
as a result."

Bri.: Nevertheless rational argumentation is often used to support 
reincar­nationist doctrines. For example Ian Stevenson's stud­ies that 
base their claim on a combination between faith and pseudo-science. 

Within the Theosophical (and also other esoteric) litera­ture on 
reincarnation, one finds a trust in revealed information, in the 
wisdom of authorities. Believers can rely on the claims found in 
dozens of texts received on authority of the Masters, or channeled 
texts in which reincarnation is taken for granted. Regardless of 
which entities are said to be the source of revealed wisdom, 
Mahatmas, archangels, Egyptian priests, ascended Masters, dolphins or 
extraterrestrial beings from the Pleiades-they all seem to have 
adopted turn-of-the century theosophical doctrines of the steady 
progress of the soul through successive lives.

I have already pointed out that if used in a context of self 
discovery or assisting others in the process of self-discovery, many 
of the underlying techniques that are often based on creative 
visualisation can of course also be used in a beneficial way.

Nineteenth century belief in reincarnation generally rested on clas­
sical religious motifs: the belief in messages revealed from suprahu­
man sources. Knowledge of the afterlife state was imparted to 
prophetic figures, to mesmerist and spiritist mediums, or to 
religious virtuosi such as Blavatsky. The details of reincarnation 
were pre­sented in abstract myths or through the imaginary lives of 
significant individuals. With time, both the doctrines and their 
legitimizing strate­gies have changed. Tradition has gained 
considerable weight in texts that discuss reincarnation. 

As long as one is only aware of a single tradition, its doctrines and 
rituals may seem self-evident. Once one gets to know several 
conflicting stories, one's own set of beliefs risks being demoted to 
the status of one option among many. If one becomes aware of the fact 
that modern reincarnation belief is largely the product of a 
nineteenth century French author of schoolbooks, this knowledge might 
contribute to fostering a hermencutic of sus­picion. Universalism 
becomes an effective remedy against doubt. If in the ultimate 
analysis, all religions are merely variations of a philosophia 
perennis, the differences between Hindu, Christian or Spiritist 
beliefs are simply details. The question whether present-day rein­
carnation beliefs, as set out in the latest texts, were actually 
created (or discovered) by Blavatsky or some name­less Oriental sage 
becomes a matter of no great concern.

The doctrine of reincarnation has, at least overtly, also become 
democratized. The believer does not need to rely on blind faith 
alone. There are supposedly rational reasons for accepting reincar­
nation. For those who wish to take the next step in their interest in 
the afterlife, past life experiences are a "proof" freely available 
to anybody. The therapeutic practices that have sprung from past life 
beliefs are widespread today; those interested in investigating pur­
ported past life memories can do so with little practical difficulty. 
Rationalists may find it obvious that experiences are ambiguous and 
can sometimes even be directly misleading. For large segments of the 
cultic milieu, it seems equally obvious that personal experiences are 
faithful maps of underlying reality. Herein lies a deep contra­diction 
within Theosophical religiosity. On the outside its texts seem to 
invoke a democratic ideal, according to which nothing needs to be 
taken on faith, and which insists that the readers' spiritual 
experiences are by far more important than any opinions that the 
author might entertain. These experiences, however, are often molded 
by the most influential spokesperson ('s) of the movement. 

