Theos-Talk Archives (December 2001 Message tt00303)

Daniel;"To quote simply what Deveney or Mathiesen wrote is not citing 
the actual original sources." 

I reffered to much more then just "Deveney or Mathiesen"in my 
previous mails, and also I did a lot of typing already, responding to 
already your previous request . But oke I will do so if you at least 
first list yourself all the sources from Deveney's (only a smal) 
booklet "Astral Projection and the TS". All these sources are verry 
much connected to the subjects I covered in my series of mails on 
the early TS,and give us your comment in each case. 

I recommend the books I so far mentioned also to all others on the 
list (to obtain) for a more in depth history of the TS and at the 
same time much better researched then the Thesosophical propaganda 
material of the time of Annie Besant or the 1920-30's that 
the "compiler" (wonder who is this ) and others on the list have 
been trying to indoctrinate people with for the last 70-80 years.
Also Daniel it doesn't need any of the other authors for Steve's 
observation to be valid or not. 

Wouldn't you say now that indeed Olcott's description probably 
indicates a drug influence ? Or if not, what proof can you cite that 
it isn't ?
In the opinion of others on this list it is, as Steve said, we see 
evidence of herbs burning, herbs contained within a lacquered case 
which was held to Olcott's nose, visual hallucinations, tactile
hallucinations (the room was wet), profuse sweating,time distortion, 
loss of consciousness, cognitive impairment, and stupefaction. Can 
any reasonable person read this story and believe that there were no
botanical products involved in this wonder? 
Especially interesting is that these drugs are the means of "the 
production of flowers as the adepts do it." That clearly indicates 
that they used these substances to produce visual hallucinations and
presumably insights.

Olcott described in his own words; "We took cigars. ... I was 
stupefied. ... They sat
there and quietly smoked their cigars. ... I just sat
and looked at them in a sort of stupid daze. They
seemed to enjoy my surprise. ... Then the elder man
took out of his pocket a painted lacquered case. ...
The box exhaled a strong spicy aromatic odor much like
sandal wood but still not just that. Whatever I
wished to see, he said I need simply think of. ...
When I seemed to be growing inquisitive, some power
prevented my seeing anything. ... I stood transfixed
looking from one to another in dumb amazement. ...
Madam said, ... 'What's the matter? You must be
crazy.' ... Madam said they had been with her for more
than an hour. ... In a half hour from the time the two
men left, there was not a drop of moisture in the room
nor a shade of dampness to indicate that there had
been a shower."

Therefore Daniel , before we move on to discussing other authors and 
their sources, of wich Steve mentions NONE in the above , can we 
agree now that the above descripton of Olcott contains indications 
of drug influence ? 


Brigitte