=
Bri.
--- In theos-talk@y..., "bri_mue" <bri_mue@y...> wrote:
> Jerry: "I wrote a short article on the rising population rate vs 
> reincarnation some years ago. Needless to say, it was met with total 
> silence, just as your argument here will be. There simply is no way
> to explain it and still keep the Theosophical reincarnation scheme as 
> outlined in the SD. Your argument, and mine also, causes cognitive 
> dissonance, and will simply be ignored. The Buddhist scheme allows
> for the crossing over of animals, and we know that the animal 
population
> is decreasing, which would explain the increasing human population. 
But 
> Theosophy maintains that a "door" was shut some milion years ago 
and 
> animals cannot be human nor can humans come back as animals, and 
> so Theosophy has a problem on its hands today".
> 
> Looking at the devellopment of these TS beliefs of Dallas, 
> the reiricarnationists of the 1850s to 1880s relied heavily on the 
> strategy of pointing to the existence of revealed teachings. Kardec 
> and Caithness had their spirit sources; Kingsford's book claimed to 
> be the result of divine revelation; Blavatsky relied on the wisdom 
> of "the Masters."
> 
> Blavatsky's reincarnation doc­trine builds on elements deriving
> from several different sources. Due to the inherent difficulties in 
> harmonizing historically distinct traditions, her reincarnation 
> doctrine is not free from contradictions. At times, she seems to draw 
> on the purported roots of the "ancient wis­dom religion" in a 
> generalized Buddhism. Thus, Blavatsky can refer to "the great truth 
> that reincarnation is to be dreaded, as existence in this world only 
> entails upon man suffering, misery and pain"." Nevertheless, 
> following a view that could be either Hindu or Platonic, but 
> certainly not Buddhist in any orthodox sense, she claims that there 
> is a unique individuality that incarnates again and again. In a 
> reminiscence of an earlier Western esoteric tradition, the
> individ­ual is said to reincarnate after a stay in the astral plane .4' 
> Another echo of the frequent esoteric preoccupation with the number 
> seven, the individual is said to be composed of an aggregate of seven
> entities that part ways at physical death." A quote such as the
> following is closer to a Lurianic kabbalistic view than to the "Esoteric =

> Buddhism" that Sinnett wrote of:
> 
> The Monad emerges from its state of spiritual and intellectual
> unconsciousness; and [ ... ] gets directly into the plane of Mentality. 
> But there is no place in the whole universe with a wider margin, or a 
> wider field of action in its almost endless gradations of perceptive 
> and apper­ceptive qualities, than this plane, which has in its
> turn an appropri­ate smaller plane for every "form", from 
the "mineral"
> monad up to the time when that monad blossoms forth by evolution 
into 
> the 
> DIVINE moNAD. But all the time it is still one and the same Monad, 
> differing only in its incarnations, throughout its ever succeeding 
> cycles of partial or total obscuration of spirit, or the partial
> or total obscuration of matter-two polar antitheses-as it ascends into 
> the realms of mental spirituality, or descends into the depths of 
> materiality." (SD)
> 
> But this dualism at best and therefore materialism, and apart that 
> notting of it is true, it is not even spiritual.
>  
> =
=
> Bri.
> 
> There are several ways in which consciousness might, arguably, be 
> > involved in the ganzfeld, but there appears to be no direct
> evidence 
> > that it is. For example, even in a very successful experiment the 
> > hits are mixed with many misses and the subjects themselves 
cannot 
> > say which is which (if they could the successful trials could be 
> > separated out and even better results obtained). In other words,
> the 
> > subject is unaware of the ESP even when it is occurring.
> > 
> > Our ordinary view of ourselves, as conscious, active agents 
> experiencing 
> > a real external world, is wrong. In other words we live in the
> illusion 
> > that we are a separate self. In mystical experiences this separate
> self 
> > dissolves and the world is experienced as one - actions happen but 
> > there is no separate actor who acts. Long practice at meditation or 
> > mindfulness can also dispel the illusion. Now science seems to be 
> > coming to the same conclusion - that the idea of a separate
> conscious 
> > self is false.
> > 
> > Some old fashioned Parapsychologists however are still going the 
> other 
> > way, and still are trying to prove that consciousness really does
> have 
> > power that our minds can reach out and "do" things. In this sense
> it is 
> > deeply dualist, and as I called, materialistic, even while making 
> > reference to interconnectedness.
> > 
> > Theosophical version about what happens "between death and re-
> birth" 
> > the never dying "monad" and so on, this is a fallacy. Even 
> > many "spiritual people say that including in fact new devellopments
> > inmodern science , yet is moving further and further away from the 
> > outdated 19th century "Theosophy" version, that is bassicly
> dualistic
> > and concealed materialism.
> > 
> > In fact it was precisely becouse of the Theosophical ideas
> regarding 
> > living men project their doubles that the S.P.R. undertook the
> study 
> > of the T.S. at all !
> > 
> > In the First Report of the Committee of the Society for Psychical 
> > Research on Phenomena in Connection with the TS, it states:
> > "if-real evidence can be adduced for a separability of principles
> in 
> > living men,-for voluntary projection of the double, or
> manifestation 
> > of aspects of the same identity in discrete places at the same 
> > moment,-then though the superstructure of occult doctrine will
> remain 
> > unproved, there will be a sufficient presumption of the existence
> of 
> > real psychical knowledge in the East (and they already practiced it 
> > based on Emma Brittens info in New York !) to make it our duty to 
> > track out such knowledge through every accessible avenue with 
> > pertinacious care."
> > 
> > In the Theosophist in Dec. 1883, it is says with a note by
> Blavatsky 
> > that " Damodar was a chela of but four years standing and that 
> > whenever the phenomenon of the separation of the astral from the 
> > physical body takes place, we are told,he falls invariable asleep
> or 
> > into a trance before."
> > 
> > In the "First Report" of the SPR above it also states
> > however that; 
> > the evidence available rendered it impossible to avoid one or the 
> > other of two alternative conclusions: "Either that some of the 
> > phenomea recorded are genuine , or that other persons of good 
> > standing in society , and with charcters to lose, have taken part
> in 
> > deliberate imposture."
> > In the event , such gentlemen were cleared from charges of 
> dishonesty 
> > in the SPR report, but only at the expense of their dignity. 
> > According to Hodgson, the theosophical witnesses were "as a
> > whole excessively credulous, excessively deficient in the powers of 
> > common observation; and to many of them prone to supplement 
that 
> > deficiency by culpable exaggeration"
> > 
> > The phenomenon of projection was a common explanation also of 
> many 
> > of the appearances of the Brothers/Masters in New York, and of 
> > Blavatsky's "double" counsciousness as their agent.
> > J.P. Deveney, along with the other books and authors I have
> reffered 
> > to, describes in "Astral Projection or Liberating of the Double
> > and the work of the early Theosophical Society"(1997)
> > And wrote: "But the ability to project the astral double, and 
> > act through it at a distance was not reserved to the Brothers
> alone, 
> > and was held up to the members as the `verry last and highest
> > possible achievement of magic,'a goal actively to be pursued and
> > achieved."
> > 
> > In her letters to Elliot Coues Blavatsky wrote; "My dear
> > nocturnal visitor, You are very clever in paying visits & in
> feeling 
> > my presence in your bones"
> > "Let us go on with our attempts to communicate & see each other 
> > astrally."
> > 
> > 
> > Bilocations is a myth, but out-of-body experiences or OBE's are
> > "real" and there not the slightest reason why a person who rejects
> > the theory of the astral body should deny their reality. And the
> same 
> > counts for "remote" viewing. And just also visualisations people
> make
> > in past life theraphy about themselves are "real" in the symbolic
> sense
> > of the word, they have also real "meaning" but don't proof "past
> lives"
> > as such.
> > 
> > However it is not "something" going "out there," and if Daniel 
> > understood something about the Ganzfeld theorie in spite that he
> > name drops that term, he would understand the above, but 
obviously 
> he 
> > doesn't.
> > Even the Mahatma letters played with notions of their own 
> > fictitiousness, calling attention to the Mahatma's status as 
> > inventive inventions: having been "'invented' ourselves," the
> Masters 
> > noted, they "repay the inventors by inventing" increasingly 
> > complicated "imaginary" doctrines as a way of avoiding accusations
> of 
> > inconsistency or internal contradiction in their teachings.(KH to 
> > Sinnet , letter No.24B, in "Mahatma Letters".)
> > 
> > Theosophical "principles", wich could be printed, published, 
> > annotated , and debated (including "Atma and 
> Parabrahman"),replaced 
> > the occult and became the public emphasis of the society. The 
> > formation of the Blavatsky Lodge in 1887 was partly the result of 
> > this emphasis on propaganda and theosophical principles. According 
> to 
> > Bertram Keightley, one of its founding members, the Blavatsky 
Lodge 
> > was intended to rescue the TA from the "diletante class or high 
> > society men", Keightley argued, was not for the "kid gloves and 
> > swallow-tail coats," but for earnest and dedicated students of 
> > spiritual mysteries. (Keighley, "The Adyar Convention Lectures: 
> > Theosophy in the West", The Theosophist .,July 1891,585.) 
> > 
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/theos-talk/message/6474
> > 
> >  
> Bri.